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  #31  
Old 04-13-2013, 10:03 AM
Duelist925 Duelist925 is offline
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Originally Posted by Hyena Dandy View Post
I'm clearly behind on my theology, but Christians have a flag now?

Shit, man, I didn't know that. Here I was, humbly worshipping my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, and the sacrifice He made to cleanse me of my sins, the love He showed for all humanity, reading and contemplating the Bible, and now it turns out that I was supposed to ignore the bits about hypocrites who make a big show out of their religion and fly a big fucking flag out on the front porch?

Jesus, man, WHY DIDN'T THE BIBLE MENTION THIS?! I've apparently been doing this wrong the whole time!

And I thought that Southern Baptists were all about Sola Scriptura. I've apparently been Sola-ing the wrong Scripturas if there's some flag I'm supposed to display.
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  #32  
Old 04-13-2013, 11:11 AM
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Hyena Dandy Hyena Dandy is offline
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Man, I never get invited to these things.

Seriously, though... I'm a Christian. And I HATE to see Christianity in the public sphere. The way I see it, if we start letting Christianity sway the Government, then we have to let the Government sway Christianity. And then where do we end up? We're electing people to dictate our theology.

And then sometimes people basically say "Well, when we say GOD in "In God we Trust" and "Under God," we don't mean the Christian God, we mean just a sort of general God, so it's not sectarian."

Personally, I don't believe in a general God. I believe in a very specific God. I believe in the God of the Bible. Well over a thousand years ago, Christians died because they wouldn't bow to the Roman Gods, or the Zoroastrian God. Because Christians followed the Christian God. They didn't follow Jupiter and they didn't follow Uhura Mazda, and as much as I've read my Bible, I'm yet to see any reference to "General God-Like Thing." I do see references to "Have no other god before me" which I assume would include "General God-Like Things"
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  #33  
Old 04-14-2013, 12:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Hyena Dandy View Post
I'm clearly behind on my theology, but Christians have a flag now?

And I thought that Southern Baptists were all about Sola Scriptura. I've apparently been Sola-ing the wrong Scripturas if there's some flag I'm supposed to display.
The Christian flag is very much a Protestant thing. It's supposed to be uni-denominational, and many churches use it . . . and many don't.

It was supposed to unite Christians. Like many good ideas, it has been usurped by people who like to use it to stick their holiness in the faces of others.

But as Jesus said . . . truly they have received their reward.
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  #34  
Old 04-14-2013, 03:30 AM
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And then sometimes people basically say "Well, when we say GOD in "In God we Trust" and "Under God," we don't mean the Christian God, we mean just a sort of general God, so it's not sectarian."
I always get aggravated when people referring to the one-and-only-God who disagree about aspects of His nature or what He wants us to do decide to say the other is a different God. If there's only one, it's the same one. "Sort of general God" would simply mean not bringing up the specific characteristics that only one group or another believes in.

Now, I'm not saying it's good enough for government. But Jews, Christians, and Muslims worship *the same God.* We disagree about what name he likes to be called, how many persons are within the one, what he expects of us, and several other things. But still the same God.

If you had three people arguing over the nature of the sun, one saying it's a guy with a chariot and a big lantern, one who says it's a giant ball of burning coal, and one who says it's hydrogen undergoing nuclear fusion (and yes, I realize there's no dispute over that currently) you might figuratively say they believe in different suns, but you'd also know better: that they simply disagree about how it works.
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  #35  
Old 04-14-2013, 07:37 AM
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Hyena Dandy Hyena Dandy is offline
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I understand your frustration, but I think you're not really responding to my post. I didn't refer to Christians, Muslims, and Jews in my post. Christians, Muslims, and Jews are all Abrahamic faiths, after all. Like you said, we worship the same basic god.

But what I said was

Quote:
Personally, I don't believe in a general God. I believe in a very specific God. I believe in the God of the Bible. Well over a thousand years ago, Christians died because they wouldn't bow to the Roman Gods, or the Zoroastrian God. Because Christians followed the Christian God. They didn't follow Jupiter and they didn't follow Uhura Mazda, and as much as I've read my Bible, I'm yet to see any reference to "General God-Like Thing." I do see references to "Have no other god before me" which I assume would include "General God-Like Things"
You can define the Abrahamic god however you like, but I think you and I can agree that the definition is not "A general god-thing"

Also.

