Malicious Food Tampering vs. Stupid Food Thieves

[TheHuckster]

It's just that you and others had mentioned loosing their jobs and criminal liability and I wanted clarification as to what I consider innocent food and what you would consider a sackable offence should someone die taking food that is not theirs.

Some would say me bringing in a meal with allergens that X is allergic to is me trapping the food as X is known to take food, where as I say BS had the food not gone I would be eating it.
It's too easy to skew the 1st paragraph into the 2nd.

If X is a habitual thief who had been called out on their stealing before, and presumably people would also point out how stupidly risky it is for one to do that if they have a food allergy, then IMO, it shouldn't prevent you from bringing whatever you want, if you really want to eat it.

The scenarios I've been talking about are where you notice X is stealing food, don't say anything about it, and decide to bring peanut butter into your next meal knowing that X will strike again. THAT's where I draw the line.

The big thing to get out of this is I have this principle where whenever I make decisions in life, I try my damndest not to kill anybody, even if they steal my lunch. If I find out someone who's allergic to peanuts steals my lunch and I want to eat peanut butter, I'm going to call them out on it and tell them that I sometimes like to eat peanut butter and they really need to be careful. Hopefully they'll heed my warning and I keep my streak of 0 deaths per day going. If they don't heed it, then I'll still feel better knowing I did warn them.

[Andara Bledin]

Where's the line, who draws the line and what side of it am I on?

The line is if you change the food you bring for yourself to potentially punish someone else.

If you don't, then stop worrying about it and get on with your life.

That said, just being innocent is not necessarily enough to protect you from accusations and recriminations. You have to also appear innocent. So, if you threaten to bring in something nasty, but never do, but the thief gets sick after having eating your food, you're possibly looking at charges and sacking. If you are known to go off regularly about someone stealing your food and the thief gets sick after having eaten your food, you're still looking at the possibility of charges being levied.

If you want to be absolutely beyond accusations, get a bloody locking lunchbox/bag and avoid the entire drama fest. Because life isn't fair and it's a trivial step to avoid being a repeat victim. Otherwise, if you've had your lunch stolen before and you do nothing to change your behavior and expect the outcome to change, then you're operating outside the bounds of reality as we know it.

[protege]

gingertea: i'm going to bring the things i personally want to eat. if someone steals my shit, and happens to be allergic to the thing i wanted to eat, that's not my fault because it was my intent to eat it myself.

That's how I see it too. I bring in what I want, and my lunch is always in a distinctive Fiat-branded canvas bag. If it's not in that, it's in a black Norfolk Southern bag...that has trains on it. Considering that I'm the only car/train guy i the office, it's pretty damn obvious that it's mine.

Every now and then, I bring in my awesome tacos. The bag contains everything--onions, peppers (including jalapenos), spices, cheese, beans, and other items. My peppers aren't hot, but if you're not used to them, they'll still kick your ass...and possibly make you shit fire

Up until now, my lunch gets left alone. However, if someone--like Sarah (who has lifted food items from the 'fridge in the past)--decides to eat them, all bets are off. I've heard her mention that she can't handle spicy items. If she decides to steal my tacos, and ends up shitting all over the office, I don't have any sympathy. If she's that stupid, she deserves it.

It's not like they're "bait," or I've "tampered" with them. I've brought them to work many times, and have at least one photo of me (taken on my birthday for some reason) eating them. So, it's not like I haven't brought them in before.

[Mr Hero]

The scenarios I've been talking about are where you notice X is stealing food, don't say anything about it, and decide to bring peanut butter into your next meal knowing that X will strike again. THAT's where I draw the line.

If I understand this correctly, you bring up a scenario I hadn't thought of. Are you saying food thief is observed in the act? If so, I agree. If I have definitive proof, I'll go and say something. I might even snap a picture on my phone and show it to someone.

If all I have is circumstantial evidence, I don't feel it's a good idea to confront the food thief directly because I could be wrong. If the alleged thief has an allergy to something I find delicious, I would deliberately change my menu for a few days and try to make the allergen conspicuous. There's no mistaking a PBJ sandwich.

And one post seemed to imply that I currently am dealing with a food thief. I am not. I work alone so my food is safe.

[TheHuckster]

If I understand this correctly, you bring up a scenario I hadn't thought of.

The scenario is pretty much what you put in the OP (emphasis mine):

But let's say a known food thief is allergic to peanuts. You are not. You bring your food to work and you purposely include an ingredient with peanuts to protect your food.

