The Bushes

[ditchdj]

Hey I got another major bitch-rant about people that support giving up freedom and liberty for safety and security......

With more and more law enforcement agencies and the government instituting their Nazio-Gestapo-like tactics on cracking down on people not wearing their seatbelts and people buying "too many" things of cold medicine, how come crime is NOT eliminated????? Why is shit STILL getting stolen out of my yard??? I mean, if we're gonna turn this country into one big prison-run police state then why arent things getting better???

[rahmota]

Because the cops are too busy being nannies chasing down people who arnt wearing their seatbelts, driving without front plates (a big nono in ohio which for some odd reason still requires a front and rear plate) or otherwise doing stuff that deals with whatever major PR program the politicos have on their table right now. Crackdowns on crime generally only do minor things. To eliminate or truely reduce crime one has to go to the root of the problems and change the mindset of the society but that is a subject for another thread.

[ditchdj]

Someone on another board pointed out that every single war that we've declared on, terrorism, drugs, crime, has all failed miserably. Maybe it's time for a different approach for a change.

[Luna]

The only good thing I can say about Bush is that at least he can't run again.

I think what pisses me off most about him is that if you dare to disagree with him, you're branded "unpatriotic", a traitor, or a terrorist. Sounds like a classic case of "pot, kettle" to me.

Exactly. Why is that? I don't kill people, violate treaties, start wars based on lies...why am I branded as a liberal demon when all I want is peace and $$ to fund oUR poor and OUR country. That sounds patriotic to me.

[rahmota]

Luna: because to say anything about the poor and downtrodden in america needing help would be to accept that this country has a problem and is not the great and wonderful utopia that many righties want to make this country out to be. Don't you know in their minds anyone who doesnt have a job just doesnt want to work and wants to be on welfare or living hand to mouth in underpaid wageslave jobs.

Besides the sound of sabers rattling has such a pleasant ring doesn't it?

[TNT]

One of the problems in the US is that political labels tell us very little... you can never be sure which party is going to stand for what ideals at any given time.

Consider the 1960s, during the War on Communism. In 1961, the Republican Dwight Eisenhower said this:

"In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist.

We must never let the weight of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. We should take nothing for granted. Only an alert and knowledgeable citizenry can compel the proper meshing of the huge industrial and military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals so that security and liberty may prosper together."

Meanwhile, the Kennedy-Johnson-Humphrey wing of the Democratic party brought us Vietnam and all that came with it.

[rahmota]

Republican and Democrat have drifted so far from whatever they where supposed to be about and mingled into the business as usual politics that they should just be called Republocrats now.

[Luna]

One of the top 100 reasons why I hate the Bush:

G.W. Bush (R), as Governor of Texas. Interviewed on ABC's Good Morning America, 1999-JUN-24 by Peggy Wehmeyer. Bush's comment was in response to the Wiccan soldiers at a military camp in Texas being given the right to meet together on base -- the same right as has always been given to Christians, Jews, Muslims, etc.

"I don't think witchcraft is a religion. I would hope the military officials would take a second look at the decision they made."

and then goes on to say:

George W. Bush, President:

Address to a joint session of Congress, 2001-SEP-20.

"I ask you to uphold the values of America and remember why so many have come here. We're in a fight for our principles, and our first responsibility is to live by them. No one should be singled out for unfair treatment or unkind words because of their ethnic background or religious faith."

At a news conference on 2005-APR-28:

"Role of religion in our society? I view religion as a personal matter. I think a person ought to be judged on how he or she lives his life or lives her life. And that's how I've tried to live my life: through example. Faith plays an important part in my life individually. But I don't ascribe a person's opposing my nominations to an issue of faith….The great thing about America is that you should be allowed to worship any way you want. And if you choose not to worship, you're equally as patriotic as somebody who does worship. And if you choose to worship, you're equally American if you're a Christian, a Jew, a Muslim."

WTF??? Can anyone say two-faced lair? I can.

[Myra]

Anybody catch the Presidential speech last night? Or at least read the highlights? He wants to send in 20,000 MORE troops. That's 20,000 more human lives.

In an article in the new Newsweek, Obama said he doesn't think Congress will block the funding for the troops because they basically don't want to make waves this early after they were all elected. We're talking about HUMAN LIVES! Men and women! Making waves indeed!

We've lost nearly 3,000 last I heard. It's been five years since 9/11 and Bin Laden is still out there. How about focusing on that a bit, eh?

I cannot agree with the statement that "the troops signed up for this...it's a volunteer situation..." Because I believe that we have a RESPONSIBILITY to not send these men and women into a bad situation. I believe that Saddam was a monster. But the monster I was worried about is the one who orchestrated the biggest attack on OUR SOIL since Pearl Harbor. Perhaps I am crazy, I do not know. I just don't want him around to think up and try another one.

This I do know: every time President G.W. Bush opens his mouth, my blood pressure goes up.

[rahmota]

Well catching Osama would actually kinda be bad for Bush & the right wingers. I mean an Osama running loose in the wild is like the perfect boogyman to rattle in front of congress to get more money, troops and concessions passed.
Osama the gift that keep on giving.

[Myra]

Well catching Osama would actually kinda be bad for Bush & the right wingers. I mean an Osama running loose in the wild is like the perfect boogyman to rattle in front of congress to get more money, troops and concessions passed.
Osama the gift that keep on giving.

I could see this if this was actually what Bush and his ilk were doing. Not the "We need money to fight for the freedom of the Iraqi people..." song and dance we've been hearing.

First it was to fight terrorists. Then it was to get Saddam because he has WMD's. Then it was okay, he doesn't have WMD's, but he's a monster so we need to get him out for the Iraqis so they can have democracy too.

It's just become a giant mess.

[MadMike]

Anybody catch the Presidential speech last night? Or at least read the highlights? He wants to send in 20,000 MORE troops. That's 20,000 more human lives.

I don't watch that stuff, especially since he became president. I'm afraid if I do, I'll either throw the TV, or I'll throw something heavy at the TV. I was furious enough when I read the paper, but at least I can't hurt anything by throwing a newspaper.

My first reaction was, "Hasn't he gotten enough people killed?"

What's the problem, wouldn't his daddy get him a set of army men when he was little? Is that why he insists on playing childish games with real army men today?

They say you shouldn't wish someone dead, but I sincerely wish he'd just die already.

[rahmota]

Myra: Yeah I know what you mean. This is an incredible mess. In the begining after 9/11 it was all about Osama, then saddam, now its save the iraqi people, then Osama when there's slow news about Iraq. JUst a disgusting mess. Whats even more sad is I saw a political pundit who was saying that we needed to keep the troops there until we won a decisive victory otherwise it would make America look weak like we where running away from something.

I know some people are claiming this is the modern Vietnam but I dont know. This in many ways is a lot messier than that. And with the addition of the various religious elements instead of just nationalism that throws a whole nuther level of complexity into it. But considering how Bush II missed out on the whole Vietnam thing by getting to stay stateside how would we expect him to be able to figure this out?

[ditchdj]

Another lame excuse I hear about supporting Bush and his war policies is that "Well we should ALWAYS support the President, no matter who it is". Yeah well was it right for the German people to support Hitler. After all, they were merely just supporting THEIR "President". Never mind what HE was responsible for, right???

Another idiotic excuse I hear about supporting Bush is, "Well look at who's running against him??? My response is, "Well look at who we got running the country right NOW!"

[AFPheonix]

What scares me even more is that he STILL hasn't learned from this quagmire he's gotten us all into. It's projected that he'll take military action against Iran before he leaves.


Hello? Small army, already shot to hell, can't really take on yet another endless war, dumbass.