US Credit Rating Downgraded

[Gravekeeper]

Call it a science if you like, but it's far from exact, and not all economists agree.

Then you go with the majority. Who did, btw, agree the best approach was a mix of spending cuts and tax increases. The point is when you're dealing with something this complex, you ask a god damn expert. You find the smartest people you can that specialize in the field. You don't argue over it like children and cling on to the approach that suits you ideologically rather than the one that will actually help the situation.

Which is the biggest problem with the US's entire political system right now. The Tea Party Republicans basically held the country hostage over the debt ceiling increase. Purely for ideology. Doesn't matter if their ideology would destroy the country. Sticking to their ideology and sticking it to the other team is more important.

Its like refusing to let a mechanic fix your flat tire because you hate your neighbour and he uses tires.

so yes he "renewed" them but under the threat of blackmail of other vulernable US people who were hurt in the meltdown.

Yeah, kind of a reoccurring theme. Say no to everything then blame someone else when the country burns down. >.>

[mikoyan29]

If nothing else though, congress and specifically Republicans, have proven that they do not give a shit about Americans themselves in any capacity. Just corporate donations and lobbyists.

What's funny is that the Republicans say that they support the small businessman but many of their policies are pretty harmful to the small businesses. Many of the tax cuts and loopholes are only beneficial to the multi-nationals.

Yep, blame the Republicans, who only recently came into having a majority in Congress. Our country's spending issues have been going on a long time--since the 1930s in fact. At the time...debt was 300% of our GDP!

Yeah, I must have been imagining those Republican majorities from 1994 to 2008. And I really must have been imagining when they had control of the Presidency, Senate and the House.

[Andara Bledin]

What's funny is that the Republicans say that they support the small businessman but many of their policies are pretty harmful to the small businesses. Many of the tax cuts and loopholes are only beneficial to the multi-nationals.

Both sides want to make the richer rich and push everyone who isn't rich further down, 'cause the only way to get richer is to take it away from those in the middle who still have something to take away. It's just that one side wants to screw us while they're screwing us.

Why anyone still buys into their bullshit baffles me. Unfortunately, all evidence suggests that most people really are that stupid.

^-.-^

[protege]

Yeah, I must have been imagining those Republican majorities from 1994 to 2008. And I really must have been imagining when they had control of the Presidency, Senate and the House.

What I was hinting at, is before the Republicans took over in the *last* election...the Democrats had the majority. A slim majority, but instead of trying to control costs...they foisted Obamacare on us. Even so, there's plenty of blame to go around for this mess. The voters, for wanting something for nothing, Obama, for attempting to cater to those whims, and the members of Congress...simply because they're too busy trying to screw each other over...and to keep their cushy jobs.

[mikoyan29]

What I was hinting at, is before the Republicans took over in the *last* election...the Democrats had the majority. A slim majority, but instead of trying to control costs...they foisted Obamacare on us. Even so, there's plenty of blame to go around for this mess. The voters, for wanting something for nothing, Obama, for attempting to cater to those whims, and the members of Congress...simply because they're too busy trying to screw each other over...and to keep their cushy jobs.

So the 6 or so years where there was a Republican majority *AND* a Republican President don't count for jack? I seem to recall that Mr. Bush inherited a small surplus and in his 8 years turned it into ballooning deficits. Where were the Tea Assholes then? Oh yeah, Bush is white and a Republican, they were still trying to figure where Clinton's dick was.

[Gravekeeper]

What I was hinting at, is before the Republicans took over in the *last* election...the Democrats had the majority. A slim majority, but instead of trying to control costs...they foisted Obamacare on us.

Honestly a majority means nothing right now. Hence the SUPA majority bullshit. It's filibuster, filibuster, filibuster, filibuster. Say no to EVERYTHING, then blame it on the other guy when the country burns down. Hell, how many empty positions are there in government right now because Obama can't get appointees past the childishness? There was 177 last summer, and still well over a 100 left at the start of this year. You have agencies trying to operate without any leadership because those positions are still empty.

As for "Obamacare", the very fact you're calling it Obamacare should say everything you need to know about the political enviroment right now. Obamacare barely made it through as a shadow of its former self, and I don't recall it increasing any costs. Nor is it projected to increase any costs. Plus the majority of it has not even come into effect yet. So you can't really hang anything on it.

Even so, there's plenty of blame to go around for this mess. The voters, for wanting something for nothing, Obama, for attempting to cater to those whims, .

Define "Something for nothing".

[jackfaire]

Plus the thing about things like "Obamacare" Okay so you have a different idea of what should be done fair enough welcome to adulthood. That's how it is how it's supposed to be the whole idea behind our political system is "I like this guy's ideas I vote for this guy then he gets to make votes and push ideas that if I don't like I am voting for someone else in four years."

But holding the whole country ransom? Pointing a metaphorical gun at someone's head, "You can either take our deal that will hurt the people you care about or we will let the country burn and they will blame you."

