Republicans: crybabies or patriots?

[Jetfire]

We can't do any of those things in the US because we don't have a Parlimentary system. We have a republican system of indirect Represenation. To do any of the things you suggest means completely re-writing the US Constitution. It won't happen.

Well, banning gerrymandering/replacing it with a fairer system is possible. California has actually done it, as have a couple of other states. There just needs to be a bigger push to spread it further, and recent events might be the push needed for that.

The other elements admittedly are pipedreams, but they do highlight some of the issues with the system. But they probably won't be addressed ever.

[wolfie]

Our tax code on US citizens abroad is grossly unfair, and recently made worse by requiring foreign financial institutions (who operate in the US, which is most of them) to comply with a burdensome process on reporting the assets of US citizens for tax purposes.

And what happens if the foreign financial institution is based in a country with strong privacy laws that make it a criminal offense to obey the U.S. demand for reporting on assets? If they don't report, they're breaking U.S. law, but if they do report, they're breaking their home country's law.

[Hyena Dandy]

I'm not sure I'm going to call the Republicans crybabies. I try to afford namecalling. What has to be understood, here, in the reason for the Government shutdown, is this.

Essentially, what has been happening for a while is something called a Continuing Resolution. We haven't passed any major budget, but we've passed Continuing Resolutions. CRs, in effect, say "We're not shutting the government down for a few months.

Democrats have drawn one up in the Senate. The entirety of what it says boils down to "We're not shutting down the Government."

The House takes it, and sends it back "We're not shutting down the Government, and we're gutting the ACA."

The Senate takes the Resolution, and crosses out "And we're gutting the ACA" and says "We're just not shutting down the Government."

The Republicans will not allow a CR to pass unless it includes legislation taking out key components of the ACA. Their position is that the Democrats need to be able to compromise on this, or else nothing can get done. "This is good for you, this is good for us, let's do what works for both of us."

The Democrat's position is that the Federal Government continuing to run should not be considered a "Thing that is good for Democrats" but a "Thing that is good for America."

[Gravekeeper]

The problem is that Obamacare is a law. Its as much a law as is possible. It went through the entire progress legitimately, was challenged as unconstitutional and was ruled constitutional by the Supreme Court. Thats it, its a law, end of story. So seeing this grand standing fuck monkeys get up there one after another and rant about how its an unconstitutional assault on American freedom while pulling out prob Constitutions from inside their jacket ....

Its either malicious, orchestrated evil or complete cognitive dissonance or somewhere inbetween. With various flavours of utter hypocrisy running through it as the GOP is incapable of keeping its story straight for more than a month.

The GOP is basically Taliban Light at this point.

[Mongo Skruddgemire]

The party is starting to turn on itself between the lunatics pushing this and the moderates that see this is immature lunacy.

It's not just the moderates. Even some of the more extreme right-wing folks are standing up and looking at their own party and screaming at them that this was a bad idea.

I mean, the GOP's argument was that if Obamacare passes it will become too popular to repeal so they have to stop it now.

Which makes even less sense considering that it's already passed and is being implemented. If they want to stop it then they need to generate support for stopping it and generate the votes in the House and Senate to have it repealed.

Fox News is in full Pravda mode trying to spin the shit out of this now too. They won't calling it a shutdown, they're calling it a "Slimdown".

"Fox News" is a bit of an oxymoron in of itself. Frankly most news outlets here in the US are not much better. And people wonder why I get my news about what happens here in the US from the BBC.

For pity's sake, the BBC even knew about the "Prom Mom" incident that happened in a hole-in-the-wall township in the middle of New Jersey.

[draco664]

what's really scary is they have another opportunity to try to screw everybody over- if the debt ceiling isn't raised by October 17th, then the US will default on it's debts.

Hate to break it to you, but that is merely a matter of timing at this point. The US Federal Government is addicted to spending (not that that is particularly unusual for governments...), and it has almost reached the point where all the federal level revenue from tax won't cover the interest on the debt and spending already committed (pensions and so forth).

The Federal government has increased it's debt by 600% since 1990. As GDP has only increased by 75% in that time, that's a bubble just waiting to burst. Repeatedly increasing the debt ceiling is doing nothing more than increasing the pain that will occur.

