can someone recommend a rapefree nonkids fantasy book series.

[Nekojin]

It's a base inconsistency. Either the Big Bad is evil and will do whatever he likes, including raping people if it gets him closer to his goals (or even just strikes his fancy), or you have to ignore the idea that sex even happens.

You can do the latter, but it works better in books aimed at kids and young adults than in books and series aimed at mature adults.

There's more to it than just that, though. If we're talking fantasy literature, without expressly defining what sort of fantasy we're talking about, you're naturally invoking the category known as "high fantasy," which is magic and dragons and elves, and all that. Unless otherwise specified, that also entails an inherently feudal world, where kingdoms' reach only extends a few miles beyond their developed borders; where most of the world is a lawless, rough place, where lawless, rough people live, and a great many people DO live outside of the protection of their lord's troops. It calls to mind a world where might-makes-right is the only rule for many people... and when you have might-makes-right, and human sexuality... well, you can see the end result as plain as day.

If you want to propose that rape never happens in such a world, I'd want to start setting up definitions of where the line between "consensual" and "rape" actually lies. Does the barmaid perform sexual favors for any and all, with a smile? Or is she sometimes just doing it for the money, and being coerced by her "patrons" to perform acts that she'd really rather not do? Or perhaps her patrons are all far too polite to ask her to do anything she doesn't really want to do.

Did you roll your eyes at any part during that last paragraph? I did.

[Kheldarson]

If you want to propose that rape never happens in such a world,

I think there's a slight difference between saying that and displaying it, though, which might be gremcint's point.

Can you write a high fantasy novel without discussing human sexuality? Sure. See Tolkien. Sex is not mentioned in the writing. Does that mean it doesn't happen? Of course not, but it's not in the books, so it's not important to the story.

Same thing in other books. Is sex mentioned? If no, no rape. If yes, then rape or sexual violence has to be a viable option.

For example, a story I'm working on. Is sex a possibility? Given that the two main POV characters are in a relationship, possibly. Is rape a possibility? Personally, no. I wouldn't write a rape scene, and I don't really have any antagonists that would resort to such measures. But that also means I come back to the idea of sex in my story. Do I really need it? The real answer is no; I may allude to it for some discussion points (emotional awareness, character development) but the sex itself is unnecessary. It becomes consistent in that way.

On the other hand, if rape were necessary to my story (or any story for that matter!), one would hope it's balanced by some healthier sex scenes (one reason I'm not a big fan of Goodkind's works. The setting was interesting at first...but the fetish just...yeah. No.)

[gremcint]

I'm getting the impression that there's some underlying motivation here that hasn't been fully expressed. Would you care to fill us in on the parts of the conversation we're not aware of, gremcint?

I admit I'm being a bit more subtle here than I usually am, partly because I wanted to see people's thoughts about this when not trying to argue a point but also I am honestly curious how prevalent rape is as a plot device. It seems to me at least to come up more often in fantasy series than sci fi and it's honestly just kind of "can I have something to read where it doesn't happen". Why does it have to be on the table? Why does having sex in a book mean that rape has to be an option. I'm not saying you can't write about rape but if I wanted to read a book without it in it how easy is it to do?

I wasn't aware trying to find rape free fantasy series was a problem. Then I started to think about it for a minute. >.>

So I can write about the rampaging barbarian horde led by the evil wizard and be fine. It can be bloody and torturous. But if I've already established that sex is a thing in my world (not just understood, but I've actually shown sex in my writing), then it doesn't make sense for my wizard to not let any women (or men!) in the group get sexually molested.

Two things, first of all I didn't say any comparison between violence and rape, Second of all just because the wizard wants power or riches doesn't mean he can't object to people being raped or molested. there are all kinds of complex villains who for example fight for their people, fight for the environment or just fight for power, just because they're the bad guy or antagonist doesn't mean they have to be a rapist, even if characters have sex.

I'll be frank this is a case where I wanted to see what conclusions people would draw on their own without my guidance and some of the responses are very surprising, you guys have suggested more books than I thought would come up suggesting to me that it's not as prevalent as I thought.

I mean if it's possible to have a book with dragons, or a book about a world with no flowers (mistborn) then why not one without rape?

