Bullying

[Nyoibo]

I think you just want to make this all about you.

You know, I want to believe that that was tongue in cheek, but too many years on the internet have taught me better.

[violetyoshi]

I think you're embarrassed and are now trying to backpedal. That's okay. I'll let you gracelessly deflect and bow out now.

What do I have to be embarrassed of? I'm not the one who's decided to make how someone else chooses to go through life, their personal issue.

[Nyoibo]

What do I have to be embarrassed of? I'm not the one who's decided to make how someone else chooses to go through life, their personal issue.

Yes you have, if someone else decides to go through life not accepting that Aspergers or anything else should be used as a crutch and expect special treatment you rail against them.

I'm sure if I say that my view of it is "Harden the fuck up princess*, life's tough, the worlds a mean and nasty place and it's not going to change just for you, so deal with it" you'd be all over me and taking it personally.


*probably only Australians will get the reference.

[violetyoshi]

Well, there have been other cases where society has been intolerant of others who have had struggles. I believe I used the example of people in wheelchairs and how they used to be denied available access to places.

There have been many situations where society was intolerant towards people who they felt were "other", and then later realized that they are people too just different than them.

I'm not asking the world to change for me, I'm simply suggesting that people with Asperger's Syndrome shouldn't be expected to put up with emotional abuse in public school. I guess everyone has to, so it'd ridiculous of me to complain about it right?

I am curious, what is that quote in reference to? The only Australian cultural references I know, are from Rocko's Modern Life, lol.

[Lace Neil Singer]

When I left my first school due to bullying, I went to a non mainstream school instead; my parents fought hard to get me a place there, cuz it was small and places were hard to come by. Looking back now, I'm sure that a lot of people who went to that school were undiagnosed Aspies, just like I was; I only got my diagnosis late in life, a couple of years ago. I did a lot better at that school than at the other; and also at college, too.

[the_std]

I'm not asking the world to change for me, I'm simply suggesting that people with Asperger's Syndrome shouldn't be expected to put up with emotional abuse in public school. I guess everyone has to, so it'd ridiculous of me to complain about it right?

But it's not as easy as you seem to think it is. Everyone in this world has to put up with emotional abuse and yes, it does happen to most people in school. Children are cruel creatures. It would be impossible to fully stop without changing the very basis of human nature. Yes, it would be nice to have a major overhaul of the societal values that lead to said bullying (praising brawn over brains, priorities of sports over intellectual pursuits, the ideal of beauty), but that just is not going to happen all at once. It is especially not going to happen if we go around blaming everyone under the sun.

So all that you can do are two things. One, become a bullying advocate and lobby for reform in bullying tolerances in schools or, two, deal with the bits that you can, try to adapt, change, take responsibility for yourself and recognize that society isn't "out to get you", you are simply different and people fear what is different.

[violetyoshi]

So all that you can do are two things. One, become a bullying advocate and lobby for reform in bullying tolerances in schools or, two, deal with the bits that you can, try to adapt, change, take responsibility for yourself and recognize that society isn't "out to get you", you are simply different and people fear what is different.

So explain this to me, how "society isn't out to get me" yet people fear people who are different. Isn't fear what breeds intolerance and prejudice, which cause people to be hostile to those who are different?

[Flyndaran]

So explain this to me, how "society isn't out to get me" yet people fear people who are different. Isn't fear what breeds intolerance and prejudice, which cause people to be hostile to those who are different?

So you are demanding that children stop being human?
Bullying should be stopped where and when it can. Pushing and any form of violence toward the different, which has very little to do with real differences in most cases, should be curtailed. But trying to stop all negative socializing is impossible. You can't make kids play, or even interact, with someone they don't want to.
My girlfriend was mercilessly bullied for no discernable reason whatsover, while socially awkward fat kid I wasn't.

[Akasa]

I was bullied from pre-school till high school. That's when the rage finally took hold. There were fights with bullies, but for the most part I was about causing them grief they couldn't trace to anyone. Slashed tires in the school parking lot during first period(my period off), shaving cream and toothpaste all over their paint job, glue in the key holes, trash all in their car if they were stupid enough not to lock their doors or leave a window down, shaving cream in their lockers, stealing their lunches if they were foolish enough not to lock their lockers, or watching them and learning their combinations and stealing from them, do the same to their girlfriends.(it was ALWAYS guys who picked on me.)
I was a good student, a honor roll, advanced classes student, and teachers liked me. I almost got caught once and the teacher knew me so was sure it was someone else who did it and I was just in the wrong place at the wrong time. When I get cornered and enraged tears start flowing. I may have just hospitalized a football player, but I'm crying and shaking. It was always the bully who got in trouble for me getting in fights with them.(I should note I was not quite 5' and under 100 lbs.) Teachers would take my side and I'd get off scotch free.
Note it took till high school. Thats over 10 years of bullying till I snapped. I have been diagnosed w/ PTSD. The strangest things trigger a flash back and cause the adrenalin to start pumping.
Schools are trying to say they are cracking down on bullying, but bullys are good at doing things where they won't be seen. Unfortunately teachers don't want to take a student's word for it that they've been bullied. Technically schools have a zero tollerance policy these days, but I don't believe it. A school teacher would have to pipe up here for us to really know how its supposed to be handled these days.