That's one of the funny things I notice it's never Congresses fault. Ever. Good or Bad. If congress does something awesome like a last minute shot that wins the game even though they aren't wolfing out then everyone will grab the President, no matter who it is, throw him on their shoulders and cheer about how awesome he is.

If Congress runs a touchdown into the other team's end zone it will be the President that people are waiting in the parking lot to beat down.

The problem is that it makes it so easy for politicans that don't have career limits to build a career on hiding behind an ever changing office.

"Oh yeah well uhm my constituents I wanted to vote for that measure but the PRESIDENT wanted us to add something that I didn't like and it's not like he can only make suggestions and we had to add cuz you know he is the President and my boss even though he totally isn't"

[protege]

So you can't really hang anything on it.

I can hang something on it. The fact that Congress didn't even bother to *read* the bill before voting on it

Define "Something for nothing".

Let's see now, we have people who want to upgrade our infrastructure. They want to upgrade our schools, roads, power plants...all of which will cost a pretty penny. However, these same people...fight any tax increase to pay for it. I'd define that as wanting something for nothing.

Also, I find it interesting that when Obama does something...Congress is supposed to get blamed. Yet, when Bush "increased our deficit" nobody says a thing about Congress. Uh, didn't they give him the authorization for the wars...which drove up spending in the first place? Like I said, there's plenty of blame for this mess.

[jackfaire]

Also, I find it interesting that when Obama does something...Congress is supposed to get blamed. Yet, when Bush "increased our deficit" nobody says a thing about Congress. Uh, didn't they give him the authorization for the wars...which drove up spending in the first place? Like I said, there's plenty of blame for this mess.

If your referring to my comments my point is that the President doesn't really do anything good or bad. Everything he does is checked by congress who out number him by a lot.

I have never heard most people actually blame or credit congress for anything.

[Nyoibo]

Let's see now, we have people who want to upgrade our infrastructure. They want to upgrade our schools, roads, power plants...all of which will cost a pretty penny. However, these same people...fight any tax increase to pay for it. I'd define that as wanting something for nothing.

Not really, it could easily be accomplished with reallocation of spending



If defence funding was cut to just 50% of the budget spending you could double or even triple spending in any other area of the budget.

[jackfaire]

If defence funding was cut to just 50% of the budget spending you could double or even triple spending in any other area of the budget.

But that would leave us vulnerable to....to....uhm who is trying to take over the world this week?

The Brain and Pinky retired to their love shack.

Heinz Doofenschmirtz is busy with the Tri State Area

Cobra Commander is in jail listing the 10 things he hates about Duke.

Oooo wait we haven't heard from the Gummi Bears in awhile I bet they are the newest threat. Sneaky bastards.

[Gravekeeper]

I can hang something on it. The fact that Congress didn't even bother to *read* the bill before voting on it

Well of course not, its "Obamacare", so it must be opposed. Anything that has anything to do with the president has to be opposed. =p

Let's see now, we have people who want to upgrade our infrastructure. They want to upgrade our schools, roads, power plants...all of which will cost a pretty penny. However, these same people...fight any tax increase to pay for it. I'd define that as wanting something for nothing.

Even putting aside how general a statement that is. How is Obama attempting to cater to those whims by trying to raise taxes? >.>

[mikoyan29]

If your referring to my comments my point is that the President doesn't really do anything good or bad. Everything he does is checked by congress who out number him by a lot.

I have never heard most people actually blame or credit congress for anything.

In the latest polls, Congress' numbers are in the low teens if I remember correctly. Of course those numbers get different when you start breaking it down into individual Congressmen. It's sort of like saying, "Congress as a whole sucks...but my guy is just fine".

I don't know, it seems like many of the rules that are used to make Congress a nice place have been used to turn it on its heel. I think it started with Clinton have difficulty in getting people through and in tit for tat it was worse for Bush and now with Obama....at some point the cycle is going to have to end.

[jackfaire]

In the latest polls, Congress' numbers are in the low teens if I remember correctly.

I am not talking polls. Which are about as meaningless as a poll on who is your favorite (Insert this week's boy band member).

The "they all suck but my guy" is part of the problem. If your guy is golden and he is the one you get to vote on then you vote that jagoff into office again he does what he does again and you blame it on the rest of congress who used peer pressure.

The thing is polls aren't really people talking which is where the important data comes out. Polls ask leading questions that tend to lead to the conclusion the people running the polls kind of expected in the first place.

If you listen to two people talk in a relaxed environment you will get their real opinions. Most people in actual conversation rarely if ever blame congress for any troubles.

The closest I have ever heard them come in a conversation was "Man Congress is still waffling what the hell is wrong with the President he is falling down on the job"

[Andara Bledin]

Even the Repub cheerleader I work with has a heap of blame to lay on Congress when he gets to bitching about politics.

Unfortunately, he'll vote in the same assholes that are screwing shit up today at the next election. If we want things to change, we have to make them change. It's a 2-party system because everybody has to have a party. I say fuck the parties, both of them, and replace them all with people who aren't them. It's not like they could do much to fuck things up worse than this asinine "he started it" bullshit we have going now, and we might actually get some shit done.

^-.-^