Is this why people voted for Obama?

[IDrinkaRum]

Peggy Johnson thinks Obama & government is going to pay for her gas & mortgage

Really? Is the government really going to pay for that and everything else? Can't she get welfare? Or does she "make too much"? Is she now in the "magic" lower number (somewhere lowerthan between $150,000 and $250,000 that will be considered where the "rich" start and then there's everyone else?)

Does this mean that because my husband & I aren't "rich" we can apply for the government to pay our $1,500/month mortgage. I have an SUV. It costs me about $30/week to keep it in fuel. Can I really apply to the government to pay for that too?

And the reason people are throwing the "Socialist" label around? There are people in the U. S. that are understandably nervous about all this "spreading of the wealth" around. Whose wealth is going to be spread around? Those who make the "magic number" of $250,000 or more? $200,000? $150,000? $100,000? This might be a newsflash to some people out there, but just like those of us who go out and work retail/office jobs/etc. and want to keep our money, those who make $250,000+ are also working to make that money. And guess what??? They want to keep their money too! Amazing, ain't it? People who make money out of the whazoo actually want to keep their money for themselves & their own families. I mean, listen to those who win the big lottery jackpots - do they really say "Well, the first thing I'm going to do when I get my money, is stand out on the street corner handing it out to random strangers." Nope, they don't. It's always to pay bills, get things for their families, etc. Selfish of them, huh? I mean, when I become rich and famous, I want to keep my money.

[DGoddess]

I suspect that may be an exaggeration . . . as I haven't heard that rumor before.

What I understood our President-Elect to say was that he wanted to share the wealth more in the form of tax relief - ie, reducing the burden a bit on the lower-income taxpayers/families and increasing it for those with much higher incomes and corporations.

Which, theoretically should put more money in our wallets, therefore easing the burden a bit on the daily struggle to pay the mortgage/pay the bills/buy groceries/gas for the vehicles so we can get to work, etc. I suspect that's what she meant - she just didn't express it quite clearly enough so it sounded like she was expecting a free ride.

At least that's my opinion.

[Greenday]

This might be a newsflash to some people out there, but just like those of us who go out and work retail/office jobs/etc. and want to keep our money, those who make $250,000+ are also working to make that money. And guess what??? They want to keep their money too! Amazing, ain't it? People who make money out of the whazoo actually want to keep their money for themselves & their own families. I mean, listen to those who win the big lottery jackpots - do they really say "Well, the first thing I'm going to do when I get my money, is stand out on the street corner handing it out to random strangers." Nope, they don't. It's always to pay bills, get things for their families, etc. Selfish of them, huh? I mean, when I become rich and famous, I want to keep my money.

We could go with no taxes at all. This way, everyone gets what they earn. I mean, since no one wants to GIVE up anything, why should we RECEIVE anything? Either you succeed or you fail. Sucks to be you if you fail. Sucks to be you if you never had a chance.

[IDrinkaRum]

But isn't that the American Dream? To make something of yourself without the help of anyone or anything else? Isn't that sorta what Capitalism is? You either succeed or fail. Is this a new concept?

Everyone applauds the "self-made-man". I want to go ahead and do stuff and make my money. Don't forget: "Those who have the most toys wins!" Or was that just the 1980's?

Now it's: Don't worry if you can't afford this or that, get credit! Get the government to bail you out!

Maybe DGoddess is correct that Peggy Johnson was so overwhelmed that Obama and the Government will help her out with the tax cuts, etc. But I seriously doubt it. The people I talked to at the Gaming Store, out in public, friends, and family they were all either "OMG ... Obama is going to bankrupt us with all this spending!" Or "We'll get a free ride with the Democrats in office. Woohoo!"

And that is what I'm griping about. There is no such thing as a free lunch or a free ride. There's always a payment somewhere along the way. When that payment comes due, will we really be ready to pay it?

[AdminAssistant]

But isn't that the American Dream? To make something of yourself without the help of anyone or anything else? Isn't that sorta what Capitalism is? You either succeed or fail. Is this a new concept?

