Official Languages for the US

[Rubystars]

My only point in bringing that up is how they're using their children to get a firmer foothold here. First to have an "American Citizen" baby and then child which makes it harder to deport them, and as the child grows into an adult, a politically active ally.

I don't expect people to vote against their parents. What frustrates me is that these people are granted citizenship as babies even though their loyalty is going to be more to the illegal foreign nationals.

[DesignFox]

The reason the illegals don't get deported or thrown in jail- just not enough jail space or funding. My dad tows for the police- these illegal types drive around, get pulled over for something, turn out to be illegal (no valid ID, green card or driver's license, no registration in car, no valid license plates), and just walk away...laughing. They GET AWAY WITH IT. ALL THE TIME. The government needs to do SOMETHING about it or it will never be remedied- for that to happen, more citizens...LEGAL ONES...need to take a stand and voice their concern. Since that isn't happening, the problem persists.

This makes my brain hurt... humanity is going to blow itself up in the next 100 years..... (and that's a generous estimate).

[Rubystars]

Fox, they've tried to remedy that in some places by setting up tent city jails, but the bleeding heart leftists decry the adequate conditions as inhumane.

A lot of illegals do get away with crimes like driving without a license, etc. However there ARE a lot of violent offenders in jails that are illegal aliens.
Many of them are sex offenders due to the fact that the culture is different in Mexico and girls are considered women at a younger age in Mexican culture than they are in American culture. Grown Mexican men were whistling at my friend and I when we were 11 or 12 years old. There is also a lot of Hispanic gang violence, from groups like the Latin Kings and Crazy Crew.

It's one major reason (along with people in jail for soft drug use) that the prisons are overcrowded. No wonder they can barely fit any more in there.

Deport illegal alien criminals to a Mexican prison, decriminalize soft drugs (at least), and the prisons will be more open for scumbags like our own home grown child sex offenders, who often live free after a tragically short stay in prison.

[squall]

And I wasn't telling you to go to radical protests, I was telling you to go to ANY large protest of illegals demanding rights. Just because the news cameras usually don't focus on those signs doesn't mean they're not there. It would be interesting for you to go to one of those protests then see how it's covered by the mainstream news outlets and note the differences.

I believe that any time you get huge gatherings together of any specific race, whether it is a white gathering, black, latino, middle-eastern muslim, together it usually steers to an "us against them" mentality. The mobs tend to take on a life of their own and the hateful feelings come out because of their strength in numbers. Things like "white devil", "Go back to Africa", "Death to Infidels". Basically it's not unique to Latinos, so I don't think it is any indication of a majority movement.

[Rubystars]

I may not be able to convince you that it's not a fringe idea no matter how many examples or videos I show you or how many 'mainstream' names I drop. However, what I will tell you is that to be a part of that movement, all they have to do is keep flooding over the border and reproducing and refusing to integrate, numerically overwhelming Americans until their culture is the dominant one in the Southwest. In their daily lives, they don't have to do anything particularly militant in order to support this movement. It's already beginning to be the dominant culture in some areas. What will it be like in 20 or 30 years? What if the birth rates don't even out? What if a guest worker program sends millions more over (including the families of the 'guest workers') who will overstay their work visa and simply disappear into the crowd? Reconquista is happening before our eyes and the only way to stop it is a two pronged approach of true improvement in border security and a streamlined way of enforcing the law and deporting the illegals already here. It would also help immensely if the children of illegal aliens were not automatically given citizenship, because it would not give the rights of citizens to people who would be more loyal to a foreign country than to their supposed own country.

[squall]

Highly disagree!!! I would venture to say most are not silent supporters of some reconquista movement. The idea sounds racist. You are lumping all of the illegal aliens, and even legal immigrants into the category of an extremist group. To cast them all with suspicion, even legal immigrants, is racist. Unless they have waved the Mexican flag in front of me and held banners confirming their beliefs, I will not automatically think that they are supporters of taking the land back for Mexico. They come here to live a better life, not necessarily to retake what was once their ancestors land. I doubt any who are sane believe that Texas still belongs to Mexico. I'm sure many fully intend to integrate US culture, but do not be shocked if they bring a little culture back with them. I saw ONE mainstream politician in all of those videos.....that's not alot of mainstream people. I am not a silent supporter of any pro-white movement just because I'm white.

Being born in the United States and becoming a citizen was one of the founding principles of this country. It meant freedom from the oppression and tyranny of a foreign power, or any who falsely proclaim sovereignty over our soil (then the United Kingdom). Perhaps a little outdated...but founding principle all the same. People will probably take advantage of that, maybe not always consciously. Many illegals don't know enough about our laws in the first place and are not politically active. Yes they borrow identities, but probably not extremely widespread. Look up "reconquista" in the context of retaking the southwest on Wikipedia and you will see how little information there is on it. I've not heard much about it, neither have many Americans.

I believe with all due respect that your numbers of this movement are inflated.

We must treat all illegals the same, whether they be English speakers or non-english speakers non-citizens(Canadians, Chinese, Ukrainians, Mexicans, Cubans, Vietnamese, whatever). So much emphasis has been placed on the country south of us. What about our northern borders? It would be contradictary, and I venture to say racist, to beef up security only on the Southern border. The immediate problems of having a third world country next to us are the most obvious of course.

I treat all people with respect. I do not cast suspicion on somebody with different color skin. I don't think things like "they must be illegal, or harbor and illegal" or "they must live in the hood" or "they must be terrorists". In the end, we all bleed red. We are all on this boat called Earth together, and we all should just start getting along.