Or if I'm reading a book about ancient north america just because it doesn't mention horses doesn't mean they don't exist in the world elsewhere.

Why can I have fiction that has black people never being enslaved but can't have fiction without people being raped?

I guess what I was originally going for is "is rape a central part of the fantasy genre like magic spells and items and quests or is it possible to have stories about that stuff without it?"

The main reason I specified nonkids is because I was figuring every response would be "harry potter" and "percy jackson" and nothing else. besides I've read them, and they're great but I want something more to sink my teeth into. I'm not sure where I'd draw the line between kids and adults to be honest.

I am thinking in terms of high fantasy mostly but aside from an age category I'm trying to leave it open for suggestions. The series I disqualified were ones I know rape is in.

[Kheldarson]

I admit I'm being a bit more subtle here than I usually am, partly because I wanted to see people's thoughts about this when not trying to argue a point but also I am honestly curious how prevalent rape is as a plot device. It seems to me at least to come up more often in fantasy series than sci fi and it's honestly just kind of "can I have something to read where it doesn't happen". Why does it have to be on the table? Why does having sex in a book mean that rape has to be an option. I'm not saying you can't write about rape but if I wanted to read a book without it in it how easy is it to do?

Two things, first of all I didn't say any comparison between violence and rape, Second of all just because the wizard wants power or riches doesn't mean he can't object to people being raped or molested. there are all kinds of complex villains who for example fight for their people, fight for the environment or just fight for power, just because they're the bad guy or antagonist doesn't mean they have to be a rapist, even if characters have sex.

Granted but here's the big issue: unless you have a specific reason why sex can be introduced but only in a good way (like your villain out and out rejects the option on screen for X reason), it's unrealistic to say that rape's off the table just because. If the story goes to a point where it's a viable option (like trying to break the heroes), why would you shy away if you've already written sex in?

That's not to say the villain can't have the reason to not rape. But it still becomes a stronger story to present the option and have people deal with it.

I mean if it's possible to have a book with dragons, or a book about a world with no flowers (mistborn) then why not one without rape?

Or if I'm reading a book about ancient north america just because it doesn't mention horses doesn't mean they don't exist in the world elsewhere.

Why can I have fiction that has black people never being enslaved but can't have fiction without people being raped?

Because it's a standard power play in human sexuality. You can change discrimination targets, resource distribution, or even rules of nature due to setting differences, but you can't change humanity's base without going into why humanity changed that much.

Basically, as long as there's violence and sex, there'll be rape.

I guess what I was originally going for is "is rape a central part of the fantasy genre like magic spells and items and quests or is it possible to have stories about that stuff without it?"

And the answer is yes you can have books without rape, but books aren't just about magic spells and items. They're about people. And people aren't always the nicest. That's why rape can be included. It's our most not nicest moment that can be done one on one.

[Ginger Tea]

Part of me is drawing the conclusion that a book cannot be written nowadays without sex being brought up at some point unless it's written for the single digit age bracket.

Years ago when I was sketching my book ideas I paired up a few characters and even had a cannon 2nd generation set of characters, so sex happened at some point in their relationship, but I had no intention of writing it in, mostly cos it would suck.
Two female characters started off in a relationship, both originally prostitutes in a modern setting, then when I was working on the youngest back story I decided she would not be on the game as she was taken in by the elder at 13 (but not as a lover till nearer 18), the elder potentially saved her life stopping her getting into a punters car no so long after she had run away. But she being morally grounded didn't want her following in her footsteps and if she had, the reader might just assume that I had written her in as an underage prostitute even though we don't meet them till she is 18 or older, but the reader would just assume unless I wrote in big letters "I have been on the game for 6 months and 3 days after my 18th birthday".

If I ever get round to collecting all my notes and trying to form a full novel out of a story, if you could call it that, out of 25 or more years of character development, there will be a murder, a bit of the occult and the supernatural, although these were for a spin off backstory not needed in the main, the monotony of working during the 90's and clubbing, but I was not out to write another trainspotting or club/drug book/movie, I just wrote a soap opera type thing (more UK flavour than American) with little story, but anything that was worth expanding I sketched chapters and dialogue, but the fucking nah not going to write that down.

