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Why Marvel should never bring the X-Men into the MCU
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Old 10-04-2017, 02:32 PM
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Default Why Marvel should never bring the X-Men into the MCU

Honestly I don't think X-Men should have ever crossed over with other Marvel properties. I think the X-Men should be it's own Marvel Universe. Here's why. For most of the existence of Marvel most Super-heros In universe don't get the hate that Mutants do.

And this makes no sense. This would be like people hating Muslims but only if they are from certain countries.

The defining characteristic of a mutant is their powers.

So why would other powered humans who hide their identity behind masks not get the hate that Mutants who often don't wear masks get?

Thematically it doesn't actually make any sense. I mean after all couldn't you just claim to be some superhero then and boom no one hates you? Does the general public really know that Peter Parker was bitten by a radioactive spider rather than developing spider powers when he hit puberty?

No of course not.

If we brought mutants into the Marvel Cinematic Universe suddenly we would have to explain why this group of superheros is hated and the others aren't.

Not saying Fox should keep the rights, though they kind of should for the most part they do really well with the material. But I am saying if Marvel wants them back to add them to the Universe they would be shooting themselves in the foot.
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Old 10-05-2017, 02:16 PM
TheHuckster TheHuckster is offline
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I offer the counterpoint that doing so would introduce a narrative reflecting the hypocrisy that's often present in the general public.

There are some distinct differences between X-Men and MCU heroes, too:

1.) X-Men came from a different era. The first were born in 1950s and 60s when people were less tolerant of "differences" among people in society. Had Spiderman in the MCU been mutated in the 1960s, who knows how the public would have perceived him then versus now. Captain America is a notable exception, as he was commissioned by the military in WWII and soon after went into a deep freeze while the cold war was happening.

2.) The X-Men separated into two factions, and thus the public's perception is going to be a conflict of whether they are good or bad. Looking at what Magneto and Mystique have done, it's perfectly reasonable to have concerns about mutants in general. Especially in the Cold War-era where one would not only have to worry about nuclear war, but wars between people with superpowers. Thus curing mutants could be juxtaposed with nuclear disarmament.

3.) The MCU heroes are not without controversy and concern. Iron Man is perceived as a narcissist ass who is sometimes at odds with the government and other entities due to his ability to construct military-grade equipment without being contracted by the government. The Hulk is similarly considered high-risk, and there are undertones of people wishing he could be "cured" as well.
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Old 10-05-2017, 07:46 PM
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Let's not forget that a lot of people don't like a lot of the Avengers because of all the chaos and destruction they've caused.
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Old 10-06-2017, 10:37 AM
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I am not saying the other characters aren't without their controversy but that's exactly why it would be a problem.

We tend to forget as the readers that we have information and perspectives that the civilians of these comic book worlds don't have.

We are free to think it's ridiculous that no one knows Superman and Clark Kent are the same person because we know for a fact that he is and thus a pair of glasses coupled with an entirely different personality doesn't fool us.

We the readers always know when a character is a mutant or not. In the MCU characters inspire controversy and fear because of the damage they can cause. No one's hating on them for having powers. No one's talking about exterminating them or imprisoning them JUST for having powers.

Mutants meanwhile "Oh you hit puberty and it turns out you have powers but you literally have done nothing illegal with them? To jail with you!"

From a reader standpoint this usually made sense because we knew they were mutants while we knew The Fantastic Four weren't.

In the MCU none of the civilians that would suddenly be hating on Mutants for Having Powers would be so far out of left field it would be ridiculous.

They have no way of knowing which heroes are mutants and which aren't unless all humans are mutants whose mutant ability is knowing every hero's back story.

If they were going to bring in the X-Men and mutants in general they would need some establishing scenes to introduce the concept of humans hating on other humans with powers and the heroes with powers would have to get the same treatment from these groups as Mutants. Oh the US government is imprisoning mutants but somehow leaving superheroes alone?

No that doesn't make any sense unless they know every masked hero's origin.
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Old 10-08-2017, 06:17 PM
Ginger Tea Ginger Tea is offline
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Have you not been following Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D?

The inhumans (not the new TV show of the same name) are basically mutants, but they can't use the name due to Fox owning the name as part of the Xmen rights.

You have people in congress making or trying to make laws registering anyone affected by Terragenesis (spelling) a well funded 'vigilante' group that has attacked inhumans either members of shield or known by shield due to aforementioned registration laws.

And the What if HYDRA won alternate albeit virtual reality had inhumans as a feared round em up and kill em mentality.

Sure not everyone who watches MCU watches the spin offs, but all ABC and AFAIK Netflix Marvel shows are part of the MCU and reference events in the movies even if the movies themselves never bring them up.

Season 2 had the fall out of Thor 2, another had a character see Ultron before the movie hit.

Trust me, inhumans are feared in the greater MCU.
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Old 10-09-2017, 04:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ginger Tea View Post
Trust me, inhumans are feared in the greater MCU.
Which is my whole issue. It doesn't make sense to fear the InHumans but not Scarlet Witch.

