Been under that rock for about fifty years, eh?

[Flyndaran]

But she made the qualifier, in the South. Hence, the problem. Racial divides exist all over the country, especially in big cities. I wouldn't say they exist anymore in the South than they do up here in the Midwest/Plains area, from personal observation. Kansas City is a poster child for it.

Big cities are far less bigoted than rural areas.

[BroomJockey]

Big cities are far less bigoted than rural areas.

Got anything besides your own experience to back that up? After all, you swear by the scientific method, and I'd hate for you to make a statement of fact based on just hearsay.

[smileyeagle1021]

well Broom, it's not quite scientific, but Democrats tend to be less bigoted (they tend to vote in favor of anti-discrimination bills and equality laws) and big cities tend to have more Democracts (just look at election results), therefore, if we accept both premises to be true (that democrats are less bigoted and big cities are more likely to have democrats) then we can accept that big cities have a less bigoted population.

And my personal experience has backed that up... with the exception of salt lake, the larger the city, the more people have been open and welcoming to homosexuals... and salt lake has the excuse that it is a cult headquarters city (my apologies to SIGE, but after my experience in the so call church, I can never again show it respect).

[AdminAssistant]

Seriously, go to Kansas City and drive down Troost Avenue or State Line Road. There is a clear delineation between the 'white' part of town and the 'black' part of town. Blacks and other minorities live east of Troost or in KCK. Poor whites live downtown, south of Bannister Rd., or in certain corners of midtown. Richer whites - Brookside or any of the many "white flight" suburbs. There is an extreme amount of racial prejudice and tension there. Moreso than the smaller, rural towns in the South that I'm familiar with. A friend in St. Louis has told me there's a similar problem there. Other cities...I don't know.

But, of course, it's just easier to sweep all of the South and every rural neighborhood with the same brush. We're all just stupid, racist, NASCAR-lovin' rednecks.

[RecoveringKinkoid]

That would have probably been my first thought as well, that the groups were segregated. That's a proper term. If you see a group of a certain race all together with few in the other groups, wouldn't that be your first thought?

It wasn't mine. I was in that same gym the week before to see my nephew do his gym class, and when I saw them, my first thought was that they were a school group or a special club or something. I asked my sister and sure enough, they were pretty much both: cheerleading class from a particular school.

Segregation being, you know, illegal and unconstitutional and all. I mean, I know that some groups do self segregate in certain situations, but I seriously doubt a place that holds classes would get away with deliberately segregating their classes for long.

RAPS: yeah, I said the same thing to her, actually. I would not have been able to let it go. But my sister is not much like me. She's kind of shy and not much willing to engage in a conversation with an idiotic stranger.

[BroomJockey]

And my personal experience has backed that up...

You're not the one who's said personal experience is not adequate to prove a fact elsewhere on the board, smiley.

[protege]

A friend in St. Louis has told me there's a similar problem there. Other cities...I don't know.

Pittsburgh has a similar situation. We too have a clear distinction between the 'white' and 'black' parts of town. Blacks tend to live in areas like Hazelwood, the Hill District (up behind the Mellon Arena, for those of you who watch the Penguins), the North Side, Lincoln-Larimer, Homewood, East Liberty, parts of Oakland, etc. All of which are high-crime areas compared to the 'white' suburban areas.

Originally, many of those neighborhoods were 'mixed' neighborhoods. Then, after the 1960s race riots, quite a few white people moved out to the 'burbs, and even now, many of the 'burbs are still mostly white. It's not that we don't want blacks out in the 'burbs...but rather we don't want the problems of their neighborhoods to come with them. That is, we don't want the drug trafficking, the prostitution, and other crimes that seem to be "tolerated" in their neighborhoods.

Quite a few people saw what happened to the "Green Gables" housing development over in Baldwin. As soon as that place started taking Section 8 vouchers, and the blacks started moving in...it went from an OK neighborhood to "South Central LA" almost overnight. Since then, there have been several drug busts over there. Bad enough, that there's now a police station in the middle of that development. Eventually, under pressure of surrounding residents, the development lost their Section 8 status, and most of those residents left. No sooner do they leave, when the crime level over there...went back to its pre-Section 8 level. With that said, it's no wonder there's prejudice out in the 'burbs

[RecoveringKinkoid]

Racial divides still exist (and are indeed more prevalent in the South) but "segregation" just isn't the right word.

Exactly. I have to wonder if she meant to use another word. But even if she meant to suggest some sort of voluntary division of races, I'd love to know where she's getting her information.

I am certainly not going to claim there is no racial tension of any sort here. Of course there is. I imagine you'll find that anywhere there is more than one race. However, Georgia is (to my suprise, actually, I thought the percentage would be higher) 30 percent afro-american, and South Carolina, where I live, is approaching 50 percent, if I have that right. I'd say that overall, we've figured out how to live together for the most part.

