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The OTHER government body that likes to tear families apart....
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Old 07-03-2018, 04:30 AM
HEMI6point1 HEMI6point1 is offline
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Default The OTHER government body that likes to tear families apart....

No, I'm not talking about ICE. This is not an immigration thread.

I am talking about Child Protective Services aka CPS aka Dept of Children and Families in some states.

For some reason, CPS is the only government entity that late-night comedians and investigative journalists are afraid of touching. It could be that people who do talk wind up dead.

For people who don't live in the US, CPS is the government entity that is responsible for taking kids away and putting them into foster care if they suspect abuse of any kind. It's important to note that there is no oversight, they pretty much answer to no one.

Here's the problem: A law was passed in 1997 called the "adoption and safe families act." It, among other things, gives bonuses to the CPS branch of a given state when a child it places into foster care gets adopted out. As you may expect, giving an agency like this financial incentive is a really bad idea.

You may hear of a child in a shitty situation falling through the cracks and thinking, "Why didn't social services step in?" It's because the child didn't look "adoptable." Which means no bonus if the child languishes in foster care and isn't adopted out.

Meanwhile, here are some stories of CPS making up bullshit claims to kidnap kids to sell them into foster care with the hopes of getting them adopted out:

Some I don't have links for, sorry about that:

http://medicalkidnap.com/2018/04/01/...ccused-mother/

http://medicalkidnap.com/2018/06/26/...rental-rights/

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.033643b8bd41

Remember the parents from Maryland who figured their neighborhood was safe enough to let their kids walk home from school alone? They called it "free range parenting." CPS tried to charge them with child neglect so they can snatch their kids.

https://www.offthegridnews.com/curre...y-was-camping/

http://medicalkidnap.com/2018/05/31/...kidnap-babies/

http://medicalkidnap.com/2018/05/20/...after-6-years/

http://www.freerangekids.com/intervi...alone-in-yard/

Many years ago on a talk show I watched, they had a couple who had a CPS scare when their son choked on a french fry during dinner. The kid lived, thankfully, but CPS accused them the parents of intentionally choking him in retaliation for getting a bad report card.

I believe it was in one of the Carolinas, but many years ago a woman's young daughter was acting like a brat in the supermarket so once they got back to the car the woman spanked her daughter once. ONCE. One of those anti-spanking crusader morons saw it and called the cops. CPS snatched the girl and the mother was arrested for child abuse. It took months to get her kid back and clear her name.

----

You wonder why parents nowadays are afraid to let their kids do anything like say ride a bike or play on a swing set as they might get hurt? It's because if the kid gets hurt, and the kid goes to a hospital, the doctors have to check if the injuries are from abuse. All it takes is for a kid to look "adoptable" and before you know it CPS is accusing the parents of abuse so they can kidnap their child.

Now you may be doing research and reading from the CPS workers themselves insisting that they don't get bonuses. Of course they are going to say that. It's like the cops who insist that ticket quotas don't exist when we all know they do.

BTW, for people that scream "but they need to use due process!" Um.... not CPS. I should know as a family friend who's 6 year old daughter said some things at school that were misunderstood and the school called CPS who took her away to their branch and started the process to put her into foster care without ever getting the permission from a judge or anything. The poor mother was waiting for the bus to drop her off from school and it never came. Hours later CPS called and literally said, "We have your daughter and she is being booked into foster care." Took 6 months to get her daughter back.

One final note: 2nd amendment people say it's to defend against government tyranny. A CPS worker taking someone's child due to a BS accusation is government tyranny. Sounds like a good time as ever to put the 2nd amendment to good use....
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Old 07-03-2018, 08:44 PM
Daskinor Daskinor is online now
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Alright this all seems like a stretch to be honest.


We can separate this into two chunks.

A-The adoption racket

B-Overzealous CPA actions

the causation being that A results in B.


First off you link to a blog stating that Nancy Schaefer was murdered to keep this secret. This murder tends to feed into a conspiracy about how various CPS agencies in different states, with different operational structures all conspire to collect children from families to adopt out for federal dollars. The common thread is that she was killed for This report.

you link this article http://www.foxnews.com/story/2002/02...alousness.html

It was written over 16 years ago. And touches on the Pay for adoption scheme as well.

It basically boils down to the state makes money from the federal government per each kid taken then adopted. And they go for nice children they can easily and quickly adopt out.

So the problem with this theory is such.