And not because in the comics she is a mutant but because the powers they have is the whole reason they fear them.

No I haven't been watching Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. They kind of lost my interest.

But I don't think the Mutants in the comics, TV shows, or movies should co-exist in a world where other superheros are celebrated and loved.

Because they are always hated for their powers. Yes there are ones like Nightcrawler who get the standard "humans hate freaks" thing but most mutants people are terrified of what they can do.

But your normal civilian has no way of knowing that Thor isn't a Mutant. They should logically fear him if they fear mutants because he would be under the same umbrella.

It only makes sense because as the reader we know that Thor is a Norse god. We know for a fact that's his real origin.

To the average person it's more likely he's a mutant with a similar power set that took on the identity of him to seem more impressive.

Unless in that world Humans have an instinctual ability to sense mutants which they clearly don't then it makes no sense to hate and fear group A with powers and love and celebrate group B with powers.

When I first read Marvel as a kid and found out the Fantastic Four and the X-Men existed in the same world I got really confused because it didn't make sense to me. I think Mutants should have their own Earth where the only superheros are Mutants. You could even have the same villains like Galactus as he would exist in every timeline.

I love when Mutant stories stand on their own but the instant they're doing a story where they're being persecuted and they team up with someone the exact same public loves it's like "what cognitive disconnect exists in your mind where this makes sense"
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Last edited by jackfaire; 10-09-2017 at 04:10 AM.
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Old 10-09-2017, 08:50 AM
Ginger Tea Ginger Tea is offline
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TBH I never thought the movie hero's got their dicks sucked by the general populace, but the thing with superhero movies in general is that we never see the fall out of their cinematic escapades (though BvS did hint to that in clips I saw), but we got the fall out of the downfall of SHEILD and the rise of HYDRA in the show, to a movie goer, that must have all seemed wrapped up by the end credits. Cap won HYDRA lost, which it didn't, HYDRA continued to operate (almost) openly.

It took the best part of a season or more to resolve the fall out of Winter Soldier and even after resolving that arc, HYDRA never really went away.

Civil war showed that the public were not riding caped dick by the Sakovia accords and the fact that they only got away with what they did due to them being governed by SHIELD and if they were rouge (like inhumans (not the show of the same name) are) they are unregistered variables.

You could compare it to the military/police vs an armed mob, sure both might be taking down the same bad guy, but ten guys with shotguns have no accountability and although ending a hostage situation in a bank, they could have escalated it more than necessary and would end up in the clink along with the survivors.

SHIELD sending in capes to take down an inhuman crime ring has over sight, a rag tag group of inhumans who want the world to see they are not all bad taking down the same people, even if the collateral damage is the same, public opinion is different.

It took the Inhuman director of SHIELD to say Sky/Daisy was working covert ops for people to do a 180 on their opinion of her. To them Quake was running amok on inhumans and remnants of HYDRA and the anti inhuman militia, which she was, she quit SHIELD and did go rouge teaming up with Ghost Rider along the way.

But once he said "Nah man, what she did, she did on behalf of SHIELD for the greater good of mankind/America." and she was lauded for it.

No one at Xavias school has that governmental backing.

Have a go hero's are always divisive, although they got the job done, many think it could have ended much worse due to their recklessness, yet if said person is later revealed to be an off duty cop or serving in the military, their training wins over public perception.

"He's been trained to do this kind of thing." "I feel safe knowing people like him are around."

VS "It could have ended so badly, I hope I am never in a situation like that with him around."
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Old 10-09-2017, 09:56 AM
Ginger Tea Ginger Tea is offline
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Another thing that cinema goers mentioned that gained traction even though comic readers have been asking the same thing for decades.

"Why didn't anyone else help Tony during the whole Mandarin thing in 3?"

Once you give a cape friends, you expect to see said friends show up to help. But no, not Tony, but let's all gather round Steve.

I refuse to call Civil War a Captain America movie as it has way too many Avengers and I treat it as such even if the original story line started in his comics or had him as a driving force.

Marvel made the mistake of putting Transformers in the same universe as Spiderman (he was there in his pre Venom black suit during the 4 part origin) yet I don't think anyone ever spoke of giant robots wreaking havoc on the world (well North America) and you would think most would intervene given the chance.

The only other time I can recall Trasnformers related characters encountering capes was Deaths Head and the FF which IIR was trying to get him into the correct time line for the TF comics after Doctor Who (again never referenced in the main canon but now a part of it by proxy of TF related characters) dropped him off.

Had they not introduced Parker to the storyline, I wouldn't give a fig that the 7th Doctor met Deaths Head and their interaction got him into a FF story line.

When you have a connected universe, these outliers look too effing odd, keep TF/GI-Joe(Action Force in the UK for most of their run) in a universe with no capes, it keeps it cleaner for whomever takes over the rights to reprint, where as TF had to redo Parker and loose out on Circuit Breaker and her team cos they were Marvel properties and not Hasbro.

But that one issue with Spiderman meant that SHIELD, Avengers and the Xmen were ignoring a Decepticon threat.
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