If all I have is circumstantial evidence, I don't feel it's a good idea to confront the food thief directly because I could be wrong. If the alleged thief has an allergy to something I find delicious, I would deliberately change my menu for a few days and try to make the allergen conspicuous. There's no mistaking a PBJ sandwich.

And then what? If the thief doesn't eat those ones, you've somehow got proof now? That's just more circumstantial evidence. What if the real food thief just doesn't like PB&J or there's another thief who's allergic and just didn't make it known to you?

I just think there are far better and less error-prone ways to deal with this than what you're proposing here... you can get a locking box, or even get a very distinguishable lunch box and ask people to do you a favor and report anyone who touches your box. Sooner or later they're going to get caught.

[Mr Hero]

And then what? If the thief doesn't eat those ones, you've somehow got proof now? That's just more circumstantial evidence. What if the real food thief just doesn't like PB&J or there's another thief who's allergic and just didn't make it known to you?

The goal isn't to prove 100% who the thief is. It's to be able to enjoy the food you brought. I'd say mission accomplished.

[Andara Bledin]

Well, until you bring something that isn't PB&J.

All you've really accomplished by that is a delaying tactic. You haven't actually solved anything.

[Ginger Tea]

It's the getting caught in the act part that can be tricky.

Found taking your food, 100% busted.
You see them taking a banana out of the fridge, well I didn't have a banana in my lunch bag, I don't know whos it is so I assume its theirs.

Someone later complains that their banana has gone, well was it the only banana in the fridge, did I see more than one person eating a banana other than the one I saw taking one from the fridge?

Now say for example, someone brought a salad in a hello kitty Tupperware box, box is gone, I didn't see anyone take said box, but I did see someone eating a similar salad in clear Tupperware.
Did that person just so happen to have a nigh on identical meal, or did they dump the contents and ditch the as yet unfound hello kitty box?

If I see someone taking my food, best case scenario they are frog marched to the higher ups to explain themselves, worst case they do their explaining between spitting out blood and broken teeth.
But if I see someone taking food that isn't mine, I assume its theirs, unless I see someone walk off with Hello Kitty Tupperware and I know there is only one in the office.

[Andara Bledin]

... worst case they do their explaining between spitting out blood and broken teeth.

This is not healthy.

[HYHYBT]

If you know someone’s been stealing your food, which is the entire premise of the thread, then you’re not in the category of “without the expectation that it’s going to be stolen.” Your intent, therefore, unless you’re just totally clueless, includes BOTH “if this is stolen, the thief will eat it” AND “if this is not stolen, I will eat it.”

So far no one has convinced me that I could be in the wrong, unless I prove intent by saying "I'm gonna get that fucker." or something else incriminating.

Logically, this is the same as saying “it’s only wrong if I get caught.” Which has never been true.

The big thing to get out of this is I have this principle where whenever I make decisions in life, I try my damndest not to kill anybody, even if they steal my lunch. If I find out someone who's allergic to peanuts steals my lunch and I want to eat peanut butter, I'm going to call them out on it and tell them that I sometimes like to eat peanut butter and they really need to be careful. Hopefully they'll heed my warning and I keep my streak of 0 deaths per day going. If they don't heed it, then I'll still feel better knowing I did warn them.

Amen.

[wolfie]

But if I did have a problem with a food stealer, I wouldn't sabotage, nor will I label any more than just my name on my food. I'd just start complaining to HR and in general, and get louder and louder each time it happens, until something is done about it.

Problem is HR is there to protect the company. If the easiest way to stop the complaints about food theft is to get rid of the complainer (identity known) rather than the thief (either identity not known, or known but "untouchable" - e.g. the boss), then the complainer is SOL.

The point people are making is if your food is being stolen regularly, and if you know who is doing it, and if you know that person happens to have an allergy of some kind, then it is wrong to plant that allergen as sort of a trap if and when they steal food again. That's it. If you are choosing to do something with the intent of causing harm to someone else, either actively or passively, it's wrong and could even be criminal.

So long as an ingredient isn't banned by company policy (e.g. "This is a peanut-free workplace"), and it's something I want to eat, it's fair game for me to put in my lunch. Who knows, maybe tomorrow is the day I'll get to enjoy the lunch I paid for. The lunch thief can EASILY avoid allergy issues by not stealing a lunch belonging to someone who doesn't have their allergies.

