Woman wants all shop staff toilets to be open to public

[Lace Neil Singer]

OK, I don't have a link cuz I heard this on the radio while travelling back from holiday. Basically, this woman phoned in to say that she was shopping with her autistic son (stress hers, not mine; she kept on using that word even tho I'm at a loss to see why it was significant) of three years old, when he said he needed the loo. So she marched into the nearest shop and demanded that they let her son use their staff loo (there were no customer toilets in the shop). They refused, so she left, outraged (her words, not mine) to attempt to find public loos. She couldn't find any, so her son wet himself.

Now, tho I see the point; it must be frustrating to be stuck with a child of any age moaning about needing the toilet, there are certain things that she hasn't considered.

1. A lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine. Yes, it's almost impossible to plan ahead in this case; kids do sometimes need the loo when you're out and about despite all efforts you have made to ensure it doesn't happen, but it's not the fault of the staff in the shop. My mum used to carry a potty around so that if one of her kids did need a wee, there was somewhere for them to go into. In any case, there are plenty of places with customer toilets, like fast food places, where you can just walk in and use the toilet without any problems. Far better to look for one of these places, than marching into the nearest shop and demanding that they bend the rules just for you. Which leads me on to the next thing.

2. Health and Safety/Security. H&S rules might state that no customers are allowed round the back; same goes for security. I'm by no means an expert on either of these, but where I work we don't allow customers round the back to use the toilet cuz a) there's a chance they might hurt themselves and therefore not be covered by insurance; b) there are shop products stored round the back and c) the office, containing the safe, a computer, various files full of secure info, the work mobile etc is round the back. It doesn't matter how pressing a customer's need for the toilet is, we can't let them round the back. While we might feel sorry for them, or their kids, the consequences should we let them round the back could be dire.

3. Damage. I'm sure that the woman who phoned in would deny to her last breath that there's a chance that her son could cause any damage to the staff toilet, but it's a sad fact that a lot of customer toilets end up being damaged by the people using them. I'm sure everyone here has horror stories of SCs destroying the toilets by peeing/defecating on the floor; finger painting; smashing mirrors; blocking toilets; stealing everything not nailed down. Why would staff want to risk their facilities being damaged, especially since it would probably be them who had to clean up said damage? Therefore, it doesn't make sense to allow customers to use staff toilets.

[Flyndaran]

I'ld bet real money that she's an entitlement ho in more ways than this.
Only places that sell food and/or drink are required to have public restrooms, I think.
It would be one thing if this ninny argued that all places have public restrooms.

[Lace Neil Singer]

Reading between the lines, I kind of got the impression that she'd kicked up a fuss when told no; altho she didn't mention doing so, the way she spoke about her experience seemed to suggest it. O.o She described the staff as being rude so I'm betting she's of the "No = rude" school of thought. -.-

[Peppergirl]

Lace, that's another thing I'm sick of lately..

(geez, I've been awfully ranty recently - lol)

I can't stand these parents that think they deserve special treatment because they have a chiiiiiiiiiiild with them. Seems like this whole entitlement attitude is getting worse too.

As to his autism, I'm not really sure if that makes a difference. Maybe rummy can provide some insight?

More than likely she was a 'no=rude' rule EW, but I'd be interested in seeing if autism makes it more urgent for a child to have to use the restroom right this second...at least more so than a non-autistic child. Interesting.

[IDrinkaRum]

As far as I know, Child Rum has no problem with going to the bathroom. It's harder, I think, to potty train them, but maybe it was my own inexperience in potty training that made it difficult for me?

There have been times she's either held it in for too long and she's peed/pooed her underwear (but that's few and far between).

However, I do know, like all children, once she says she has to go, she has to go, so I find a toilet as quickly as possible.

Also, I was thinking - there are some restaurants (mainly smaller, non-chain ones) that have signs that read "Toilets for customers only". If she went to one of those, and they said she had to buy something to use the toilet, and she didn't, then I think that's sucky on her part.

[tabbyblack13]

I've had to deal with people like this. When I worked at a gas station there were many time the toilets would break. When that happened I would always get asked if they could use the staff toilet. Then I would have to explain that there are no staff toilets. There were a lot of people that became the EWs. Of course I have at least one horror story about what the customers have done to the toilets and the restrooms.

I think that if a store is a certain size and sell food and/or drink they they are required to have a bathroom for customers. As for the "paying customers only" bathrooms, I can understand those. Restrooms are not easy or cheap to maintain.

[Rapscallion]

I heard a radio piece about something similar. I wasn't really listening too much, but I did hear about a woman causing a fuss because her child wasn't allowed to use the toilet.

There was mention of toilets in stores etc, but I think the main case involved a toilet in a job centre - it was staff only. Part of the argument was that children can't hold it in so well, so exceptions should be made for them, and part of it was that the taxpayer pays for the place, so the taxpayer should be able to use the facilities.

Rapscallion

[DesignFox]

Everyone expects everyone else to make exceptions for them. It's ridiculous. Rules are rules. You're not a special snowflake who gets to break them just because of X, Y or Z.

*If* someone breaks the rules for you, be grateful, but you certainly can't *expect* it. Plus, if you break the rules for one person, then how do you tell someone else "no"? Where do you draw the line?

I've been very grateful to the places that have allowed me to use their staff restrooms. I make sure I don't make a mess, and I always thank them before I leave. But, I certainly don't expect it, and if the answer is "no" I accept that answer and move on!

No one else is reponsible for my "potty emergency".

[Lace Neil Singer]

Part of the argument was that children can't hold it in so well, so exceptions should be made for them, and part of it was that the taxpayer pays for the place, so the taxpayer should be able to use the facilities.

