Wherein I dare to be unpopular!

[Bloodsoul]

I recall a thread over at one of GameFAQs secret boards about Batman VS Superman, saying that Superman was actually the more "human" and "relatable" of the two (using his reaction of his foster father's death as evidence). Just 'cause Supes is invincible doesn't mean he can save everyone. That reminds me, I need to check out "Death of Superman" at some point.

As for Jokers, my favourite's Mark Hamill, but that's 'cause I grew up on the old "Adventures of Superman/Batman: The Animated Series" cartoons.

[Slytovhand]

Sucks to be me... I didn't see it this week.... damn! It got booked out and all.

I've got to agree on the whole "let's base a review on sympathy rather than actual ability" crap (not that I know how he did, though I heard Heath did a great job...but that mentality itself). Makes you sort of wonder what it actually means to be a credible film critic!

Bale as Batman...hmmm - I'm still not convinced! Maybe he's portraying a particular version. As I think I mentioned - Batman Returns seriously didn't do much for me at all...somnehow it just didn't seem real to me (as sort of weird as it sounds!)

Keaton, to me, played a 'real' Batman... given all the psychological stuff and all - but without pushing it too much.. it was there as a basic fact of life for him - and then he just got up and dealt with it (and bashed up a stack of people .. that'd be the anger after the grief, denial and depression stages )

Clooney...phoney!


And I think Superman wants to be more human than most other humans - to stand out and try to make an example to inspire people. Bats knows the dark side is in all of us, and tries to channel that in a more positive way - and doesn't want to be a hero, but doesn't want the world to fall into the pit of darkness and despair that the baddies want it to be.... ( /psych 101 )

[AFPheonix]

I lied, we went and saw it.

Wow! It was much better than Batman Begins. Ledger makes the Joker seem to come from plausible origins, which makes him that much more scary. He isn't cartoony at all like Nicholson's Joker was.
It's just sheer mental illness bound up in an evil package that scares the everloving crap out of you.

[Slytovhand]

Yay me... I finally saw it!!

Well - one thing I can definitely say - Ledger put in a performance unlike any other I've seen him do! And it was quite believable...which in my books says 'good acting'!

Though... for me, it was hard not to look at what he was doing and think how Jack would have been doing it (I saw Get Smart just before it, and was doing the same thing... comparing!)

[AFPheonix]

I didn't really compare them, since they played such different versions of Joker. Nicholson's was a grittier version of Cesar Romero's Joker from the tv series, and Ledger's was a Joker that you'd expect to come out of a schizophrenic ward.

I really don't think Burton's Batman or these newer ones from Nolan are better or worse than the other, because they're really exploring different facets of the same universe. They're pretty much apples and oranges in my opinion, and it's ok to like both.
I do declare open season on Kilmer's and Clooney's turns in the suit, though. Those movies just plain sucked.

[BlaqueKatt]

Ledger makes the Joker seem to come from plausible origins, which makes him that much more scary. He isn't cartoony at all like Nicholson's Joker was.
It's just sheer mental illness bound up in an evil package that scares the everloving crap out of you.

Is this where I get to say "I told you so"?

[CancelMyService]

I loved Batman Begins, but after someone on another board I frequent pointed out that Bale's Batman voice sounds like Assy McGee, that's all I can think of now.

The 90s Batman movies (with the possible exception of the first one) were pretty much over the top and campy, like the 60s TV show with a multi million dollar budget. The statement that Jack Nicholson's version of the Joker was just his take on Cesar Romero's version seems spot on to me. The new series of movies is a more realistic approach in the sense of "what if these psychos were all real people, what would they be like".

I'm also of the opinion that the B:TAS is one of the best shows ever in terms of writing. If Nolan ever uses Mr. Freeze as a villain and bases it on the episode "Heart of Ice", it would be the one thing that could top Ledger's Joker. The biggest test of this new franchise will be if they can keep the bad guys from getting too over the top cartoony. They seemed close to getting there with Two-Face, but I don't think there's really any way to avoid that with his character. The Riddler would be a good one to fill the "psycho crazy enemy" role since obviously can't bring the Joker back, but they'd have to wait a few movies before bringing him in since *everyone* would compare whoever played him to Ledger.

[AFPheonix]

Is this where I get to say "I told you so"?

What doesn't kill you makes you......stranger.....

Eesh, still gives me chills thinking about it.

