What's the difference

[DrFaroohk]

Well done! Any other stupid points you want to make?

[Ree]

That's a little rude.

You're the one who posted looking for advice about your own children.

Oh, correction...looking for advice about the behavioural differences between your own flesh and blood sweet angel of a daughter and the heinous little stepkid.

[the_std]

DrF, I have to point out - the very first reply to your OP, I told you that there was no way this topic would end well, it is not a good thing to bring up with strangers. And yet you straight up insult Ree? When she's trying to point out the differences you don't seem to want to see? Why the hell do you bother posting this stuff at all, then?

[Ree]

Why the hell do you bother posting this stuff at all, then?

I'm guessing because even negative attention is attention, and this is something he can control in his impotent world?

[DrFaroohk]

Yeah because the little eyeroll earlier wasn't rude at all. My statement was just as rude as you intended that to be.

Also, quit strawmanning. That's a good way to look really stupid.

[the_std]

I suppose... Because otherwise it's all "CONFRONTATION IN MY LIFE IS BAD LOOK AT HOW MUCH MY LIFE SUCKS" with everything, except with us... Then confrontation seems to be the name of the game. It's pretty sad.

[the_std]

Yeah because the little eyeroll earlier wasn't rude at all. My statement was just as rude as you intended that to be.

Also, quit strawmanning. That's a good way to look really stupid.

You know what? You need to man up or shut up, because this getting pathetic. Ree's eyeroll was essentially because she was trying to HELP YOU and you stick your finger in your ears and say, "LALALALA YOU'RE WRONG I'M RIGHT". She is answering the goddamned question in the title of this thread and you don't want to hear any answers!

And then you turn around and call her stupid again?? Pick up your balls and admit when you're wrong or stop asking advice when it's fucking obvious you're not going to like the answers you get!

[Ree]

Yeah because the little eyeroll earlier wasn't rude at all. My statement was just as rude as you intended that to be.

Also, quit strawmanning. That's a good way to look really stupid.

Excuse me???

My comments were not made to belittle you. Yours have all been made to imply that I am "stupid", and that is rude and uncalled for.

The eyeroll was intended as an emphasis because you started a thread asking total strangers who have never even met your child, what the difference was in the behaviour between 2 different children of 2 different genders in 2 different age groups, and when I asked a question that you should have known the answer to, I got "I'm not a psychic" as a response.

You were lamenting the behaviour of the 7 year old boy, and from what I read of the description of your behaviour, it seemed to me, based on 8 years of fostering troubled children, and having taken training and courses in dealing with these children, that the behaviour described was not all that normal for a 7 year old boy.
Some of it could be chalked up to normal stubbornness and clumsiness in a boy of that age, but some of it set off some red flags for me, and I was concerned.

When I asked if he had properly dealt with the death, I had assumed that you were like most responsible parents and you had actually talked to your child about it and made sure he was OK.
I didn't expect a verbal shoulder shrug and a "How should I know? I'm not psychic" type of answer.
The fact that you started this thread made me think you really did care about this behaviour, but I see now that you just wanted to bitch about the boy being a pain in the ass and a thorn in your side.

Aside from whether or not his father's death affected him, or is even a factor, based on what you post on here, it sounds like your household is filled with constant tension and turmoil.

You describe yourself in a way that shows some very passive aggressive tendencies, and that can't be easy for a child to decipher.

[DrFaroohk]

It's wonderful knowing that other people's comments are only to be interpreted how they meant them, but MY comments are automatically assumed to be as offensive as possible. That's a great standard.

The bickering aside, I want to get something straight.

So this is my typical situation with Jr:

Me: Jr, please do this incredibly easy thing.

Jr: NO.

Me: Jr, please, I'm asking nicely, do this incredibly easy thing please.

Jr: NO.

Me: Jr, this is the last time I'm asking nicely, please do this easy thing or you will get in trouble.

Jr: NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Me: Fine then, your call. No computer, no TV, no xbox, until this easy thing is done.

Jr: WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH OMG I HATE YOU KICK STOMP SCREAM WAAAAAAAAH!
----

Is all that really my fault? I try every step of the way to do right by him. At the end of the day, it comes down to choices HE makes. Sure maybe a 7 year old can't make an informed decision, but how much more informed can you get than "Stop shooting the cats with your nerf gun, or I will throw it over the bridge."

[Ree]

It's wonderful knowing that other people's comments are only to be interpreted how they meant them, but MY comments are automatically assumed to be as offensive as possible. That's a great standard.

How is one to interpret the word, "stupid"?
If you could point out where I called your comments "stupid" or said what you were posting was "a good way to make you look stupid", I will apologize. I merely posted a rolling eye smiley as emphasis to question why you even started this thread. You gave me a "How should I know" type answer to something I felt a parent would be aware of in an attempt to possibly help you deal with this child who is giving you so much grief.

As for your description of what dealing with this child is like, we don't have the benefit of actually being there and hearing your tone and seeing your body language when you are trying to get this child to cooperate. As a result, it's really pretty hard to offer any insight to the question you posed, "What's the difference?"

