What is a religion?

[Flyndaran]

I'm curious to read others' definition of religion. It's a word used all the time, but I think one that has no real set definition.
Is Mormonism a religion? Is scientology? If only one person believed something is it a religion or automatically a set of delusions? Am I sane for saying that Jesus, a greek name of a jewish rabbi that may have existed almost two millinenia ago loves you, but not sane for saying that Zeus loves you? What's the difference?

I'm a born atheist that has never "had" religion and the very concept never meshed with my psyche. I was six when I understood that the sunday school adults actually believed the stories they told us. It freaked me out and made me realize that adults could be just as full of it as any child my age. Fortunately I didn't catch any flack from my father. We had many in depth discussion about it, and even he realized that the god concept just would not fit in my head no matter how it was explained.

So help me a little with your own definitions and anecdotes, please.

[Slytovhand]

I choose to define a 'religion' as a set of beliefs one has about the nature of the universe.

Yep, incredibly broad, but that has the wonderful advantage of not being able to put one 'religion' above any other - they're all on an equal footing.

'Beliefs' then makes for the significant word... atheism therefore becomes a religion, as it is obviously about the nature of the universe, and regardless of how much scientific evidence is put forth, it is still a stack of beliefs all melded together. It is quite possible that this is all an illusion (as per Des Cartes).

I totally agree with you how some beliefs are considered perfectly normal, but others considered batshit crazy! That makes no sense to me at all (other than those beliefs which ridiculously go against what obviously happens around us - things which are logically inconsistent with real life). There are things I believe which get eyes rolled because of their lunacy, but I think things through and they make a hell of a lot more sense to me than other things! (ie - alien civilisations - if one believes in reincarnation, then there's really no reason not to believe that we have lived lives on other planets - statistically it makes far more sense than some guy born about 2 millenia ago can save your immortal soul for eternity...).

One minor anecdote - I know someone who says she is a witch, yet got offended when I called her a pagan.... sheesh!!!!!

[anriana]

I choose to define a 'religion' as a set of beliefs one has about the nature of the universe.

So Confucianism isn't a religion but atheism is?

[Flyndaran]

Could the mods correct my title typo. I meant to write "WHAT is a religion".

[Slytovhand]

So Confucianism isn't a religion but atheism is?

Not seeing the issue here...

If one made the definition reliant on 'supernatural forces', then maybe, but I don't - I just said it's about beliefs. Confucianism has just as much belief as atheism (and anything else, for that matter - since I can't see that one belief has a 'value' higher than any others).

What made you think I would see it this way???

[Flyndaran]

...
If one made the definition reliant on 'supernatural forces', then maybe, but I don't - I just said it's about beliefs. Confucianism has just as much belief as atheism (and anything else, for that matter - since I can't see that one belief has a 'value' higher than any others).
...

Atheism isn't a belief though. It's a lack of belief, so it shouldn't be called a religion. (It's a bit of a sore spot with me and others of the same non-belief as one could imagine.)

[Slytovhand]

Flyn - yep, not surprised it's a sore point

Sore point with me because atheists don't reckon that they 'believe' anything - they know!!!. Whereas, in reality, that's all any human can do (believe, that is).

Now - if one is Xtian, and therefore doesn't believe in the Hindu Gods, does that "lack of belief" make them atheist?

[anriana]

Not seeing the issue here...

If one made the definition reliant on 'supernatural forces', then maybe, but I don't - I just said it's about beliefs. Confucianism has just as much belief as atheism (and anything else, for that matter - since I can't see that one belief has a 'value' higher than any others).

What made you think I would see it this way???

Confucianism deals with leading a moral life, not the nature of the universe.

[Slytovhand]

Yes....?

Even in current circles, there is debate over whether it is considered a religion or not, given that it is a philosophy.

Personally, I see moral imperatives as being a part of the universe. At the very least, what people do, why they do it and the consequences of such actions and thoughts all fits. By 'nature of the universe', I'm not only referring to objective reality, but subjective as well.


But, this does lead to an obvious question from me.. I've defined what I call religion - what's your definition?

[Sylvia727]

A religion is a set of subjective beliefs about meaning. It answers the why of life, the universe, and everything. A religion is absurd when it contradicts known and solid science. A thousand years ago, a heliocentric (the sun as the center) religion would have been crazy, because scientists knew that the earth was the center of everything. Science and religion are two different ways of trying to explain the same thing. One looks at the how, and the other looks at the why.

Everyone's religion is just slightly different from the next person's, even two people sitting in the same church pew. Organized religion is a group of people with similiar beliefs coming together to reaffirm and discuss their religion. There are any number of unhealthy religions, from the cults that preach drinking poison to commune with aliens, to the sidestream religions that deny necessary medical treatment to children, to mainstream religions that deny divorce even to battered spouses. A red flag of an unhealthy religion is when an individual stops considering, discussing, questioning their religion and starts swallowing down whole what another person tells them.

As for whether atheism is a religion, I believe I answered that question in the I believe in atheism thread.

[Boozy]

I'm not much of a philosopher, and I haven't thought about this much, but I have trouble seeing Confucianism and Taoism as religions. They don't answer those ultimate questions - the origins of life, whether or not there is a God, and what happens after we die. There are even various forms of Buddhism that do not try to tackle these questions.

I also don't see atheism as a belief system of any sort. It doesn't require any leap of faith.

[Evandril]

My definition of 'religion' would be similar...I'd say religion is a belief structure to explain that which cannot be proven. I would also classify atheistism a religion, because it requires belief there are no dieties of any sort. Notice I didn't say no 'omnipotent' dieties, I said dieties of any sort...And the existance or non-existance of such a being I do not feel would be provable, using scientific methods...Hence it being a belief.

[AFPheonix]

But as has been discussed in another thread entirely, atheism is the utter absence of religion. It is areligious, so while it may be a belief system, it is not a religion.

[Evandril]

That depends on the definition of 'religion', which is what this thread was about, I thought? I was giving my personal opinion on it, and what I felt it included.

Edit: What *was* religion defined as in that thread? I know people who believe in various religions, and concider themselves to be religious, who do not have any 'rituals' they practice..and others who accept the Christian religion, but don't act on their beliefs....How are the classified?

[crashhelmet]

To me, a "religion" is simply a set of beliefs. It doens't require any type of higher power. Just a set of beliefs that you abide by or allow to influence you in your daily actions.

Where it gets complicated is when theologies get involved. As was earlier pointed out, theologies help answer the questions that no one had been abel to answer before. In some, they stretch out to comfort people's fear or instill fear into them to keep them on the "right" path.

Clearly hypothetical, but I see the transition from Judaism to Christianity as being a battle over the fear of death and the after life. "You need ot convert to Christianity or you're going to burn in Hell!" Last i checked, Jews didn't believe in Hell. You went to Heaven if you were good, otherwise you went to "Paradise" or sumthin like that. The different Christian Denominations all grew out of the "I don't believe that, but I believe this" mentality. They simply have a core foundation.

Buddhism doesn't teach you to follow a supreme being. It teaches you to BECOME a supreme being. If you attain the highest level of enlightenment, you become a Buddha.

They're all different. Based on my definition, I believe Atheism to be a religion. It is simply the rejection of a theology. A belief in the absence of theistic entities.

CH