If you intended to eat it, then you did not intend to get someone else sick. That's what intent means.

Look, here's the deal: If someone brings an allergen-laden lunch to work, labels it with their name (or brings some kind of obviously identifiable box/bag), without the expectation that it's going to be stolen by an allergic culprit, who then gets an allergy attack then clearly it's the thief who is to blame.

Exactly - and regardless of how often someone's lunch is stolen, unless an ingredient is on a banned list, it's their right to put anything they damn well want to eat in their lunch.

[Ginger Tea]

If you know someone’s been stealing your food, which is the entire premise of the thread, then you’re not in the category of “without the expectation that it’s going to be stolen.” Your intent, therefore, unless you’re just totally clueless, includes BOTH “if this is stolen, the thief will eat it” AND “if this is not stolen, I will eat it.”

Although the OP stated that their hypothetical thief was known and had allergens, in most if not all my examples I had stated that its not me every day, food goes every day, but not always mine.

If it was me each and every day I would be complaining to higher ups daily and as posted, it would probably be a case of fire the noisy guy (me) than look into it. Or I would go out for lunch and if back late, I would just say "well if you didn't do fuck all about my food going missing every day I wouldn't have to leave the office to get food on my lunch break." which again gets me listed as a problem worker and TBH it would only be a me and me only who experiences food theft and shit all being done about it for quite some time where we would get the worst case scenario I last posted about should I catch someone in the act.

Also my last post I pointed out that unless I catch them in the act taking my food, all I know for sure is it's going missing, maybe over time speculations might form, but not caught red handed = no proof. Hell even if someone says to a supervisor "I saw X take Ginger's lunch box." they might not do anything about it, I've had many instances where I inform higher ups about coworkers doing something they shouldn't and being told nothing is to be done because basically they didn't see it so it's my word against theirs.

Sure they could tell me that X took my box, but it's 2nd hand information, hell it could be a misdirection and that it was Y who took the box and is lying about X's actions.

Granted X will be on my radar after that, but because Y said so isn't strong enough for me to confront them other than a passing comment that my lunch got stolen. And no I don't mean "Boy I hope it doesn't happen again because incrimination incrimination incrimination." no it would be a casual bitch about it to a coworker just the same kind I would have if X wasn't a suspect.



I don't go up to people taking a bag that is obviously not mine and say "What's the name on that?" they don't have my food and I sure as hell am not going to be the lunch police making sure Dave hasn't picked up Sue's bag unless I know for sure that it is Sue's for example the Hello Kitty Tupperware.

[Jetfire]

The other option as well is to just make it harder to steal your food. Get a lunch container that you can lock up would be the simplest.

Another idea (which I don't know if it exists but it should; maybe Think Geek has something like this?). Get a screamer lunch box. If anyone opens it but you, it emits a loud annoying noise. You carry a key fob or something that will disable it if its close enough.

[Andara Bledin]

If you have your food stolen regularly or irregularly, you have three options:

1) Do nothing, suck it up and let them walk all over you.
This is apparently what too many people do because they've got no ability to deal with confrontation.

2) Do something to 'get back at' or 'punish' anyone who might choose to steal your lunch.
This is a shitty thing to do, and you're essentially become nearly as bad as the other person. You have a brain, use it to stop being a victim, not to victimize someone else.

3) Take a step to proactively protect your lunch from theft and stop acting like you're helpless, because you're not.
It took me literally 10 seconds (and most of that was waiting for the results to load) to find this page on how to crate a simple alarm for a lunch box with a simple 'key' to keep it from sounding for more than a second when you open your box.

If you can't figure out how to safeguard your own lunch without booby-trapping your food, then you're failing at civilized life as much as the person stealing other people's food.

I really don't understand what's gone wrong with people who think that retaliation and violence are even remotely acceptable responses to petty theft that doesn't, itself, lead to a potential health crisis.

For those of you who require food at given times, take it up with HR and let them know that if your food is not available when it's time to eat it that there is the potential for there to be a medical crisis and ask them for advice on how to work with them to ensure that no such crisis happens. Come to them as allies instead of adversaries, and you'll be much better off.

[Teysa]

Frankly this hypothetical food thief must be a special kind of stupid. If someone has life threatening food allergies why on earth would they steal food when they had no idea how it was prepared or exactly what's in it? That, to me, is just asking for trouble.