Quote:
If there's only one, it's the same one.
I understand your frustration, but I think you're not really responding to my post. I didn't refer to Christians, Muslims, and Jews in my post. Christians, Muslims, and Jews are all Abrahamic faiths, after all. Like you said, we worship the same basic god.

But what I said was

Quote:
Personally, I don't believe in a general God. I believe in a very specific God. I believe in the God of the Bible. Well over a thousand years ago, Christians died because they wouldn't bow to the Roman Gods, or the Zoroastrian God. Because Christians followed the Christian God. They didn't follow Jupiter and they didn't follow Uhura Mazda, and as much as I've read my Bible, I'm yet to see any reference to "General God-Like Thing." I do see references to "Have no other god before me" which I assume would include "General God-Like Things"
You can define the Abrahamic god however you like, but I think you and I can agree that the definition is not "A general god-thing"

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If there's only one, it's the same one.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sikhism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atenism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoroastrianism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lingayatism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tenrikyo

...Not really, no.
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  #36  
Old 04-14-2013, 06:07 PM
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Originally Posted by HYHYBT View Post
Now, I'm not saying it's good enough for government. But Jews, Christians, and Muslims worship *the same God.* We disagree about what name he likes to be called, how many persons are within the one, what he expects of us, and several other things. But still the same God.
The Jews would probably differ with you on the idea they worship the same God as the Christian or Muslim god, especially since the Jews do not believe in the Triune God (God the Father, Jesus the Son, and the Holy Spirit). I think you make a major logic leap there. While I certainly view that I worship the same God as the Jews and Muslims, I acknowledge that the Jews may beg to differ in spite of the fact we also draw on the Old Testament for our holy scriptures.
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  #37  
Old 04-16-2013, 02:54 AM
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"missing the point" - nope. I personally feel to many people use the "separation of church/state" ... as a means to silence people of faiths. that people are turning the 1A away from freedom of speech & religion into "freedom to not be offended"
I think another issue at hand is that it's basically religious freedom for the majority. Do you think a room full of strongly religious Christians would sit quietly and listen to someone pray to Satan for guidance? Of course not, since according to most religious blowhards in politics, religious freedom only applies to those who think the way they do.

Hell, just look at that story about Bobby Jindal from Louisiana who famously voted for publicly funded religious schools, not realizing that state money would go to schools teaching religions other than Christianity. Le gasp! Other religions exist!?

Yes, they do, and in trying to further your own agenda, you've furthered theirs as well. Now live with your shame, Bobby Jindal.

Personally, I don't think shows of religious belief should be a part of any government meetings. As a citizen who pays for these idiots to sip wine and pat each other on the back for months at a time, I'd prefer they get down to business sooner rather than later.
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  #38  
Old 04-16-2013, 11:34 PM
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Yes, they do, and in trying to further your own agenda, you've furthered theirs as well. Now live with your shame, Bobby Jindal.

Personally, I don't think shows of religious belief should be a part of any government meetings. As a citizen who pays for these idiots to sip wine and pat each other on the back for months at a time, I'd prefer they get down to business sooner rather than later.
I do think you're on to something when it comes to these guys. The Founders wrote the first amendment to protect all the One Truth Faiths from all the other One True Faiths.

A government meeting is not a church service. My constitutional rights are in no way impacted by keeping a government meeting to government business. My faith does not require nor is it hurt by a lack of school prayer or "In God We Trust" on the money.

All government sponsored prayer is, is an opportunity for some people in government to show their piety. Well, they have received their reward.
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  #39  
Old 04-21-2013, 09:39 AM
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Hyena Dandy Hyena Dandy is offline
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Hell, just look at that story about Bobby Jindal from Louisiana who famously voted for publicly funded religious schools, not realizing that state money would go to schools teaching religions other than Christianity. Le gasp! Other religions exist!?

Yes, they do, and in trying to further your own agenda, you've furthered theirs as well. Now live with your shame, Bobby Jindal.
Small correction - Bobby Jindal was the Governor who signed the bill. Valarie Hodges was the one shocked that Islam was a religion.
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