1. They need to be in the system for 22 months, as per the 1997 law
2. Of the 22 months, at least 15 of them need to be in foster care
3. The law makes no differentiation between who gets the child. They can be adopted by a family member. They can be placed with a family member then be adopted by the family member.
4. IT COSTS MORE MONEY TO TAKE AND ADOPT THAT CHILD OUT THEN THEY GET BACK. http://www.adoptioncouncil.org/image...OCATE_NO35.pdf That report is from 2011. The amount has gone up in the last 7 years while the federal money has not.

The conspiracy theory probably started with Nev Moore, founder of the Massachusetts-based Justice For Families. The TL;DR of her story is, she pushed her child hard enough during a fight (she was 7 at the time) to cause enough injuries that CPS was brought in. And the daughter was removed, she reportedly had a rough time in foster care. Her response to the incident was that she did nothing wrong, the system was trying to steal her child for a reason. From there This Article probably turned the idea into pure Conspiracy Theory fuel. I find it is sourced by allot when researched the theory as a whole.

As for these stories. While I believe CPS does take actions that are unneeded and overreact. Or completely drop the ball. These stories are always one sided, Juvenal records, court documents are almost universally sealed (particulars dependent on the state of course.) So you almost always hear one side of the story. Nancy Schaefer's "report", the thing she was supposedly killed over. Only spent one paragraph on the taking children from money angle. The rest was on this horror story she was told, THAT WAS NEVER SUBSTANTIATED IN HER REPORT!

This is a conspiracy theory. For it to be real requires way to much creative accounting, to where the state makes a profit. Then that profit is filtered down to the individual CPS agent to take the child. The Judges to revoke parental rights. And a different subset of CPS to adopt them out. Comptrollers to submit the paperwork to the government to be paid by the government at some point (the money can take years to get.) And state executives to use the money for something. And to top it all of, while the numbers of children taken by CPS agencies have gone up over the last 20 years. They have stayed close to the percentage per capita.

To many people, to many moving parts, over a large geographical region. To difficult to keep under wraps for this long. It's a simple solution, for a much harder problem. Where to draw the line for abuse, and deciding if taking the child will cause more damage then solve.
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Old 07-04-2018, 04:36 AM
HEMI6point1 HEMI6point1 is offline
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Here's another CPS kidnapping story...

I am sorry for posting a Blaze article, but this was also on some other websites but none of them are "mainstream." Makes me wonder why. Just google "CPS takes child for parents refusing ADHD diagnosis."

Anyway, it's clear what happened. 7 year old was hyper, which they all are. School wanted him to be professionally diagnosed with ADHD so they they can have an excuse to drug him and make him a zombie to make their job easier. Parents were having none of that shit. So the school calls CPS on them.

https://www.theblaze.com/news/2017/0...adhd-diagnosis
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Old 07-08-2018, 05:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HEMI6point1 View Post

Anyway, it's clear what happened. 7 year old was hyper, which they all are. School wanted him to be professionally diagnosed with ADHD so they they can have an excuse to drug him and make him a zombie to make their job easier.
Quick note. The drugs that are supposedly turning those 7 years olds into Zombies are uppers. Meaning that any child who doesn't have ADHD will become even more hyper and out of control after taking them.

The only kids that slow down on uppers are those like me who legit had ADHD. For some reason our chemical reactions are reversed. Things like caffeine in soda would put me to sleep. Where one of my siblings would get a jolt of energy from it I would get sluggish and tired.

My mom once gave me a soda so I could stay up late and finish my homework and instead it knocked me out.

Most of the "Oh I have ADHD too" kids I met growing up that didn't actually have it were pushed into that by their parents not the school.

Usually after the school did the polite version of "Your kid's an asshole" the parent would then be all "oh no really he's got this medical problem that allows him to be an asshole to his classmates and you so shut up"

When Autism started getting more media attention suddenly parents were saying "Oh my kid has Asberger's or Autism that's why they are a little shit and not the fact I raise them to be entitled"

Honestly School's rarely if ever go whipping out attempted medical diagnoses as

1) they have no say in the child being medicated


2) They couldn't say anything about the child's behavior then because then it would be discrimination.

What makes teachers jobs easier is kids who want to learn. This requires parents who aren't ignorant who don't tell their kids lies like "You will never use (insert subject they use every day including algebra which they forget is where they learned the skills they use)"

My generation grew up and had kids passing on the "when are we ever going to use this" question I got sick of hearing growing up.

