Born in the US but denied citizenship?

[Red Panda]

Hmm, worked for the folk aboard the Mayflower...

Also, all those convicts we sent to Australia, and ...

Rapscallion

So we need to operate by standards set sevaral hundred years ago? Things have changed since then

[Rapscallion]

Dunno, seems to work for religious groups. However, the point was mostly made for amusement value.

Rapscallion

[jackfaire]

5. Take a written citizenship test which covers American history, geography, politics, and by extention, literacy. Take the test in english. Pass, even though the average natural American would fail horribly.

Yes I would but I haven't been in school in at least 5 years. I did however pass all of those tests when I was given them in elementary, junior high, and high school.

People act like we have never had to learn and test on the same things simply because as adults we don't remember every single fact. Yet no one ever gets on people because they can't still do their multiplication tables.

[ExiledV20]

But the states hand out the birth certificates.

That is irrelevant. Should AZ decide in statute who does and does not get citizenship when born in the USA on the basis of their parent's citizenship, they are infringing the power of the federal government. A state doesn't get to make the decisions about who qualifies for jus soli. That's determined by federal law in accordance with 8 U.S.C. § 1401. Supremacy Clause of the Constitution kills this bill right out of the water.

People have already addressed that if you failed the test you would continue to live in America but with fewer rights

Frankly, the whole Starship Troopers thing is impractical as a concept and probably illegal. The South tried a version of it throughout most of latter 19th and early/middle 20th centuries. It was called Jim Crow. They were 'separate but equal', which is essentially what's being proposed here with two classes of citizenship.

[Red Panda]

Jim Crow denied citizens rights. The Starship Troopers thing would simply have differant degress of citizenship, none of which are race based

[ExiledV20]

Jim Crow denied citizens rights. The Starship Troopers thing would simply have differant degress of citizenship, none of which are race based

No, before the Civil Rights Act of 1964 Jim Crow did NOT deny citizens rights. The SCOTUS decision of <i>Plessy v. Ferguson</i> (1896) said so. And what SCOTUS says is the interpretation of 'separate but equal' is the law until legislated otherwise. Blacks under Jim Crow were simply considered to be a separate kind of citizen, separate but equal.

As per Justice William Rehnquist at the time: "I realize that it is an unpopular and unhumanitarian position, for which I have been excoriated by 'liberal' colleagues but I think Plessy v. Ferguson was right and should be reaffirmed. To the argument… that a majority may not deprive a minority of its constitutional right, the answer must be made that while this is sound in theory, in the long run it is the majority who will determine what the constitutional rights of the minority are." That matches directly up with the idea of citizen classes...

[Greenday]

Except Jim Crow laws were still a load of crap and were NOT equal. Under the circumstances I provided, and in Starship Troopers, everyone has an equal chance under those rules.

Starship Troopers = Everyone can earn full citizenship.
Jim Crow = Labeled equal, not treated equal.

Quite a difference.

[Hyena Dandy]

Look, whether I like it or not is irrelevant. If a law is unconstitutional, it shouldn't be passed. End of story.

[Red Panda]

The Starship Troopers proposal would require a change in the constitution so it would be legal after the changes happen

[Wingates_Hellsing]

The Starship Troopers proposal would require a change in the constitution so it would be legal after the changes happen

Would have to amend the constitution first, otherwise the law would still be illegal and invalid.

[tropicsgoddess]

That's going too far in terms of illegal immigration considering that it's unconstitutional. Arizona isn't the only state that is rampant with illegal immigrants: how about Texas and Florida too? I live in South Florida and instead of it being Mexicans as the main ethnicity of illegal immigrants, we have Cubans and Haitians. If they want to clamp down on illegal immigration, how about this for size. More guards at the borders, patch up any areas that illegals can go through the border to the US as well as enacting and enforcing strict checkpoint requirements i.e. documentation that the person(s) wishing to immigrate have the proper documentation on hand at the checkpoint or leave.

[AdminAssistant]

The problem with that, tropicsgoddess, is the number who get here through legal channels (like a visa) and then just stay when the visa expires.

[Red Panda]

The trouble with anybody who tries to solve illegal immigration is that they get called racist by idiots and hispanics.

[Hobbs]

The trouble with anybody who tries to solve illegal immigration is that they get called racist by idiots and hispanics.

I'm Hispanic. I'm slightly offended by that, too. I don't think solving the problem is racist; but policies that are inherently racist (such as profiling) is racist. There's no denying that.

[crashhelmet]

The trouble with anybody who tries to solve illegal immigration is that they get called racist by idiots and hispanics.

That's because almost all proposed resolutions for Illegal Immigration promote racism or are heavily fought for by racists with racist agendas.

CH