But to agree with you, yes illegals need to be sought out and deported by the authorities, but it is not our civic responsibility to do it as civilians. Border patrol needs to be tougher. Guest visas need to be investigated. The state governments need to be more pro-active in stopping illegals, possibly even build a fence if they think it is cheaper (I think it's way too expensive and unrealistic having driven the length of the Southwest). But to say I have no respect for other cultures, that is not the case. I am conservative, but not the over-inflated sense of ego southern Baptist type.

[DesignFox]

I think the point rubystars is trying to make (and I agree) is that she has no problem with people who have come to America legally, have adopted our culture and our main (if not official) language- English.

Her problem, I think, is with people who cross the border illegally, and then try to lay claim to rights they don't deserve- because they don't LEGALLY belong here. (again, I agree)

The main beef is that these ILLEGALS are stirring up rallies, and trying to bring THEIR culture, exclusively, into OUR country. If you want to live, eat, sleep, breathe your country's culture- then you should bloody well stay there. Don't come over here, bitch whine and moan, and try to start a fight- especially if you aren't a LEGAL CITIZEN in the first place.

Chances are, if you are a LEGAL citizen- and you became one not because your greedy parents let you drop out the vagina over here- but because you moved here -LEGALLY- and applied through channels to gain citizenship- you are likely going to be loyal to this country. Afterall, you gave up EVERYTHING to be here. THOSE people I have no problem with, and even welcome with open arms.

As for illegals- in my opinion- as soon as they are caught, they need to be deported. Period. I believe that is the issue here- although it all started over whether or not our official language should be English...which, since our schools teach English, all business is conducted in English, and our government is run in English...you get the point.

[squall]

I truly agree with every point you just mentioned, DesignFox. The only problem I have in regards to the earlier argument is stereotyping a race into being a violent, invasive group typical only to a fringe extremist group. Like calling all Muslims terrorists, or all Hispanics reconquistadors. To project the faults of a view bad apples onto an entire race and by saying breeding is a form of rebellion and punishment to us.

I'm not trying to disagree with everyone, but when prejudices come out, I take aim.

[Rubystars]

Design Fox puts it better than I can. I know that some of my posts can come off sounding harsher than I mean them to and that can sometimes distract from the points I'm trying to make.

I don't have a problem with Mexicans or their culture per se. It's that I think that American culture should predominate here and that immigrants should be legal and not come in such massive numbers at once that it makes it impossible for them to really assimilate.

All immigrant cultures will contribute some things from their culture into ours as they assimilate, and that's not a bad thing. A lot of American kids have pinatas at their birthday parties now, for example. Many Spanish words have even become commonly used among English speakers to each other, and that's ok too. That's quite a different story from the massive invasion that's occurring right now, many with a push toward their culture shoving American culture out of the way rather than blending with it and adopting as their new native language: English.

[Barefootgirl]

Are there any hard numbers on how many people belong to these reconqistador movements? Any suggestions of total active turn-out at rallies, etc? Cos it reminds me a bit of when the WTC was attacked, and all the news stations showed that footage of Palestinians dancing in the streets, celebrating and burning American flags, and we all watched appalled...until afterseeing EXACTLY the same piece of footage every day for a week, someone (probably John Pilger) went and investigated it and found out that this was the only protest of its type that ANY film crews had been able to find. There wasn't a great mass of celebrating palestinians, just about twenty in a back street. Lots of scaremongering that there is an evil sea of aliens jsut waiting to over-run us and give us their filthy diseases...

Incidentally, I didn't see much medical or intellectual rigour in that Madeleine Cosman article that suggested that filthy illegal immigrants are spreading disease across the USA. No mention of the increase on foreign travel, no mention of the increase in LEGAL immigration, no mention of the fact that many Americans cannot affrod proper medical treatment, so travel to these places without gettign the proper jabs and re-infect their peers on their return, no mention of the fact that yes, some of the re-introduction of these diseases IS vectored by immigrants - but not every immigrant a) has the Black Death and b)is an illegal.

[Rubystars]

These diseases do come in through other means, however the reason that illegal immigration is such a point of concern on that subject is the massive volume of people who come in. Millions, with no medical screening upon entering the country.

Legal immigrants are much less likely to be a problem because 1. They may actually have to be screened for some things and 2. There are much fewer of them in total.

There have been protests like that throughout the southwest U.S., promoting the rebirth of the Southwest as Aztlan, supporting Reconquista, etc. One of the video clips shows Mexicans chanting "Our Land! Our Continent! We're taking it back!" Michelle Malkin in her clip quite eloquently destroyed the logic behind such cries by explaining the history. There are a lot of people behind the movement, and some of the groups involved are getting federal funding, sadly enough.

[powerboy]

The way as I think about it is this. If I visit any other country, then I would have to learn to speak the language; well enough to get by. So why not, the same for the people that come here from other countries?

[Greenday]

The way as I think about it is this. If I visit any other country, then I would have to learn to speak the language; well enough to get by. So why not, the same for the people that come here from other countries?

Exactly! English is the main language of America, whether it is officially recognized or not. To have people come here, try to live here, and never even bother TRY to learn English is total crap.

[CancelMyService]

When the first settlers came to America, did they adopt the Native languages and culture? No.

Funny how that works when the shoe's on the other foot.

The thing about language debates it that there's always an undercurrent of "my language and culture is superior and you need to abandon yours and adopt ours to be accepted" that just seems kind of wrong to me.

[Greenday]

Of course they didn't bother to learn any of the Native American's languages. For one thing, there was no language of the Native American's. There were a ton of different languages/dialects. Every single different group had a different dialect if not entire language. You can't compare that to today's society. The majority of people in America speak English. According to the 2000 census, 82.1% of Americans spoke English. Next comes Spanish with 10.7%. I'm sure those numbers have changes in the past 7 years, but there's no way in hell Spanish has surpassed English. Since the majority of Americans speak the same language, there is valid reason to make English the national language.