I assume your post was purely rhetorical and you really weren't looking for any kind of advice. You just wanted us to commiserate that, yes, this kid is a pain in the butt, but your other child seems like an absolute dream.

I know, in my experience, many 7 year-olds are starting to learn independence, and are always wanting to do things themselves to prove they are all grown up.
Perhaps you could put a positive spin on things and make him feel like he is such a big boy for cleaning up his mess rather than ragging on him that he needs to do it or else?

What about a rewards chart to reinforce when he gets it right with the possibility of a special reward at the end? Be very clear with him as to how it works and ask him for input on what a special reward would be.

It may be that disciplining and reminders to him about cleaning up after himself didn't start early enough and bad habits developed, and now it's too late to change? (I don't think it's ever too late at that age, but it requires a huge commitment from the parent to change their parenting style if what they are doing isn't working.)

How old was he when you first started parenting him?
What type of discipline was in place in his early years?

Have you considered giving SuperNanny a call?

[DrFaroohk]

when you gave me a "How should I know" type answer

THAT. RIGHT THERE. You chose to interpret it that way. That is not my problem. Honestly, talking like that reminds me of someone with a ginormous stick up their ass. I do hope this isn't the case.

As for your description of what dealing with this child is like, we don't have the benefit of actually being there and hearing your tone and seeing your body language when you are trying to get this child to cooperate.

I say it in a regular tone, I guess. At first. Slowly I start to get a bit agitated and forceful as I'm like "Do this or else."

I assume your post was purely rhetorical and you really weren't looking for any kind of advice. You just wanted us to commiserate that, yes, this kid is a pain in the butt, but your other child seems like an absolute dream.

Sorry, but no. Some of it was rhetorically bitching, but apparently that makes me Satan if I don't think both my kids are little angels. One thing I WAS getting at is that it seemed pretty sad that the three year old can do things and grasp things that he can't, and I'm starting to wonder if maybe he's...I dunno what the PC word is, but..."retarded"? Not the insulting kind, the medical kind.

I know, in my experience, many 7 year-olds are starting to learn independence, and are always wanting to do things themselves to prove they are all grown up.
Perhaps you could put a positive spin on things and make him feel like he is such a big boy for cleaning up his mess rather than ragging on him that he needs to do it or else?

That's one of the things we've tried. One thing that HAS helped 3 do so well is that she receives lots and lots of praise. What started our whole chore routine is I realized that 7 didn't get hardly any praise, but largely because he didn't do anything to get praise! So part of the chores was to give him an opporunity to get praised, and to feel more grown up and getting a sense of accomplishment. WEnt right over his head.

What about a rewards chart to reinforce when he gets it right with the possibility of a special reward at the end? Be very clear with him as to how it works and ask him for input on what a special reward would be.

Tried this as well, but it makes it seem like the chores are optional. And yeah, he WILL sit there, in absolute silence, with absolutely no entertainment or anything, and just cry, rather than even consider doing what amounts to 15 minutes of work.

It may be that disciplining and reminders to him about cleaning up after himself didn't start early enough and bad habits developed, and now it's too late to change? (I don't think it's ever too late at that age, but it requires a huge commitment from the parent to change their parenting style if what they are doing isn't working.)

How old was he when you first started parenting him?
What type of discipline was in place in his early years?

This helps to sum it up. The thing is...with me...I try to be understanding and whatnot, and if he's got a real problem I help him with it. But when it comes down to things like "You didn't phrase it right so it's appealing to a 7 year old" or "He's probably not listening because of something Freud said"... I just don't care. When it comes to doing as he's told, I make it real simple, and really easy to understand. He heard me, he understood the message, he made the choice to disobey. What else matters?

[Rapscallion]

THAT. RIGHT THERE. You chose to interpret it that way. That is not my problem. Honestly, talking like that reminds me of someone with a ginormous stick up their ass. I do hope this isn't the case.

I think the biggest problem is that you've managed to alienate a fair chunk of the membership through your typical posting methodology. That can easily be solved by stopping it being everyone's problem.

Rapscallion

[Ree]

Honestly, talking like that reminds me of someone with a ginormous stick up their ass.

And once again, you manage to insult, but not really, so that you stay within the site rules about personal attacks. Very smooth!

Sorry, but no. Some of it was rhetorically bitching, but apparently that makes me Satan if I don't think both my kids are little angels.

Hmmm..."THAT. RIGHT THERE. You chose to interpret it that way. That is not my problem."
This is fratching. It very clearly says that you should be prepared to have people question your words and be prepared to defend your position.
I do not think you are Satan because you are upset by the boy's behaviour. I was upset that you are on here describing your frustration at his bad behaviour when compared to your 3 year-old daughter's behaviour, yet when I offer a suggestion as to a possible psychological reason, you say something like, "I don't know. I guess. He seems OK. I'm not psychic." That is what I have the problem with, and not your comparison nor your pointing out that he is not an angel.

One thing I WAS getting at is that it seemed pretty sad that the three year old can do things and grasp things that he can't, and I'm starting to wonder if maybe he's...I dunno what the PC word is, but..."retarded"? Not the insulting kind, the medical kind.