[violetyoshi]

So you are demanding that children stop being human?
Bullying should be stopped where and when it can. Pushing and any form of violence toward the different, which has very little to do with real differences in most cases, should be curtailed. But trying to stop all negative socializing is impossible. You can't make kids play, or even interact, with someone they don't want to.
My girlfriend was mercilessly bullied for no discernable reason whatsover, while socially awkward fat kid I wasn't.

You consider sadists to be human beings? Not all children have the drive to hurt others to make themselves feel better.

I was diagnosed with PTSD after high school. I also get flashbacks sometimes, and I'll "zone out" it's really weird. Like it'll be a couple seconds later and I'll be like, "Huh? What?"

Going to public school shouldn't result in being diagnosed with the same thing that war veterans get diagnosed with.

[shroo]

A school teacher would have to pipe up here for us to really know how its supposed to be handled these days.

From my experience it basically goes:
1. In class management (detention and the like). If that doesn't work--
2. Contact parents. A lot of kids are products of their environment so this doesn't always work, so you might have to--
3. Get Administration involved. This can be class switching, suspension, expelling a student, whatever. They are the top of the food chain.

It's actually a lot harder to spot bullying than you may think. I know it is really obvious to the bullied and those around the bullied, but step back a bit--I worked at a school with over 800 kids, in between periods I stood in the hallway and tried to essentially police students as they passed from class to class: "Hey! Watch the language!" "Boys--keep your hands to yourself!" More often than not I would yell at kids to stop horsing around and insulting each other because I couldn't tell if they were serious or not and fuck it--I'm erring on the side of caution. The sad thing is, it seems like once bullies get to the high school level they are smart enough not to get caught--they'll quietly kick the chair you sit in so when you turn around and screech for them to knock it off guess who gets in trouble? Again, this is what I've seen/heard from students.
Not to mention most bullying now takes place on myspace and facebook. Unless someone is typing up an insult in my class, I can't do anything. I can tell the administration what I heard is going on, but schools don't really have any authority over websites. We can try--but we need help from parents and students alike...not that easy.
I wish bullies came with flashing neon signs and always made a point to act out right in front of an authority figure, it would make my life a hell of a lot easier.
Then again no one was dumb enough to act out in front of me because I was a scary little bitch when I was mad. Most students knew better, and knew if they needed a safe haven they could come to my room.

Schools do not condone bullying, but it can be hard without support from parents....or the administration. I'm not going to say the system is perfect, there are a lot of holes. Supposedly a student can go to guidance/administration whenever there is a problem, but unfortunately with the abuse of the system and the occasional "not my child" parent what should happen falls short.

[Pedersen]

Not to mention most bullying now takes place on myspace and facebook. Unless someone is typing up an insult in my class, I can't do anything. I can tell the administration what I heard is going on, but schools don't really have any authority over websites. We can try--but we need help from parents and students alike...not that easy.

Heh. You might be interested in how schools are acting outside their authority in just the way you say they can't. Too many links for me to link to one specifically. Too many cases.

They might not be able, but they sure as hell are trying when it suits them. Of course, the only times it suits the school administration to even try (usually) is when the content is against the school administration. When it's student vs student? Well, boys will be boys...

[Lace Neil Singer]

Or girls will be girls. I have only had trouble with bullies in the all girls school secondary I went to; both my mixed primary, the mixed school I went to after leaving the all girls school and college were fine. I'd say that girls are worse than boys as far as bullying goes; the girls at my school mostly used verbal and threats.

[Boozy]

You consider sadists to be human beings? Not all children have the drive to hurt others to make themselves feel better.

All young children are sadists to some extent. Most of them grow out of it, and relatively quickly.

[shroo]

I did say the system was flawed. I did say what was supposed to happen doesn't always happen.
Honestly, I'm sure there are plenty of cases where the school stepped in to help a student who has been bullied, even online, that haven't been jumped on by the media.
Unfortunately not nearly enough, though, I'm sure....


And yeah, it does break my heart.