[gremcint]

The GOP is basically Taliban Light at this point.

in the past I would have argued you, called you out on this and maybe even called you a name or two. Now I find it hard not to agree with you.

[Andara Bledin]

And... more drama in DC.

Reports are that a woman rammed the gates of the White House with her car, was chased over a dozen blocks, and shots were fired. At least one officer was injured at that time, and the woman is either dead or in custody.

I'm hoping she's in custody because I really want to hear what the hell was going through her head.

[Talon]

The GOP is basically Taliban Light at this point.

in the past I would have argued you, called you out on this and maybe even called you a name or two. Now I find it hard not to agree with you.

Gk did make the distinction by calling them Taliban "Light". As I recall the actual Taliban slaughtered entire villages for having the wrong version of faith.

The GOP hasn't slaughtered anyone. Which is about the only positive thing I can say about the GOP.

[Duelist925]

Gk did make the distinction by calling them Taliban "Light". As I recall the actual Taliban slaughtered entire villages for having the wrong version of faith.

The GOP hasn't slaughtered anyone. Which is about the only positive thing I can say about the GOP.

Its really sad that I mentally added a "yet" to that sentence without even realizing it.

[Andara Bledin]

Its really sad that I mentally added a "yet" to that sentence without even realizing it.

Nah. They mostly don't have the stomachs to do their own violence. They'd much rather support foreign wars against people they don't understand or like and prevent those in need from getting health care or even shelter because that's enough distance that they don't have to own up to the fact that it's their fault we are where we are.

[Gravekeeper]

The US Federal Government is addicted to spending (not that that is particularly unusual for governments...), and it has almost reached the point where all the federal level revenue from tax won't cover the interest on the debt and spending already committed (pensions and so forth).

The US is addicted to military spending. This is the crux of the situation: There are two sacred cows for the GOP; Military spending and high income tax rates. They won't allow any suggestion that military spending be reduced but at the same time will not allow any suggestion that tax rates should be increased on higher income brackets that can actually afford it. Instead, they shriek about entitlements and how the Democrats are the one spending all the money. When all of the programs they point at to cut to save money amount to minuscule portions of the federal budget that wouldn't solve anything. Save making the people that rely on them suffer.

When you have multi billionaires that pay lower tax rates than their housekeeper, something is seriously fucked up and no amount of cuts is going to rectify that situation. The GOP has convinced the mouth breathers any tax increase is bad and we should fight it together because we're in this together. Which totally ignores any semblance of logic or math.

Its wasn't even that Obama wanted to increase taxes, he wanted to restore high income tax rates to what they were previously. Before Bush handed out all the sweet heart deals to the 1% in the form of shit like lower capital gains tax. Resulting in a system that literally makes you rich if you;re already rich. But is a giant fuck you to anyone that doesn't make several million a year.

Its such a mind boggling cluster fuck to watch from the outside. Because income tax rates are at their lowest in what? 40 years down there? Yet you have his deluded segment of the population convinced they're somehow on par with the revolutionaries.

And you can't win with facts because there was such a schism created during the Bush years between the American people. Then shit like Fox News embraced and exploited this new market creating an insulation bubble around its viewers. While giving them an Us Vs Them mentality. So presenting facts to them is useless as they reject it as liberal media lies or whatever.

The whole situation gives me a headache and I don't even live there.

[gremcint]

lots of republicans are saying it's not big deal and talking about how everyone's lives aren't falling apart, aren't they basically then arguing that they aren't needed?

[Greenday]

lots of republicans are saying it's not big deal and talking about how everyone's lives aren't falling apart, aren't they basically then arguing that they aren't needed?

Yea, I see a lot of Republicans bragging about how great it is that all these cuts and job furloughs and it's not really harming anyone. Cause if the world can make it a few days without those people, clearly their jobs aren't needed, right?

[gremcint]

Not what I mean, they themselves walk off the job, still get paid and turn around and point so people don't get angry at them at how the place isn't falling apart without them. In a company the boss would go "you're right... you're fired we'll get someone we actually need."