The Fox Top 10 For The First GOP Debate

[Rapscallion]

If they like him for his honesty, it's not even quite the same as trying to humour your racist homophobic uncle and hoping he shuts up, but instead giving him a microphone and access to the tannoy system at a major public event.

At what point does the Republican party become unelectable and realises it? The really scary bit for me isn't that he's a lunatic who may end up with his finger on a nuclear button, and not that the GoP field is scarier, but that there are significant chunks of the US population who agree with him to an extent that they'd vote him in in a heartbeat. That's despite his history on the left of US politics.

That's unless the GoP high command are waiting in the wings with that sort of information they way they did with Herman Cain to prove they weren't racist, until it was time to get the skeletons out of the closet...

Rapscallion

[Andara Bledin]

The people in charge of the GoP machine are putting up whatever roadblocks they need on the QT.

The race doesn't really heat up for months, yet; the big money hasn't even entered the race, so we've got a long, long road of crap before the also-rans give up and a few real candidates are buoyed by their supporters needing a new horse to bet on.

[Estil]

I looked at the calendar, saw that the Republican National Convention is in late July. Almost exactly a year away.

... we have to endure an entire year of this three-ring circus? =O_o=

All the more reason I'm very much having a "wait and see" attitude on this one. As I've said before it's way too early to tell which of these guys will end up being "for real" in the long term. For all we know, the R nomination might end up going to someone we've not yet even heard about, and the D nomination could just as easily go to someone besides Hilary.

[Estil]

there are significant chunks of the US population who agree with [Trump] to an extent that they'd vote him in in a heartbeat.

"significant chunks of the US population" is still a LONG way to go from getting enough for the actual nomination, never mind receiving a majority of the electoral college to take home the prize. I can see why Trump might be getting some attention for now but I just don't think he's got the charisma...he's always been known as the most stereotypical hardcore capitalist possible and what works in business won't necessarily work for governing. Sure the economy will probably be the top issue by far in 2016 but what if we end up with another international crisis, like the Iran Hostage crisis from right before the 1980 election? Economics/business matters are what Trump has always been all about and it's just not enough.

[Gravekeeper]

For all we know, the R nomination might end up going to someone we've not yet even heard about, and the D nomination could just as easily go to someone besides Hilary.

That's pretty wishful thinking at this point. Is there *anyone* left in the GOP field that's remotely qualified / not terrifying to think about near the White House? Never mind that no one is getting anywhere near the R nomination without that sweet sweet Koch brothers money cock in their mouth.

The GOP has chased away most its moderates and frothed its base up so much they wouldn't accept anyone reasonably sane anyway.

As for the D nomination, no one is going to "easily" pry that out of her cold dead hands. >.>

[Estil]

Remember what I said about charisma? How else do you explain how Obama became President despite not even being remotely qualified for the job (only a fraction of a term in the state legislature, then fraction of a term as a Congressman, and voted Present most of the time...IOW most of the time he didn't even have the guts to even vote yea or nay, which sort of defeats the whole idea of being in public office, no?)?

[Andara Bledin]

Um... The people he was up against were scary and wanted things that were demonstrably bad?

You don't really have to be charismatic when the opposition is acting like a bunch of lunatics.

[Gravekeeper]

Remember what I said about charisma? How else do you explain how Obama became President despite not even being remotely qualified for the job

Is there any GOP meme you won't trot out? >.>

Plus, he was a senator for 3 years and a state senator for 7 so I have nfi what you're on about. Not to mention teaching Constitutional law for 12 years. Never mind that he was re-elected president.

Comparatively the last Republican president was a governor for 5 years and spent the rest of his time failing at business or being drunk. As president he caused more damage to the country and the world then any other world leader in recent memory.

(only a fraction of a term in the state legislature, then fraction of a term as a Congressman, and voted Present most of the time...IOW most of the time he didn't even have the guts to even vote yea or nay, which sort of defeats the whole idea of being in public office, no?)?

He voted present 3% of the time. That's hardly "most of the time".

For fuck sakes man, learn to use Google and spare us the bullshit talking points. You're just making yourself look like a shill that parrots whatever you were told.

[Estil]

Yunno, I consider myself on the conservative side of moderate, but good grief even I can't find any redeeming qualities in this field. There's really not even a lesser of evils here, there's just vast amounts of crazy.