Rapscallion

Which is a pile of pants; using that argument, I guess that since I'm a taxpayer too, I can walk right into the jobcentre and use their staff coffee machine out the back. Cuz, like, I'm a taxpayer, right? I really hate arguments like that; it's almost as bad as "I pay your wages blah blah so you should let me have a refund even tho I forgot the receipt and have no proof I bought it at your store!"

As for "children can't hold it in well"; time they learned. Might not be fair, but life's not fair and there are adults who can't hold it in well for whatever reason; for example, the elderly. Fact is, rules are rules and for everyone, not everyone cept you and your precious little snowflake. That goes for this woman and the one in my post. -.-

[Sylvia727]

In the Midwest, and I assume the entire USA, restaurants are required to have bathrooms available to their customers. The definition of "restaurant" gets a bit technical; a coffee bar in a bookstore needs a bathroom, but a fast food station inside a department store does not (maybe because customers could use the department store's bathrooms?).

So why couldn't this woman take her kid to a fast food joint or a bigbox retailer? Someplace that would actually have public bathrooms? And if they were "customers-only" and wouldn't ease up for the needy three-year-old, which I have trouble imagining, then just buy the ninety cent fountain drink or the sixty cent candy bar. Instead, she kicks up a fuss because the rules were enforced. Boo hoo. Take responsbility for your own parenting and track down an available bathroom for your kid. If that doesn't happen in time, then clean him up, learn your lesson, and move on.

When any of my mom's kids had a potty emergency and there were no public bathrooms around (usually during road trips), she'd pull off the side of the road. If we were too little to do it by ourselves, she'd pull down our pants, hold us under the armpits and brace our feet on the car bumper. Now granted, it may be harder to convince an autistic child to do something unusual or outside of the routine. But don't blame anyone else for that.

[Boozy]

Which is a pile of pants; using that argument, I guess that since I'm a taxpayer too, I can walk right into the jobcentre and use their staff coffee machine out the back. Cuz, like, I'm a taxpayer, right?

Or, taken to the very extreme, calling up a government employee and demanding the use of their car, since your tax dollars pay their salary.

There are liability reasons why every washroom in every store or workplace can't be open to the public. I'd like to think that people would be kind and allow a desperate parent with a young child to use their washroom, but you really only have to get burned once before you think twice about being nice.

[guywithashovel]

During my life, I have only worked in one retail setting, and fortunately, that retail setting had public restrooms. If I did work somewhere that did not have restrooms available to the public, I would make sure I knew of the nearest place that did.

This would be a really hard situation for me. Initially, I would be inclined to say, "Sorry, we don't have a public restroom." However, on the other hand, I know enough about kids to know that when they have to go, they really have to go (most of the time). And I know that if the kid were to wet his pants while Mooooomy was standing there bitching about my store's policy, I would look like a total asshole, and Moooooomy would probably call corporate on me, and corporate would probably side with her, even though I was merely following the policy that THEY set. Back when I worked at the aforementioned retail setting, I used to run into this while processing WIC orders, though no one ever called corporate on me. Often, customers would get a type of cereal that they weren't supposed to get, or they would get 37oz of something when they were only allowed 36oz, or something else like that. I would stick to the WIC rules, the customer would get tetchy, and I would look like a petty jerk. Then again, I was probably a bit more of a stickler when it came to WIC than I would be with staff-only restrooms, and this is for reasons that would take this thread too far OT.

In some circumstances, I would probably let people use the staff restrooms. (e.g. if the kid was doing the "I have to go" dance and the parent was polite and diplomatic.)

[Lace Neil Singer]

The problem with doing that is that if any damage occurs or if liddle pwecious gets hurt, it'll be on your head. Also, I refuse to believe that this woman and her child were miles away from either a fast food place or a public toilet. The fact is that you can not let members of the public go unattended round the back area; and if you accompany them, how do you know that it's not just a ruse to get you off the shop floor so that their accomplice can shoplift in comfort? The sad fact is, like Boozy said, being nice could bite you in the arse; as for complaining to corporate, that's unlikely to hold any water if you ended up losing your job over it. You'd have a very good case to take them to a tribunal, which would cost them a lot more than if they just handed out a gift card and put the person's complaint in the idiot file. Personally, I'd rather be thought of as a bitch rather than let a member of the public round the back when it compromises both health and safety and security regulations.

[Slytovhand]

<snip> that's unlikely to hold any water

hahahahaha - oh, you mean that wasn't supposed to be a pun??

When any of my mom's kids had a potty emergency and there were no public bathrooms around

Ah, you see, there's the issue! People have become 21st century snowflakes! Global warming is threatening our ability to get everything we want - right now!!!!! <stamps foot>

Gone are the days of actually, you know, having to be responsible for our actions and the consequences arising from them...

[pile of monkeys]

I can't stand these parents that think they deserve special treatment because they have a chiiiiiiiiiiild with them. Seems like this whole entitlement attitude is getting worse too.

The fact is, it seems many parents these days excpect rules to not apply to them simply because they're parents. I mean, congratulations, you've managed to (somewhat) successfully breed. So has every existing species, up to and including a large portion of the hugely overpopulated human race. How, exactly, does that make you special? How does that exempt you from not using staff bathrooms, having to follow return policies, having to show basic common courtesy in public places, and why do you think that having produced offspring makes you so damn special that you can do anything you want and everyone else has to just take it because you have a widdle tiny pwecious BEBEBEBEBEEEEE with you? You aren't special. There are 6 and a half billion people just like you and your precious goddamn snowflake on this planet. Accept your sheer ordinary-ness and move on. And plan better. Kids often have to pee. Have a plan.