I wish there was more help for kids with real issues and that it was mandatory for schools to put the kids in that educational track. Imagine how bloody quickly those parents would stop claiming those diagnosis when their kids started getting treated like they were real.
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Old 07-09-2018, 07:32 PM
protege protege is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jackfaire View Post
My generation grew up and had kids passing on the "when are we ever going to use this" question I got sick of hearing growing up.
Unfortunately, there are a LOT of things that you're forced to learn...that you will never use. For example, when have I had to deal with Shakespeare's plays, Beowulf, or the various other "classics?" Yet, the school I went to, would spend a freaking month going over those things. Similar deal with some of the math classes. I can't remember the last time I've had to graph an equation...
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Old 07-27-2018, 03:37 AM
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Originally Posted by protege View Post
Unfortunately, there are a LOT of things that you're forced to learn...that you will never use. For example, when have I had to deal with Shakespeare's plays, Beowulf, or the various other "classics?" Yet, the school I went to, would spend a freaking month going over those things. Similar deal with some of the math classes. I can't remember the last time I've had to graph an equation...
Funny because I have used all of those. I still read and can comprehend even archaic English because of having to study those classics. I even can read and interpret legalese.

I can understand how to read a graph in an article using one to illustrate a point because I was taught how to make graphs.

I can understand the underlying philosophies of people's lives, fairly predict other people's actions/reactions and understand the world around me and how others see it even if I don't agree with what they see.
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Old 07-05-2018, 05:56 AM
Tanasi Tanasi is offline
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Working for CPS or whatever they're being called is really a thankless job. No matter what they do someone is going to be pissed off for reason or not. We had a few run ins with them concerning our youngest daughter. She's accident prone, gets hurt often and therefore winds up at the ER. The nurses and doctors see her medical records and makes calls to the LEOs who then call CPS. CPS and the LEOs investigate. The worst was when she was 16/17 and she had her wisdom teeth removed. She was put in the back seat of an SUV and buckled in. She was still on the loopy side. When nearing some train tracks she unbuckled herself, opened the door and fell out onto the rail-road tracks. She was all skinned up, hanks of hair was yanked from her head and she broke her arm (again.) We (her parents) weren't even there but that didn't stop CPS from threatening to take her away even with proof to show we weren't at fault. They backed off after we got some other LEOs involved.
On the other hand with our youngest son, CPS was great. They placed him with us at the request of his parents. While he isn't blood kin to us we made him part of our family and after his mother passed and with the blessing of his father we adopted him. CPS paved the way and made it very easy.
What it boils down to is that you can't paint the whole bunch with a broad brush, it's a hard and thankless job, it's a wonder anyone would do it.
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Old 07-08-2018, 12:30 AM
Daskinor Daskinor is online now
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Ok that blaze story is somewhat lacking. But if you read the details, the child said some very shocking things and has some major behavioral issues at school. The school is forced to respond to thoes things at face value.

The parents were dealing with the situation as "kids will be kids" and insulating that school is somehow targeting thier child.

The school is forced to respond to what the child has said at face value. Parents refuse to do anything instead blaming the school. Because the parents refuse to respond and deal with the situation. CPs is called in, and instead of complying with basic legal requirements they make things worse for themselves.

All of the ADHD references come from the parents. It's one of those situations were you need to apply occam's razor too.

Is the school conspiring with CPS to steal a child to put up for addoption.

Or is the school dealing with a child with major behavioral issues that parents are in denial about. When called out they fell back on a persecution complex.

Think about it this way, disturbed kid says disturbing things. Contacts parents about it, parents refuse to deal with the issue within satisfaction of the school adminstration. According to the article they said;

"The Maples refused to give any details into the family conversation with Camden, saying it was private family business."

School has a duty to report. Parents continue being dismissive and refusing any kind of third party diagnosis. Then things get taken to court.
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Old 07-10-2018, 05:40 AM
Tanasi Tanasi is offline
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A lot of things that I had to "learn" in school that I thought I would never need has come back many years later to prove beneficial. What I mean by beneficial is I knew the answers to many trivia questions, professionally very little has been useful.
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Old 07-27-2018, 01:47 AM
HEMI6point1 HEMI6point1 is offline
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Here is an update to a story on medical kidnap:

http://medicalkidnap.com/2018/07/19/...accine-injury/

Short version: 4-month girl old gets gardasil vaccine by mistake. Girl falls ill. Mother immediately seeks treatment. CPS swoops in and accuses the mother of having "Munchausen Syndrome by Proxy" and takes her daughter away.
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