Sexual Preference & Promiscuitity

[Hobbs]

Never been to a gay bar. We didn't have any at school (though there was one that I nicknamed our school's gay bar mainly because there tended to be a high gay population there).

Um...that sucks?

Going from relationship to relationship to relationship sucks. And personally, I prefer to not get STDs which is more likely to happen when you whore yourself out. It gets tiring after awhile. And I was under the impression that most gay people who want to stay with a partner permanently didn't give a crap what the bible has to say about it.

There are many heterosexuals that don't give a crap about what the Bible says either. I'm pretty sure most people don't want STD's either. What exactly is your point? How is "whoring yourself out" an explicitely "gay" trend?

[crashhelmet]

It always amuses me when members of the majority make this complaint. For the most part, American history (what's been allowed to be taught, anyway) has been a celebration of the White heterosexual male, only recently acknowledging to contributions of women, racial minorities, and homosexuals. Every parade, every group, every law, every positive story, until only recently, has been focused on representing the White heterosexual male. Many of the women's groups, minority groups, and homosexual groups present today ONLY came about because the rest of us were ignored. Our contributions to society, if they were acknowledged at all, were co-opted by White heterosexual males. Do you know why Black history month and Hispanic Heritage month and Asian Heritage month exist? Because there's more to all of those groups histories in this country than the blurbs they're relegated to in the history books. Do you know why Gay Pride exists? Because not only do they not even get a blurb, this country still has not reached the point where it sees them as full people.

Regardless of what our history was, it still does not excuse the fact that if someone decided to start the National Association for the Advancement of White People, they'd be quickly labeled a racist, have activists and their mobs after them, and then be shut down. They would probably be sued along the way too. It's a double-standard that people turn a blind eye to. The closest that they can do to a festival or a parade would be to celebrate whatever their heritage is.

Back on topic, I wouldn't go as far as to say the gay and lesbian friends I have are 50-50 in this aspect. Could only say that some are and some aren't. It would probably be safe to say that of these friends, the ones that act more like their opposite genders (effeminate men and "butch" women) are more promiscuous than the ones that aren't.

CH

[Hobbs]

Regardless of what our history was, it still does not excuse the fact that if someone decided to start the National Association for the Advancement of White People, they'd be quickly labeled a racist, have activists and their mobs after them, and then be shut down. They would probably be sued along the way too. It's a double-standard that people turn a blind eye to. The closest that they can do to a festival or a parade would be to celebrate whatever their heritage is.

There are Irish, German, Dutch etc. heritage festivals every year. My city produces several.

And there's no need for something like the NAAWP because, as stated, white heterosexual males have never been discriminated against. While there has been an issue of class within a historical setting, it has always been the standard that, "at least I'm white."

I find it hilarious that the people claiming discrimination are the ones who've never been discriminated against due to skin color.

[Greenday]

It always amuses me when members of the majority make this complaint. For the most part, American history (what's been allowed to be taught, anyway) has been a celebration of the White heterosexual male, only recently acknowledging to contributions of women, racial minorities, and homosexuals. Every parade, every group, every law, every positive story, until only recently, has been focused on representing the White heterosexual male. Many of the women's groups, minority groups, and homosexual groups present today ONLY came about because the rest of us were ignored. Our contributions to society, if they were acknowledged at all, were co-opted by White heterosexual males. Do you know why Black history month and Hispanic Heritage month and Asian Heritage month exist? Because there's more to all of those groups histories in this country than the blurbs they're relegated to in the history books. Do you know why Gay Pride exists? Because not only do they not even get a blurb, this country still has not reached the point where it sees them as full people.

By the time I was born and could actively follow politics, nearly all of that was in the past. The only group on there that still has a huge fight left if homosexuals. Women and racial minorities had equal rights by then. I'm pointing out that it's cool to have a special group of your own or party or event as long as it isn't all guys, whites, and heterosexuals.

[KnitShoni]

By the time I was born and could actively follow politics, nearly all of that was in the past. The only group on there that still has a huge fight left if homosexuals. Women and racial minorities had equal rights by then. I'm pointing out that it's cool to have a special group of your own or party or event as long as it isn't all guys, whites, and heterosexuals.

Could it possibly be that part of the reason for that is every time there is a group like that or similar, it ends up turning into a Klan knock-off or a bunch of Neo-Nazis?

[Greenday]

Could it possibly be that part of the reason for that is every time there is a group like that or similar, it ends up turning into a Klan knock-off or a bunch of Neo-Nazis?

99% of the time, yes, because they don't give a crap what anyone thinks. I'd prefer to not be called racist, sexist, etc., but the point stands. Why is it cool for there to be black clubs but not white clubs? Society doesn't allow for any other reason for people who were privileged because of the way they were born to be proud of who they are and to show it off.

[KnitShoni]

99% of the time, yes, because they don't give a crap what anyone thinks. I'd prefer to not be called racist, sexist, etc., but the point stands. Why is it cool for there to be black clubs but not white clubs? Society doesn't allow for any other reason for people who were privileged because of the way they were born to be proud of who they are and to show it off.

Society is built to celebrate who you are and show it off. Why does it need to allow for something it was built for? This is why there is Gay Pride. No one has been made to feel ashamed of who they are by the whole of society if they are White and straight.

No one is calling you racist or sexist. However, you yourself admit that 99% of the time, White pride groups turn into bunches of people who see anyone not like them as less than people. Their whole reason for existence becomes excluding or killing others. So, yeah, people are going to be afraid of any group that touts itself as a White pride group. Sort of like straight people. People complain that there is no "straight pride." Who has been made to be ashamed of being straight?

[Nyoibo]

"Who has been made to be ashamed of being straight?

Obviously never been around the bad type of gay activist.

[KnitShoni]

Obviously never been around the bad type of gay activist.