So what about the farmers when the weather turns against him and floods his fields/causes a drought and they lose their entire crop? Well, I guess they just shouldn't be farmers, right? Sell the land their family has farmed for 3 generations and let it be taken over by the big corporations.

What about a person who works for a construction company that gets injured in a car wreck and can no longer work in his field? Well, if they had any gumption they'd be out there getting another job immediately! They don't need to get time to heal!

What about the young woman who winds up pregnant unexpectantly and decides to keep the baby? She can't get help from her family, and will have medical bills and daycare costs... Well, she should just have to figure it out! And if she can't figure it out, well, just get an abortion, after all, it's probably her fault she got pregnant, right?

Do I need to give more examples? What you advocate makes the rich get richer and the poor get poorer and, well, fuck the poor. Their kids don't deserve to be educated, they don't deserve healthcare, they're just POOR and they can just stay that way. More money for the rest of us.

I've been poor. I've watched my parents try to figure out how to pay their bills. I watched my father's heartbreak when he had sell off his farm equipment - He had to sell a lifetime of work that day, then go through the embarrassment of bankruptcy. But, I guess it's just his fault. The 10 and 12 hour days he worked weren't enough, I guess. So what if he had to sell his grandfather's land? I guess that just doesn't make a difference.

[Greenday]

What about the young woman who winds up pregnant unexpectantly and decides to keep the baby? She can't get help from her family, and will have medical bills and daycare costs... Well, she should just have to figure it out! And if she can't figure it out, well, just get an abortion, after all, it's probably her fault she got pregnant, right?

What about the young woman, who can't even afford the contraception, gets pregnant, for the third/fourth time? Why are my taxes paying for such stupidity?

[BlaqueKatt]

What I understood our President-Elect to say was that he wanted to share the wealth more in the form of tax relief - ie, reducing the burden a bit on the lower-income taxpayers/families and increasing it for those with much higher incomes and corporations.

Read this article on it

"Barack Obama says he will give 95 percent of all American workers a tax cut but does not mention that his plan would send checks to tens of millions of tax filers who pay no personal income taxes - payments that critics say look "suspiciously like welfare."

Too late now-also there was an article on yahoo news that he's already said he ma have to wait on that until the economy stabilizes-not even in office and alread breking campaign promises-one day after the elections-that has to be a new record.

[Greenday]

Shit. Tax returns...to people who don't pay taxes? Damnit. Where was that link BEFORE I voted?

[MystyGlyttyr]

You know, I was just talking to my family about this today, and said that I wonder how many people (no one here making me say this, I'm talking in general) who voted for Obama are going to turn on him when he doesn't heal the blind and cure the sick and make the economy golden within six months. Not because of Obama himself, but because I have this feeling that a lot of people who voted for him don't realize that a massive change takes TIME...and that they may be expecting things from him he can't deliver in a timeframe that's impossible.

We all know about entitlement whores and how irrational they can be. I'm honestly kind of curious to see whether or not the political world is going to find out the same thing we retail drones have known for decades.

[IDrinkaRum]

AdminAssistant - that's what makes America America. Farmers and non-farmers have their options. This land was made on the backs of farmers and then people left the farm, started towns, started restaurants and saloons and hotels and brothels and boarding houses and invented the rifles and canons and the buggy that will be drawn by horses and saddles and cars, and the list goes on and on.

But that is why people come to America. They come here with absolutely nothing and try to make it. That's why my ancestors came to America. The land of dreams. The land where you can make it or break it. I had one ancestor who married into money. Then there was my Mom's Father's family who lived through the nightmare of the Bolshevik Revolution and were threatened with death. Why? They had land & money. They were part of the "nobility" in their little corner of Russia.

Greenday - If you had listened to Conservative Talk Radio, you would have heard that point before Election Day. I heard it plenty on Plante & Limbaugh shows.

BlaqueKatt - thank you for helping me make a point. I'm not sure of your political leanings, but thank you for helping me out.

Mysty - you're correct on asking about the people who will turn on Obama once they realize they don't get everything within X amount of time. And then Obama will have to do one of two things: Implement everything right away to make everyone happy or come out and say they have to wait or his administration will not be able to implement everything. Either way, his Presidency has the ability to explode all over the over the place - and not in the good way (exploding with bits of body parts instead of confetti and bubbles).

