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When is generalizing cool?
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Old 09-15-2017, 04:32 AM
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jackfaire jackfaire is offline
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Default When is generalizing cool?

This sort of ties into another topic but is a different facet of it.

Earlier I had posted about someone assuming that all Americans would't know what a word means. Now I called out the person who made the original post

One of her defenders decided to tell me that it was clearly meant to be humor. The thing is I don't think asides like "and yes men that means..." "so no women you can't ..."

Pretty much any joke that takes a group of people larger than 1 and says "this applies to all of them"

Personally I always call out jokes like that as being in poor taste. It occurred to me though that a lot of people don't actually think that jokes that generalize are the problem. Instead they see the problem as generalizing very specific groups.

To these people you can't generalize jews, blacks, gays, transgenders, foreigners etc. (Not just in the US but the world over)

But that Men, white people, and entire countries you're allowed to make the same exact jokes about.

Basically if it's not considered a protected group you can generalize all you want no matter how much these people will say that generalizing is wrong.

That kind of feels hypocritical. I legit feel it's always wrong to generalize they seem to feel it's only wrong if it's a group they support or feel is at risk.

If I were to say a general state about women i the same group I would be attacked, and rightfully so, for making broad stroke assumptions and/or jokes.

The thing is I wasn't White Knighting. I wasn't rushing to someone else's defense and I wasn't just being a dick.

I was legitimately offended that a generalized joke or assumption was being made about me and a group I belong to. Yet the same people who would attack me for such humor instead defend the person engaging in it.

Am I wrong? Should it be okay to lump people together and joke about them so long as they aren't being systematically oppressed by the current system in place? I mean I will say that doesn't feel like equality.

I get it in the USA I have white male privilege. But that to me doesn't mean I am not allowed to be insulted when someone genuinely insults me.

Thoughts?
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Old 09-15-2017, 04:04 PM
s_stabeler s_stabeler is offline
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it's a little bit complicated, but I agree with you that making jokes about an entire group is not less acceptable due to being part of a protected group.

basically, "and yes men this means..." is often intended to be part of something humorous. How acceptable it is generally depends on what the joke actually is- sometimes, for instance, the joke mocks the stereotype, not the group in question. It is, however, definitely a case of "know thy audience, dumbass."
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Old 09-16-2017, 01:33 AM
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This joke specifically called all Americans stupid

I said something because it offended a friend and she wasn't going to say anything so I did and I took the heat from a bunch of other Americans who don't mind being called stupid apparently.
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Old 09-16-2017, 07:11 PM
TheHuckster TheHuckster is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jackfaire View Post
This joke specifically called all Americans stupid

I said something because it offended a friend and she wasn't going to say anything so I did and I took the heat from a bunch of other Americans who don't mind being called stupid apparently.
To be frank, I think you're making a mountain out of a molehill on this.

I roll my eyes whenever I see someone make a comment on a video or article about a stupid person saying, "Must be in America." But the comment in question for you is someone who made a reference to a word in a different dialect which most Americans are not as familiar with. It has nothing to do with them being "stupid" (in fact, saying someone is stupid because they aren't as familiar with British English instead of American English could be offensive to some people, keep THAT in mind).

Jokes are often made at another's expense. And it's on a case-by-case basis as to how offensive it's going to be. I'm Irish, and I myself will make self-deprecating jokes about drinking, and I laugh at others who make lighthearted jokes about it as well. But if people start making jokes about me blowing up Protestants, then that's where I draw the line between fun and games and tactless insult.
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Old 09-19-2017, 01:42 PM
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I don't think pointing out something insults you is making a mountain of a molehill. I advised the person I was offended. I laid out why I was offended. I then went on with my day thinking no more of it. I did the digital "that's not funny" that people in real life do when someone says something insulting.

The only reason I brought it to fratching was that frankly I was "shocked" by the reaction that got. I was attacked for daring to be insulted. I was told to lighten up and to take the joke.

I heard that my entire childhood. Some kid would make me the butt of jokes and I was told to suck it up. The thing is those jokes colored every other kid's opinion of me. It affected how they saw me. I found my childhood a very lonely one because I was told to shut up be quiet sit back down and stop taking it personally.

If I had been a huge dick about it sure I would see attacking me. But a person should be able to say, "Hey I don't like jokes about being a drunk irish person" without being attacked by a bunch of other people who don't mind it.

There are legitimately women that don't mind misogynistic jokes being made about them. That doesn't mean women that don't like them should just shut up.

If you're insulted you should be free to say so. If you're not great then it doesn't affect you but don't go attacking people that it does.
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Old 09-19-2017, 02:11 PM
TheHuckster TheHuckster is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jackfaire View Post
I don't think pointing out something insults you is making a mountain of a molehill. I advised the person I was offended. I laid out why I was offended. I then went on with my day thinking no more of it. I did the digital "that's not funny" that people in real life do when someone says something insulting.
Alright, that's fine. I'm not saying you shouldn't feel insulted. However, I don't have a problem with other people disagreeing with you, either. I've observed other cases (not in your situation) where people are offended and just won't let the issue slide. They dwell on it, harass the person over it, accuse them of being a bigot/fascist/supremacist/whatever all because they made a joke that more sensitive people are going to take offense at. I will say, though, that saying you're stupid for not knowing British English is quite offensive to me.

And, yes, if you take offense at it, it's perfectly fine. It's not your cup of tea, and you can point out you didn't like it and move on. I guess I'm projecting from other observations, so I'm sorry for that.
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Old 09-19-2017, 11:36 PM
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Quote:
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I guess I'm projecting from other observations, so I'm sorry for that.
It's cool. I had and have 0 issue with people disagreeing with me I was miffed that some felt the need to attack me for my finding it insulting.
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