[gremcint]

it's unrealistic to say that rape's off the table just because.

I'm not saying it's banned from the story I just want to know if there is a book where it doesn't happen there is a big difference. 2 heroes meet and fall in love, fight an evil wizard and kill him. is it that hard to tell that story without rape?

and if the responses are correct then yes there are a lot.

[gremcint]

maybe clan of the cave bear

my sister has informed me there is repeated rape in this series.

Also, in Heretics of Dune there is a mutual rape (you'd have to read it to understand)

um what?????


I'm going to clarify

I consider it to be a series if it's at least 2 books, I do agree that the longer a series goes the less and less story options they have so it probably will happen but if discworld is actually rapefree how many books are in that series again?

[Gravekeeper]

...I like her Harlequin romance moments....

There's not much actual romance involved. Just roiling loins and a lot of slobbering. Is it so hard to describe a sex scene without using the terms "waves" or "tides"? -.-

[Kheldarson]

There's not much actual romance involved. Just roiling loins and a lot of slobbering. Is it so hard to describe a sex scene without using the terms "waves" or "tides"? -.-

No but she falls under my guilty pleasure reading anyway so....

[Parvenu]

Challenge accepted.



How's sci-fi for you? And medical drama? Wondering if I should try pimping Sector General...

*High fives the fellow James White fan*

[violiav]

my sister has informed me there is repeated rape in this series.




um what?????


I'm going to clarify

I consider it to be a series if it's at least 2 books, I do agree that the longer a series goes the less and less story options they have so it probably will happen but if discworld is actually rapefree how many books are in that series again?

About 30. And I'm not 100% that rape is never mentioned. I think it's been mentioned in reference to the Gods of the Disc.
Carpe Junglum is the vampire book, Lords and Ladies has elves. I haven't read the last two or three, but I always enjoyed Reaper Man. I think rape may have been mentioned by one of Cohens barbarians, or even Cohen himself.
Now, I've always liked the first three Disc books. The first two more than the third have that whole late 70s bizzare fantasy feel to them. Acid trip fantasy. They're pretty cool if you just relax and go for the ride.

There's sex onto the Disc, but it's always off screen. And, like I said the barbarians have a track record with rape.

Eta: Discworld is a satire/parody series, so that's the context the rape is mentioned (this is going off of memory, I'm on vacation and can't cite the books directly and won't for another day or two).

[Fire_on_High]

The Dragonriders of Pern series is rape free as far as I can recall.

It's not explicit, but it's certainly somewhat debatable about F'nor and Brekke's first time, before Wirenth's flight.

(Please don't spoil the next major event in case the OP picks Pern anyway...)

[siead_lietrathua]

I'd throw a vote in for the Dune books as well, if you like political-ish scifi. although the dune series original 7 books have an occasional rape scene, it's not an overwhelming volume. the prequel "house" series (atredies, harkonnen, corino) however do have a fair bit more, because harkonnens are assholes :P
i don't think the machine wars three do, been a while since i read those, and i havent read some of the newer books, i stopped after it hit 13 books or so.

the thing about rape scenes in any book though... they're obvious when they start. so it's easy enough to jump to the next chapter mark and pick it up from there. there are some good books that use rape as a tool of politics, power and control and don't try to make it seem "sexy", so i don't mind it in that context because it's being honest. it's the stupid books that tries to equate rape with love and "omg he just looves her that much" and excuses or glorifies the abuse that i can't stand.

[violiav]

I haven't read any rapes scenes in the Warhammer 40k books I've read. Now, that doesn't mean it doesn't exist in that universe. I mean, there's flying cyborg dead babies and demon cults.
I was about to say that I can't think of any in Star Trek, but I'm fairly certain that both Tasha Yar and Kira Nerys have both been raped. But thats background, not plot device.
It's similar in Dragonlance. Background information, not part of the plot to drive the story. I just don't recall any of them actually getting raped by orcs.

[Duelist925]

*snip*

I consider it to be a series if it's at least 2 books, I do agree that the longer a series goes the less and less story options they have so it probably will happen but if discworld is actually rapefree how many books are in that series again?

About 36~ish. Rape exists in the world, and is mentioned very occasionally, but it's never been a plot device.