Ok, let me rephrase that: When has it ever been acceptable in society to be ashamed of being straight? Also, how many of the "bad type"of activist are out there and affect others?

[smileyeagle1021]

. I'm pointing out that it's cool to have a special group of your own or party or event as long as it isn't all guys, whites, and heterosexuals.

I do believe that would be called the Mormon Church
Those in the minority of course have to form "special" groups, we have to rely on ourselves and each other to survive... we don't have a system that has supported us for 250 years to back us up. The most masterful piece of social engineering on the planet (the US tax code) was written by and for white, heterosexual, christian, males. Did you know if a husband abandons his wife and child, it is the now single mother who is going to take the tax hit? I guess in that context homosexuals are lucky, we will never have the tax advantage to lose.

ETA- the tax code makes it nearly impossible for a man to leave his wife. Say a man has $1,000,000 in assets, for the divorce he is forced to liquidate his assets, at the end he will have $4,000. So it is understandable why so many would just leave, and then the wife is left with head of household status which has much less deductions and tax privileges than married. The man must file as single, but that hurts someone who is raising kids a lot less than suddenly being bumped to head of household.

[Ginger Tea]

I'm pointing out that it's cool to have a special group of your own or party or event as long as it isn't all guys, whites, and heterosexuals.

Who would willingly go to a hetrosexual saussage fest?

I did one manchester madigra in 97/98 as manchester has a large 'village' which also backs onto the red light district. I was invited by a mate who was invited by a female co worker.
She didn't want to go alone as she was inbetween relationships and didn't want to be hit on left right and centre.
He wasn't too keen on going by himself so he called me in to be his 'boyfriend', both being hetrosexual we agreed it would be safer to just point to each other and say "I'm sorry I'm with my boyfriend." and leave it at that, I had to say it more than he did (perhaps wearing a dress with a front split to my crotch and leather panties didnt help) If I was the sterotypical promiscuous gay male, I could have had most of the venue form an orderly queue. being that I am not the worst I did was break a few hearts for the night and snog (but with no touges) some bloke in the toilet after he congratulated me on my gay wedding in amsterdam, a bemused me saw said mate creasing up in the corner trying to take an incriminating shot (not the most incriminating one I've ever been in mind you)

[Sage Blackthorn]

Society is built to celebrate who you are and show it off. Why does it need to allow for something it was built for? This is why there is Gay Pride. No one has been made to feel ashamed of who they are by the whole of society if they are White and straight.

Uhm....actually I have been made to feel ashmed for being white and male most all of my life. (Thankfully the only problems I seem to have with being predominantly straight is that when some guy thinks I'm cute and I tell them I have a girlfriend they seem to get a bit disappointed.) Maybe not by the whole of society, but by the majority of society where I live.

I've been told things like "Only white people can be racist", which redlines my bullshit meter. Racism is a learned behaviour, it's not a genetic trait. I've been accused of being evil in some way solely for being Male (always by young, militant feminists, never by older feminists stangely). I've had people look at me and assume that I'm upper middle class based solely on the color of my skin (I actually earn below poverty level currently) and get pissed when I tell them I have no money.

Now something I read recently by James Loewen, author of "Lies My Teacher Told Me" struck me as being significant. Loewen pointed out that "White" as a racial category did not even exist until the colonization of North America. Before that time, Europeans identified themselves as English, Portuguese, French, German, Austrian, etc. etc. Even though they new that peple in other parts of the world had darker skin tones, they were still known as African, Indian, Arabian......still identified by their country of origin and not their skin color.

And yeah, every so often I run into the rare (and hopefully endangered) Militant Gay Activist who gives me shit over being straight and seeks to blame me personally for all the hatred and inequality caused by "straight people" everywhere.

Very rarely does any one of these people who are lambasting me for the crime of being born Male, White, and Straight stop and get to know me as a person. Ask me my thoughts and beliefs on their respective subjects. If they did, they might just find out that I support equality, I think that labels such as "Homosexual" or "Heterosexual" are nothing more than labels forced on people by the culture they are born into and that humans are merely sexual beings. I would then also point out that while modern civilized cultures recognize only two genders, other cultures recognize between 3 and 5 genders. Gender is a social construct in a sense. I'd point out that while I'm quite proud of my English, German, French, Dutch, Lakota, Apache, Italian (Roman actually from WAY back in the family history), and all the myriad other countries of all the ancestors who contributed in some small way to my birth, and I find them fascinating.....I don't let it define me.

See when I was growing up, my parents taught me that all people are equel, that I shouldn't judge someone on their appearance but on their actions. And it was really painful growing up and being confronted by a young African-American kid in school who started making fun of me by calling "White Honkey, White Honkey." And discovering that people would hate me soley for the color of my skin. Or for being Male. Or for preferring girls over boys.

When it comes to intolerance, the pendulum swings both ways, and I think as long as people continue to focus on what's different about them, instead of all the things that taret similar, then there will always be groups who have to hate others to make themselve feel special.

Oh, and I don't think "homosexuals" are really any more "slutty" than heterosexuals are. As someone once told me, when you've been told that you are deviant or wrong in some way for years, persecuted, beaten, humiliated.....then it's only natural to be joyous and whole hearted in one of the few things you can choose and control in this life.....who you have sex with.

[Greenday]

This thread has totally been derailed. Back to who puts out more to more people.

[Sage Blackthorn]

This thread has totally been derailed. Back to who puts out more to more people.

Threads wander, it's the nature of conversation to shift between subjects. Don't worry about it. We're doing it no by talking about subject shifts rather than whether or not promiscuity is tied to sexual orientation or not.

[Ladeeda]

If you're judging the sluttiness of a group of people based on being in a bar designed for the purpose of people hooking up temporarily, methinks you need a broader sample.