You mean the less insulting term of "mentally challenged"?
I highly doubt it.
While I was sitting here trying to get comfortable despite that huge stick up my ass, and posting stupid comments, or comments that made me look stupid, if you would actually read what I posted, I had definite concerns about his emotional and mental state.
As I said, I don't know the child, but I doubt he's mentally challenged. He may have some learning issues or problems understanding instructions. Maybe you could talk to his school about testing.

Have you talked to his teachers?
What's he like at school?
Do they have any answers or suggestions?
Can they reinforce at school to help with the situation at home?

What started our whole chore routine is I realized that 7 didn't get hardly any praise, but largely because he didn't do anything to get praise! So part of the chores was to give him an opporunity to get praised, and to feel more grown up and getting a sense of accomplishment. WEnt right over his head.

One of the things they told us about dealing with difficult children is to catch them doing good.
Surely there are moments in this child's life when he isn't a complete and total fuck up???
Look for the good.
It may seem like something really trivial and really stupid to be praising him about, but it's still praise. It may take him a long time before there are actual results, but I have a feeling that there will be a gradual, positive effect.

Look at your own situation.

You constantly post about how nobody ever gives you any credit, and how you are constantly being torn down rather than built up. How does it make you feel? Put your son in those same shoes.
You post about how people try and get you to bend to their will, and then offer up ways that would work a lot better to get you to go along with them. Again, put your son in those shoes. Try seeing if what you think works best for you would work for him.

Tried this as well, but it makes it seem like the chores are optional.

Well then, offer the reward for getting a full chart, but add in a consequence if there are no stars after a certain amount of time.
The key is to sit and talk with him and explain it to make sure he understands the point of the chart.

Ask him about the chores and why he feels he doesn't want to do them.

But when it comes down to things like "You didn't phrase it right so it's appealing to a 7 year old" or "He's probably not listening because of something Freud said"... I just don't care.(*Emphasis mine.~R)

And that sums up your problem right there.
You don't seem to want to acknowledge that the problem could very well lie with you, or at least do any type of self-reflection to see if that could be the case. It's easier to blame the child for being wilfully disobedient, or question whether he's "retarded" than to entertain any thought that you are not being an effective parent.

He heard me, he understood the message, he made the choice to disobey. What else matters?

How do you know he heard and understood? If he has something a little haywire in his brain that means he isn't grasping the message or instructions, but you aren't willing to find out if that's the case, then how can you just assume he is being deliberately disobedient?
Do you make him repeat what you have asked of him to make sure he's hearing it, and to reinforce in him that there is a very clear task?
With some children, that can actually help.

Again, it does sound like this child has some bad behaviour going on, but, based on what you have posted regarding your own feelings and attitude, I think you need to look at parenting him quite differently than you do for the 3 year-old child.
They are not the same person, and to expect that what works with one will work with the other is not realistic.

[Peppergirl]

C'mon, man. I've stayed out of this so far, but (and I mean this from the bottom of my black heart), try to listen to what Ree has to say here. She really is trying to help. She's got a lot of experience with kids.

Try to not be so defensive and actually LISTEN. Put all your personal feelings aside and just pay attention. If you truly want advice on how to help your kid, just do it.

[Andara Bledin]

THAT. RIGHT THERE. You chose to interpret it that way. That is not my problem. Honestly, talking like that reminds me of someone with a ginormous stick up their ass. I do hope this isn't the case.

Really? REALLY?!?

I don't really know if he's properly dealt with his dad's death or not. I mean, he cried, he was sad a while, but honestly...I don't think he had such an awesome relationship with his dad that he's extremely broken up about it. He'd see his dad every couple of weekends, sometimes every weekend, sometimes not for 6 months if he was in jail or the hospital. Even when he did see him, it was more like "Sit in front of the TV while I do other stuff".

So he was upset for about a week and he seems to have moved on.

Well I'm not psychic. How do I know if he's got some deep locked away piece of pain he's acting out? I know he's talked about it, he's cried, he's been sad and he seems to be ok now. Also when he DOES Mention his dad it's not like "This is just like me and daddy used...to...dooooooooooooooooooooooo oh my god I'm in so much pain!"

But I'm not psychic.

This child lives with you and depends on you, and as far as I can see, other than making him do things and punishing him when he's bad, I can't tell that you even interact with him.

Not once have you mentioned ever asking him how he's doing with the whole death of his dad thing. As if a 7-year-old who just lost his father is supposed to be the mature one in this equation.

And that sums up your problem right there.
You don't seem to want to acknowledge that the problem could very well lie with you, or at least do any type of self-reflection to see if that could be the case. It's easier to blame the child for being wilfully disobedient, or question whether he's "retarded" than to entertain any thought that you are not being an effective parent.

Well, based on his posts, none of his problems lie with him; they're all created by outside agents over whom he has no control whatsoever, and he's forced to just ride with the tides as he struggles to be the voice of reason and hold everybody else's lives together because they're too stupid to do it themselves.

^-.-^