[Greenday]

Radio? I haven't been in my car in ages. I've been in my dorm, doing homework, or in the chem building, in a lab. I need you guys to keep me up-to-date on this stuff.

[SimplyAnother]

"Barack Obama says he will give 95 percent of all American workers a tax cut but does not mention that his plan would send checks to tens of millions of tax filers who pay no personal income taxes - payments that critics say look "suspiciously like welfare."

On the subject of taxes. Certainly, it was taken out of my check, but I got a tax refund, got the earned income credit, got the child tax credit. Got a freaking stimulus check earlier in the year. All that totaled much more than was actually taken out of my pay checks. Under President George W. Bush.

[AdminAssistant]

What about the young woman, who can't even afford the contraception, gets pregnant, for the third/fourth time? Why are my taxes paying for such stupidity?

1) As of right now, you can get contraception for free via health clinics. However, I'm sure that providing free basic health care is blatant socialism and evil, and therefore must be rid of.

2) There are a number of religions that forbid people from using birth control. Some women can't take it. What about a woman like that who gets raped?

Not all unexpected/unplanned pregnancies are a result of stupidity.

And even if they are planned, does the government have the right to interfere and say how many children you can or can't have? Because I hear that's working really well in China.

[Fashion Lad!]

There are a lot of people who I'm sure voted for Obama because he does plan on raising taxes on people making more than $250,000 a year. He says that 95% of America will see a tax decrease. Remember that some 47% of Americans have no income tax burden. In order for Obama to give those Americans a “tax cut” he must literally write them a check from the government. A check that’s only going to be in the mail once, at that.

That’s not a tax cut. You can’t cut taxes for people who don’t pay them. If you want to cut taxes you must cut them for people who actually pay them. And, frankly, that means Americans at the top of the income brackets who pay the most in taxes.

But that would mean “tax cuts for the rich,” which doesn’t fit in at all with Obama’s wealth redistribution rhetoric.

[Amethyst Hunter]

Mysty - you're correct on asking about the people who will turn on Obama once they realize they don't get everything within X amount of time. And then Obama will have to do one of two things: Implement everything right away to make everyone happy or come out and say they have to wait or his administration will not be able to implement everything. Either way, his Presidency has the ability to explode all over the over the place - and not in the good way (exploding with bits of body parts instead of confetti and bubbles).

Not necessarily.

Obama doesn't strike me as the type to make decisions rashly or on a whim. Nor do I expect any magical sparkleponies from him in his first term. (Then again, look at all the shit that asshole Bush managed to do in *his* first term...never say never, heh) I don't expect him to be an instant wonder-cure, and I don't expect him to hold everybody's hand and go 'it's okay' when it clearly isn't.

I DO expect him to have a significant amount of common sense and the humility to listen to other people more knowledgable in subjects than he is. And judging from the way his campaign has progressed, I'd say he's pretty good in that department. And I absolutely will be one of those that calls him on the carpet if he does misstep and attempt something he shouldn't.

Perfection in any human being, no matter how good they may be, is impossible, and I think the vast majority of his supporters recognize that and accept it.

As for the paranoia about "spreading the wealth", who here has a problem with taxing the shit out of entities like overpaid celebrities and oil company execs? Yeah, I didn't think so. When Tom Cruise can pull down 20 million bucks per shitty movie and wanky Wall Streeters can give themselves bonuses with the bailout money that was intended towards repairing a serious problem, I say fuck 'em.

And even if that wasn't a factor, the whole money business is about giving those who are a little less fortunate (as others have mentioned) a leg up so that they can actually stand on their own *without* government assistance. A country is only as strong as its people, and when its people can't even afford basic medical care or homes or such, how the hell are they going to be able to support their families and themselves, let alone that country in a time of need?

People like me, we're not asking for a handout and we're not asking for a government teat. We're asking for a goddamned level playing field so we can become that self-reliant ideal that's so enshrined in the nation's psyche.