Born in the US but denied citizenship?

[linguist]

They could easily expand the definition of military service that anybody could serve, even if all they do is mop floors all day.
.

and what of those who are disabled to the point that they are unfit for any sort of physical or mental activity?

[Red Panda]

Then they would just stay in the probational stage and recieve benefits under the citizenship rights of their parents or gaurdians

[jackfaire]

If either one of you had read Greenday's posts you would have seen that he posted military service as being an alternative to the test. .

It already is an option actually I served with a couple of people that were becoming citizens this way.

[AdminAssistant]

I just don't get it. What happened to our country's compassion? In the past, we have taken in millions of refugees and immigrants from other countries. But now, it's "no vacancy"? We are so concerned about our precious tax dollars that we won't let in a child because of the legal status of the parents? Ridiculous. If a couple comes to America to give birth, why not say to them at the hospital, "Okay, this child is technically a United States citizen, so now we will get you started on the path to becoming citizens. That way you can all live here together. If you don't want to do that, we will escort you back to the border." But I guess compassion and common sense don't mix with nationalism and xenophobia.

[jackfaire]

"Okay, this child is technically a United States citizen, so now we will get you started on the path to becoming citizens. That way you can all live here together. If you don't want to do that, we will escort you back to the border."

I know legal immigrants who are pissed off when that does happen. All the people that take the proper steps to get here and work their butts off are being told, "Yeah you did everything right but she had a baby so we are pushing her to the front of the line and screw you"

If a person happens to have a baby here hey whatever but people are having babies here just to use it to get themselves citizenship it's like moms who pop out kids everytime they need a welfare check.

Not all of them are doing this but some are and I don't give a shit about nationalism or xenophobia I say it's downright unfair to the people who work their asses off to accomplish something.

What if you after all your years of work and schooling to get your degree end up working next to someone whom they said, "Oh you have a medical condition? Well hell here is a PhD"

[Red Panda]

I just don't get it. What happened to our country's compassion? In the past, we have taken in millions of refugees and immigrants from other countries. But now, it's "no vacancy"? We are so concerned about our precious tax dollars that we won't let in a child because of the legal status of the parents? Ridiculous. If a couple comes to America to give birth, why not say to them at the hospital, "Okay, this child is technically a United States citizen, so now we will get you started on the path to becoming citizens. That way you can all live here together. If you don't want to do that, we will escort you back to the border." But I guess compassion and common sense don't mix with nationalism and xenophobia.

Lets say you are a landlord and want to rent an apt. A person answers your ad. They have a good job, are well educated, give you glowing references from previous landlords and have a clean criminal history.

But wait! A crackhead broke into the empty apartment and started living there. Better not kick him out right? You have to have compassion even though he is a criminal, deals drugs, and pooped in the living room but if you kick him out then you are a big meanie. Better hope he decides to send you rent checks.

[Rapscallion]

Theoretical: I was born in US but under your system I haven't yet earned my citizenship. Let's say I couldn't serve in the military and flunked the citizenship test. So I don't ever earn my right to become a citizen. What would happen to me?

I'd suggest watching Starship Troopers to find out one alternative. That's what this whole argument reminds me of - you gain citizenship by serving in the military.

Rapscallion

[AdminAssistant]

What if you after all your years of work and schooling to get your degree end up working next to someone whom they said, "Oh you have a medical condition? Well hell here is a PhD"

I didn't say you would just hand them citizenship. I said that you would give them two alternatives: begin the process of citizenship or go back to whence they came with the child.

But wait! A crackhead broke into the empty apartment and started living there. Better not kick him out right? You have to have compassion even though he is a criminal, deals drugs, and pooped in the living room but if you kick him out then you are a big meanie. Better hope he decides to send you rent checks.

You're assuming that all illegal immigrants are violent drug dealers, which is not true. Some are, but many aren't. Of course, it's much easier to swallow hateful policies if we rationalize it, "Oh, they're all a bunch of druggies and crooks."

Also, the USA is not private property.

[jackfaire]

I didn't say you would just hand them citizenship. I said that you would give them two alternatives: begin the process of citizenship or go back to whence they came with the child.

So give them a green card. Step one is they must live here legally for 5 years before they can apply for citizenship.

Then what if they do something in that time that results in them getting deported.

We now have a 5 year old child that either has to be taken from his mom or is being taken from the only home he knows and sent back to a country he has never even seen.

[Hobbs]

I'd suggest watching Starship Troopers to find out one alternative. That's what this whole argument reminds me of - you gain citizenship by serving in the military.

Rapscallion

Actually Raps, it's much different. People can be semi-citizens in that "universe" but are referred to as civilians. As civilians, they seem to hold the rights and privileges that we as citizens hold, save one, the participation in the government. The only ones who can participate are citizens, but as the movie says, there are other ways to gain citizenship as well.

[jackfaire]

I'd suggest watching Starship Troopers to find out one alternative. That's what this whole argument reminds me of - you gain citizenship by serving in the military.

Rapscallion

I would suggest reading any of Heinlein's books he had some interesting ideas of how to do things and he used them in his stories.

[Red Panda]

You're assuming that all illegal immigrants are violent drug dealers, which is not true. Some are, but many aren't. Of course, it's much easier to swallow hateful policies if we rationalize it, "Oh, they're all a bunch of druggies and crooks."

Also, the USA is not private property.

I assume they are all criminals which they are. I also assume they cannot legally come to America which if they would if they could.


And how is America not private property? Certainly isn't shared with any other nation. Its the property of America. America has the right to choose who lives in the country and should excersize it in a stronger fashion.

[Hobbs]

Private property is property owned by a citizen. The country is owned by municipal, state and federal government and is therefore public property.

Also, you know what happens when you assume...

[HYHYBT]

Deporting the parents and putting the children into foster care? Perhaps necessary. But destroying records to ensure that they can *never* be reunited is cruelty without any purpose except to *be* cruel.

We ought to be better than that.

[Red Panda]

Its so the illegals know that if they have a child in America they run the risk of never seeing it again. Make being an illegal even more undesirable