postage to return ballot, WTF

[Andara Bledin]

Let me ask you this question: Why do people have to show an ID to register to vote, but aren't allowed to show an ID when voting? Isn't that still requiring an ID to vote? I had to show my current DL (which cost money) and a utility bill (which cost money)... isn't that still a poll tax?

If you were required to provide those documents in order to be eligible to register to be eligible to vote, then yes, that is the same as a poll tax.

^-.-^

[wolfie]

You keep saying this, even though people have repeatedly pointed out that the documents needed to acquire those IDs require time and money to obtain.

Those IDs can only be considered "free" if you only look at the very end of the process, and completely ignore everything required to get to that point.

That's the argument. The problem here is that you haven't offered a counter-argument.

Please, explain your reasoning to us. Why do you believe that the ID should still be considered "free" even though you have to spend money to obtain the documents required to get it?

Right on - by the other person's logic, I was able to get my CDL in one hour (time needed for the road test). After all, the time needed to actually LEARN how to drive a truck (ability that would be verified on the road test) "doesn't count".

The question still is: How is it ok to require postage (a surcharge) to allow someone the right to vote absentee, yet we can't require ID because people have to pay for the ID, even though IDs are free in most instances?

Absentee ballot is a special case - giving someone who CAN'T get to the polls on election day the chance to vote. I'd consider postage on an absentee ballot to be equivalent to the fee the phone company charges for an unlisted number - you want something beyond the basic, you pay for it. Corollary to that would be that any jurisdiction that goes for an "everybody has a mail-in ballot" should be required to use something along the lines of "business reply mail - no postage necessary" for returning the ballot, since in this case, a mail-in ballot is the "standard" ballot. Also, domestic postage is FAR cheaper (under a dollar) than any government ID I've seen, so it's also a question of degree.

[Panacea]

The USPS pays in a HUGE HUGE chunk of money to fund retirement and we pay a pretty penny for our insurance as well.

Worse: The USPS is the only entity required by statute to PRE FUND its retirement accounts for future retirees. The Federal Government doesn't do it. State governments don't do it. Private pension plans certainly don't. But the Post Office must, and that's the single most important reason why the USPS is going bankrupt.

I honestly don't understand antutrust laws or the power of eminent domain to comment on those.

The Post Office can maintain a monopoly on postal service, though private companies are allowed to deliver packages and special types of over night letters, they can't deliver first class mail or fourth class mail (junk mail).

When you put up your mail box in front of your house it becomes property of the US Post Office, even though you are required to maintain it.

Antitrust laws are supposed to prevent monopolies and preserve competition.

It's been argued that in some areas--small towns, for example--the USPS has a monopoly on service. My grandmother's town was like that for years. There were no FedEx or DHL boxes. Everything went through the post office. There's some of of those boxes now, but you'll pay more to use them.

Well, in all fairness, the USPS has that monopoly in small towns because it is unprofitable for UPS, DHL, or FedEx to deliver in those areas. They will often take your money to deliver there, get it as far as their system will take it, then pay the Post Office to take it the rest of the way.

"Properly counted" meaning also that my vote counts for me, not some guy claiming to be me. Without me showing photo ID, I (nor anyone) cannot guarantee my vote is properly counted.

End of story.

Sure they can. Because they won't TAKE your vote unless you claim to be you. Once you have voted, your name is checked off and anyone else claiming to be you will be told you already voted--and it will raise red flags. Ditto if you show up and someone voted in your name. The validity of that ballot and that ballot alone will be called into question, and the state will do its process from there to decide what happened. You can then cast a provisional ballot while the state sorts it out.

Let me ask you this question: Why do people have to show an ID to register to vote, but aren't allowed to show an ID when voting? Isn't that still requiring an ID to vote? I had to show my current DL (which cost money) and a utility bill (which cost money)... isn't that still a poll tax?

The ID doesn't have to be a PICTURE ID, which is the heart of the controversy over Voter ID laws. The ID can be a utility bill to register to vote, as well as to actually vote in the states that currently have Voter ID. The recent changes or push for changes are to a PICTURE ID system, which is why it is being opposed, because the costs and difficulties obtaining picture ID can be too great for some citizens to overcome.

This is proving true in Pennsylvania; conflicting instructions to state workers have kept many people from getting a valid photo ID to vote with.

[Aethian]

What I want to know is why we're still complaining about a 45 cent stamp.

[Rapscallion]

What I want to know is why we're still complaining about a 45 cent stamp.

Must admit, when I look at the price of a stamp and how far it can go, I think it's sodding great value for money.

Rapscallion

[crashhelmet]

What I want to know is why we're still complaining about a 45 cent stamp.

Because it used to be cheaper. Regardless of the value, or the amount of the increase, people will ALWAYS bitch and complain when prices go up.

[Aethian]

Because it used to be cheaper. Regardless of the value, or the amount of the increase, people will ALWAYS bitch and complain when prices go up.

Gas used to be cheaper, bread used to be cheaper, milk at 4 bucks a gallon used to be WAY cheaper. Inflation hit. But to complain about 45 cents to make a voice heard in a big election, to me, is a stupid complaint. I actually went and figured it out, since I moved and thus my polling location moved I went from costing 42 cents both way to vote to 49 cents both way to vote. The stamp now looks cheaper to me but because I can't request a absentee ballot in my area, I pay for the gas.

[Aethian]

Must admit, when I look at the price of a stamp and how far it can go, I think it's sodding great value for money.

Rapscallion

Multi quote function isn't working on my phone for some reason.

Nome Alaska to Key West Florida....45 cents.

[smileyeagle1021]

The ID doesn't have to be a PICTURE ID, which is the heart of the controversy over Voter ID laws. The ID can be a utility bill to register to vote, as well as to actually vote in the states that currently have Voter ID. The recent changes or push for changes are to a PICTURE ID system...snip

In some places you don't need any form of ID at all beyond knowing your social security number. When I first registered to vote they told me if I had a physical ID, such as a drivers license, social security card, or even a utility bill with a postmarked envelope (had to have been sent USPS, won't accept emailed bills) they could register me right then and there, but if I didn't, all I needed was a social security number that could be run through the equivalent of e-verify to be provisionally registered (those rules may have changed, it's been a while since I first registered to vote).

[insertNameHere]

Actually to mail the ballot to the local board of elections is $1.30 at this rate I will have to deal with it, Originally requested ballot due to possibility of me being away on military orders during the election. but now I'll just be doing regular work an hour away from my polling location.

[LewisLegion]

I voted absentee and didn't use a stamp. Library drop-box, on my way to work, didn't cost me a dime. When I registered to vote, used my SSN, didn't cost me a dime.

So far I've voted completely for free in every election since I registered.