Riddler could be interesting, but not if he's played the way he was in the old tv series. What would be really fascinating is if they had Jim Carrey reprise the role, but have the part written and acted in a way concurrent to Nolan's universe.
Otherwise Crispin Glover would be a neat actor to plug in there.
If they had him as kind of a super hacker or something like that, taking over the message boards in downtown, stuff like that. Nothing as preposterous as polaris missiles exploding and writing a riddle in the sky like which nationality is always in a hurry.
(I do love West's Batman though, not many movies make me laugh over and over again like that one can).

The makeup for Two-Face was incredible. It was hard to look at, it was so gruesome. Much better than the makeup on Tommy Lee Jones in Batman Forever. I think he's coming back for the next movie, isn't he?

[CancelMyService]

Well the way the movie ended made you think the Joker would be coming back, but since that's not happening it seems Two-Face is going to be the guy. Since they like to have 2 villians per movie, it leaves the door wide open on who the #2 slot would be.

However, I think it would be kind of weird to have Two Face be the main villian since he's probably not known by people outside of the comic book/ B:TAS fans. Most people think of someone on the Joker/Penguin/Riddler/Catwoman level as a proper antagonist to Batman. I was kind of surprised when they relaunched the franchise with two of the lesser known baddies, but then since it was mainly the Batman origin story there would have been little sense wasting a A level villan there. I'd like to see them throw in someone like Rupert Thorne or maybe even someone like Clayface (that might open the door for horrible CGI though...) as the secondary villian in the next film.

[AFPheonix]

Penguin could be kind of interesting, especially since they've played the Mob aspect so hard the last 2 movies. I'd clean him up though, not make him as cartoony or as grotesque as the Batman Returns version. Just make him an extremely technological and sociopathic mob boss that comes to fill in the vacuum that the arrest and persecution of the other bosses have left.

[Slytovhand]

Actually - I was thinking some thing sort of similar... Penguin always came across to me as somewhat psychopathic... if they got rid of the 'humour' element. he falls into the category of 'believable'... whereas Mr Freeze would be pushing it a bit.

[AFPheonix]

The other good bad guy who would totally fit into this universe would be Bane. How cool would that be?

[Depot Denizen]

I saw a number of movies this weekend. Wall-E, X-Files, and Batman. Out of the three, I think I liked Wall-E the most. However, I think Batman was a well-done movie, if a bit too long.

There's some criticism about Batman's voice, with it being too rough and gritty. I thought it was fine. I mean, why on earth would you want to talk in your normal voice if your alter-ego was well-known? "Oh hey, you sound like Bruce Wayne!"

I honestly prefer the darker Batman from the two newer movies. Past Batman Returns they had just become campy and overblown to the point of a live-action cartoon. That's probably fine for most people, but I enjoy, I suppose, a more realistic representation of the Dark Knight. Not some guy running around in a speedo and Bat-nipples.

[AFPheonix]

I never got that criticism either. Especially if you are a bad guy, are you going to be more scared of a normal person voice or a ragged threatening voice jumping out of the shadows at you?

[Mistress Of Foxes]

Generally, when I go see a movie (or buy a game or things like that) it's because the trailer caught my attention and/or I think it might be interesting... Or it's been recommended to me by friends that know the things I like.

I went to see the new Batman movie because I like Batman, and the Joker has always been one of my favorite villians, so I was interested in seeing how the new movie would tackle it. I get that people have different opinions about the movie, and that's fine. But in my opinion, Ledger did a damn good job at playing a deranged psychotic criminal.

I didn't go see it because it was hyped, nor because it was Ledger's last movie (dear Loki, I wanted to strangle the girl at the movie that almost started crying whenever he got on screen.... Get a life!), but because I thought it had the potential to be good, and I liked it.

Edited to add (didn't want to post an entirely new post just for this): Also, in my opinion, avoiding something just because it's hyped is just as bad as deciding to do/see/hear/lick something because it's hyped. I'm skeptic towards things that have been seriously hyped, but I still make my own decision about whether or not it interests me. That's what sets me free from the hype, and I get to make my own opinions.

I went to see the Batman movie, like I said, because I like Batman, not because it was hyped. A similar hype that I'm going against is the hype that says that if you're a Batman fan, you have to hate Batman & Robin. Honestly, I don't. It's cliche and worth a lot of face palms, but I see it as a parody, and that means I can enjoy it as such. I like it because it's brain dead comedy I can watch when I don't want to think too much.

You don't get "unpopular" and "independent from the hype" by going against the hype and doing the opposite... You do it by completely ignoring the hype, IMHO.