Then who do you think would be good for the R nomination? Most everyone else on this thread apparently just wants to do general R bashing and silly drinking games. :P I'd like to here from others here who are either usual R voters or at least swing voters. I know I may sound like I'm taking the easy way out saying it's too early to tell (the R convention is still about a year away)...now if there really was someone in serious contention for the nomination that I thought was someone really unique/special maybe I'd feel differently.

[Greenday]

Then who do you think would be good for the R nomination? Most everyone else on this thread apparently just wants to do general R bashing and silly drinking games. :P I'd like to here from others here who are either usual R voters or at least swing voters. I know I may sound like I'm taking the easy way out saying it's too early to tell (the R convention is still about a year away)...now if there really was someone in serious contention for the nomination that I thought was someone really unique/special maybe I'd feel differently.

I think we should just get rid of the Republican and Democrat parties as they do way more harm to our nation and the rest of the world than good.

[Gravekeeper]

I think we should just get rid of the Republican and Democrat parties as they do way more harm to our nation and the rest of the world than good.

Two party system, don't look at me I voted for Kodos, etc

[Rapscallion]

I think we should just get rid of the Republican and Democrat parties as they do way more harm to our nation and the rest of the world than good.

I'm not quite certain how to say this, but I'm in a position where I have to agree with you, though in broader terms. I've yet to see a political party that hasn't become a greasy-pole climbing competition.

I'd like to see an end to political parties and have politicians who think for themselves. The downside is that nothing would ever be agreed. It's the least worst system around.

Rapscallion

[s_stabeler]

actually, that's not entirely true. The United States had no political parties until 1792. and there were only loose political factions in the UK until 1760.

It's worth mentioning that the problem is, in fact, parties where all the members effectuevly vote as one. looser political factions- where members more-r-less just tend to agree on things- are fine, since they tend to form and break apart relatively easily and members tend to vote based on their opinion of the topic, not along party lines.

[jedimaster91]

Then who do you think would be good for the R nomination? Most everyone else on this thread apparently just wants to do general R bashing and silly drinking games. :P I'd like to here from others here who are either usual R voters or at least swing voters. I know I may sound like I'm taking the easy way out saying it's too early to tell (the R convention is still about a year away)...now if there really was someone in serious contention for the nomination that I thought was someone really unique/special maybe I'd feel differently.

Honestly I don't keep up with it enough. Though I liked Mitch Daniels when he was governor in Indiana. I don't live there, but I'm not far and I remember liking a lot of what he tried to do there. I think some were pushing for him to run for president either the last election or the one before, but he declined.

Quite frankly right now the one candidate for president that I can even begin to consider is Bernie Sanders. Even there I'm leery. Sure, a lot of what he wants to do is wonderful. But money to pay for his programs has to come from somewhere and I've not heard how he plans to fund his ideas other than the good ol' tax the rich refrain; which I somehow doubt he could get Congress to pass.

I think we should just get rid of the Republican and Democrat parties as they do way more harm to our nation and the rest of the world than good.

The parties have gotten so polarized and there's so little working to find common ground; it's an us vs them mentality which is not only hurting the country, but also pushing out the more moderate, sane candidates. I don't see how anyone with even a shred of common sense and sanity would even consider running for president. They know better.

[Estil]

I guess if Mitch Daniels got re-elected by about a 2 to 1 margin in the same year (2008) Obama actually won Indiana (which historically is about as deep red a state as they come) then I guess he must've done something right!

As for what you said about "the parties have gotten so polarized and there's so little working to find common ground", it CAN be done if they really try, no matter how far apart they are on the political spectrum. John Adams and Thomas Jefferson as well as Ronald Reagan and Tip O'Neill for example were about as different politically as night and day and fierce political rivals "on the court" but "off the court" (in the former pair's case this especially occurred after they retired and both died within hours of each other on America's 50th b-day no less!) they were the best of pals. Just like Magic Johnson and Larry Bird were to use a sports analogy which happens to be from the same time period as the Gipper and the Tipper previously mentioned. And let's not forget how the Republican Revolution Congress of 1994 knew that the secret to a balanced budget was the line-item veto, and passed it into law, even though the President at the time was "on the other team" so to speak. Unfortunately a few years later the SCOTUS struck it down insisting that the Constitution says the President's veto power is an all or nothing deal.

So yes, these are just a few examples off the top of my head of how finding common ground can totally happen if D's and R's alike can just remember one basic and undeniable fact. D's and R's are political opponents, not enemies. And I think (I'm not positive though) it was Teddy Roosevelt who famously said that anything is possible as long as no one cares who gets the credit.