We are not perfect here. However, it's not the backwards pre-civil rights cesspit that some folks in other places seem to think it is.

[Flyndaran]

... 30 percent afro-american, and South Carolina, where I live, is approaching 50 percent, if I have that right. I'd say that overall, we've figured out how to live together for the most part.
...

Sorry, but every time that someone mentions that word, I giggle with images of 70s hairstyles gone crazy.
Black people are black. Not colored, because we all have colors. If you see a colorless person get your eyes checked. They aren't any vulgar words. They aren't African Americans unless they damn well personally came from Africa. Charlize Theron is African American and white.

I am not Native-Caucasian--Hispanic-Middle Eastern-Asian-American and maybe other stuff, because that is silly.

[Boozy]

Mod Note

Please start a new thread if you want to discuss the issues that Flyn brought up in his last post. Going that route will get us too far off topic for this particular discussion.

[XiaoTortuga]

My personal experiences from when I lived in South Carolina back in 90/91:
Everybody had figured out how to co-exist. The black teachers and the white teachers sat at different lunch tables, as did the black and white students. There were very few white students in my school because most of the white kids when to a private school where there were NO black students. Our town had the black funeral home and the white funeral home. There were the black churches and the white churches.

The only time students actually bridged the gap and became friendly with each other was the boys who played football.

It was not uncommon to hear white people of all ages openly discuss their dislike/hate for black people in very insulting language.

This was a small town, and it was a while ago, but I really doubt the town has managed to completely turn around since I was there.

(And it was known by everyone that no white girls would get on the cheer leading team.)

My experiences there do not reflect what it is like in all of South Carolina. Not all white people in the south are racist and not all areas are existing in a shared but separated space. But, the spoken and unspoken agreed upon segregation was most definitely in existence when I was there.

[RecoveringKinkoid]

My friend K, from my last job, is black.

Long story short, she had a run in with a salesman from a certain rag publication we have out here geared towards a black audience. She is a media buyer. This guy harassed, cajoled, begged, insulted and belittled her. In truth, I have never seen anyone act in such a professional manner in my entire life as this jackass did. He called her on a weekly basis. It became a years-long running office joke.

He went over the line one day, calling her an Uncle Tom, among other things. Blah blah blah.

She came over to my cube that afternoon and said to me, "You know what? Today is the very first time in my life, in all honesty, that I've actually had to deal with real race-related bullshit in my life. I can honestly say that before now, it has never been an issue for me."

Of course, the irony of it all was that she was being handed this shit by a BLACK MAN.

Her point, really, was that in her dealings with the population at large, race just didn't seem to be an issue, at least as far as it affected her. However, there will always be that small fringe group who sees racism everywhere and tries to use it to their benefit.

[protege]

She came over to my cube that afternoon and said to me, "You know what? Today is the very first time in my life, in all honesty, that I've actually had to deal with real race-related bullshit in my life. I can honestly say that before now, it has never been an issue for me."

Of course, the irony of it all was that she was being handed this shit by a BLACK MAN.

Pardon my French, but that's fucked up. Sadly, it's not unheard of.

For example, one of my mother's former coworkers was a black doctor. A * successful* black doctor, who literally started with nothing. Worker her ass off all through school, college, and then med school. Very difficult to do that 40+ years ago. Anyway, she said that when she sees her parents, (who still live in the old neighborhood...which has since fallen on hard times) she has to deal with that sort of shit. She usually tells those people to fuck off. Why should she be made to feel guilty for working hard?

Hell, up until meeting her, I had no idea she was black. Up until then, I'd always dealt with her on the phone, and the call usually wasn't very long. She'd sometimes pick up...and then transfer me to my mother

Anyway, what always got me, is that most white people always treated her with respect. Yet many of her own race did not. What's up with that shit?

[the_std]

Anyway, what always got me, is that most white people always treated her with respect. Yet many of her own race did not. What's up with that shit?

One word: jealousy.

[RecoveringKinkoid]

Well, in this case, the salesman was having to deal with my white boss until K was hired to handle that sort of thing. When the salesman found out she was black he decided that "of course the sister would help a brother out."

When he found out that shit didn't fly with her, he resorted to saying that the only reason she was hired was so that our (rather large) company could say "no" to him (a tiny little person selling an unread mag ) without looking racist.

I shit you not. He said that to her.

But I guess the point is that yeah, there are a few holdouts here who dearly hope and pray that racism is alive and well because it suits them for it to be true. It's the only thing they have. And of course, I would not be so naive to suggest that there are no bona fide card carrying racists out here. But the vast majority that goes on about their lives day to day? Not that big of a spectre looming over us.