DOJ Decides It Won’t Call People ‘Felons’ Or ‘Convicts’ Because Hurts Their Feelings

[mjr]

Awww...too bad...it "hurts their feelings".

http://dailycaller.com/2016/05/04/do...heir-feelings/

[KabeRinnaul]

So... they want to stop calling people who have been released from jail the same thing as people who are currently in jail, because it associated the former with the latter, hindered rehabilitation, and made it harder for former inmates to reintegrate with productive society?

I dunno. I don't think I have a problem with this.

[mjr]

So... they want to stop calling people who have been released from jail the same thing as people who are currently in jail, because it associated the former with the latter, hindered rehabilitation, and made it harder for former inmates to reintegrate with productive society?

I dunno. I don't think I have a problem with this.

There's a difference in what you said, and "it hurts their feelings".

A BIG difference. In my opinion, anyway.

[Anthony K. S.]

There's a difference in what you said, and "it hurts their feelings".

Yeah, the difference is that what KabeRinnaul said accurately reflects what the Department of Justice official actually said.

I read the Daily Caller article, as well as the actual statement by Assistant Attorney General Karol Mason in the Washington Post, and it was just as I suspected. Mason never said "because it hurts their feelings." That was just the spin that the media put on it, because it's a better way to grab the reader's attention.

Mason's argument was that using disparaging labels creates a psychological barrier that makes it harder for people who have served time to reintegrate into society. It drains their sense of self-worth, makes them believe that they will never be able to get out from under the stigma of having been in prison, and perpetuates a cycle of re-offending.

She said that using different words, creating a message of inclusion, will help give these people hope that they can re-integrate into society, while reminding them that they are being held to the expectation that they can become productive members of society.

I don't see a problem with this, either.

[Shangri-laschild]

How are these people supposed to reenter society and be lawful citizens if they aren't given a chance to try again? They were punished, now the punishment is supposed to be done so long as they don't go back to illegal things. Instead we just decide to punish them forever and then feel justified when they go back to jail.

[mjr]

How are these people supposed to reenter society and be lawful citizens if they aren't given a chance to try again? They were punished, now the punishment is supposed to be done so long as they don't go back to illegal things. Instead we just decide to punish them forever and then feel justified when they go back to jail.

You make a valid point, but the same could be said for that "Chick-Fil-A" guy who berated the girl in the drive-thru.

Dude lost his (alleged) $200K job, couldn't get a job anywhere else, and ended up divorced and on gov't assistance, if I understand correctly.

No company wanted to associate themselves with him afterward. It's the same thing.

[s_stabeler]

not quite. The Chick-Fil-A guy's troubles are a natural consequence of acting so badly- and I don't doubt that he will eventually get a job, since people will eventually forget. with people labelled felons and/or convicts, it's like society is telling them "you will never be acceptable again" and then being surprised when they reject society,

[mjr]

The Chick-Fil-A guy's troubles are a natural consequence of acting so badly

You could argue the same statement applies to a convict. Their troubles are a natural consequence of acting badly/poor decision/whatever got them convicted.

- and I don't doubt that he will eventually get a job, since people will eventually forget. with people labelled felons and/or convicts, it's like society is telling them "you will never be acceptable again" and then being surprised when they reject society,

You can be convicted of a Misdemeanor and get a job, though.

But I get what you're saying.

[s_stabeler]

Actually, the situations are indeed pretty similar. If the Chick-Fil_A guy keeps his head down, and stoops behaving like an asshole, people will forget what he did. if a convict reforms, then the same should apply.

[gremcint]

You could argue the same statement applies to a convict. Their troubles are a natural consequence of acting badly/poor decision/whatever got them convicted.

here's the thing between racial bias and minimum sentencing laws there's a lot of people that just get straight screwed by the justice system. That's not even taking into account the corrupt cops.

[KabeRinnaul]

It's not just corrupt cops, either. There's an extreme bias towards "guilty" at all levels. Cops have a confirmation bias on it (they wouldn't bring in the wrong guy to interrogate, after all), the DA has a vested interest in scoring guilty verdicts (each "win" for them proves how tough on crime they are to the electorate)...

If I was at home, I'd have about a half-dozen Cracked.com articles to link here. I might come back to it later, even.

[HYHYBT]

You could argue the same statement applies to a convict. Their troubles are a natural consequence of acting badly/poor decision/whatever got them convicted.



You can be convicted of a Misdemeanor and get a job, though.

But I get what you're saying.

People who are convicted of misdemeanors aren't generally labeled felons in the first place, so no need to stop calling them that.

[mjr]

People who are convicted of misdemeanors aren't generally labeled felons in the first place, so no need to stop calling them that.

True. But someone convicted of a misdemeanor is still considered a "convict", because they have been convicted of an offense. Correct?

But I understand what you're saying. Generally we don't look at people convicted of misdemeanors as "convicts" unless there's some sort of jail time involved.

[Lindsay B.]

The Chick-Fil-A guy's troubles are a natural consequence of acting so badly- and I don't doubt that he will eventually get a job, since people will eventually forget. with people labelled felons and/or convicts, it's like society is telling them "you will never be acceptable again" and then being surprised when they reject society,

Actually, the situations are indeed pretty similar. If the Chick-Fil_A guy keeps his head down, and stoops behaving like an asshole, people will forget what he did. if a convict reforms, then the same should apply.

Your first statement was actually closer to the truth.

People will eventually forget what the Chick-Fil-A protestor did, and as long as he doesn't mention it, he stands a good chance of getting his life back on track.

When it comes to those who have served time in prison, the law often won't let people forget. As Karol Mason noted, the American Bar Association has documented over 46,000 collateral consequences of being convicted of a crime, legal sanctions and restrictions involving employment, housing, family/domestic rights, government loans, grants, and benefits, political and civic participation (including voting rights), and other areas.

Just about every employment application I've ever seen has always asked, "Have you ever been convicted of a crime?" (They usually add that if you answer yes, it will not be "an absolute bar" to being hired.)

It would be much easier for the Chick-Fil-A protestor to conceal what he did. It's fairly common for Human Resources managers to ask, "Have you ever been fired from a job?" But in my experience, interviewers don't always ask that question. And even when they do ... Not that lying in a job interview ever bodes well for your employment prospects, but I would expect that the paper trail for this man's job dismissal would be a great deal easier to hide than a record of a criminal conviction.

[s_stabeler]

I was talking about how the situation should be- that morally, when you've been convicted of a crime, you should be in the same situation as anyone else who'se made a dumb decision. if you don't keep making dumb decisions, you should be able to forget it