maybe now fertility clincs will think twice

[BroomJockey]

a priviledge that can or should be restricted by common sense.

Actually, common sense is exactly what it should be restricted by. No laws, just someone with a modicum of brain power saying to themselves "You know, there's a good chance I won't survive to see this child graduate. I probably shouldn't spend every dime I have on popping out a kid."

[Flyndaran]

Actually, common sense is exactly what it should be restricted by. No laws, just someone with a modicum of brain power saying to themselves "You know, there's a good chance I won't survive to see this child graduate. I probably shouldn't spend every dime I have on popping out a kid."

If we could really promote such a wonderful but nonexistant concept as common sense, then we could probably solve most of the world's problems.

[DesignFox]

I know this is an unpopular viewpoint, but I don't think procreating is a god-given right.

If you can't, there are a number of reasons for it. Depending on what those reasons are, I don't think you should.

If you've hit menopause, you shouldn't. Your body is telling you that you can't handle it, anymore.

If there is a severe genetic defect that you have that prevents you from having children, and you know this defect will be passed to your child, and you know it will cause complications during pregnancy for you or your child...you shouldn't have IVF just so you can give birth to one.

You don't have a job or means to support children? You shouldn't be actively trying to reproduce, let alone putting yourself in the poor house for IVF.

I don't think government should step in. Mostly because, unfortunately, there is no law against selfishness or stupidity. But these doctors should have some goddamn sense and deny treatment to these imbeciles.

You know what? I'm sorry if a person wants nothing more than to give birth to a baby. But life isn't fucking fair. We all have our problems. We all have things we want in life that we can't get. All of us to some degree or another have a personality problem or health problem we wish we didn't have to deal with.

You know what? Deal with it.

That being said, I have no problem with a couple wanting a baby that maybe has some slight trouble. Say, perfectly healthy and otherwise normal, but sperm can't get to the egg for some reason. Or, the couple or woman needs to enlist a sperm donor or egg donor. Or even if the couple wants to hire a surrogate. Or even if the person or couple is well off enough to afford IVF and afford the results of said treatment- assuming of course they aren't over child bearing age- and there is no serious risk of complication to the mother or child.

THOSE things I see reason for seeking treatment. They are easy enough for the woman and child to go through and don't have an above average risk of serious health complications or seek to put a strain on an already over burdened social assistance program.

But you know. Who cares. I can have a baby if I want. Fuck society. Fuck the kid if I die. Fuck the rest of my family. IT'S MY RIGHT!!!11!!!

Yes this angers me.

[BroomJockey]

If we could really promote such a wonderful but nonexistant concept as common sense.

I hear in strange lands, in times gone by, they've come up with a miraculous concept, called... edjamukacion. It's supposed to provide people with basic critical thinking skills, knowledge of cause and effect, and other information about basic structures and concepts.

[AdminAssistant]

I know this is an unpopular viewpoint, but I don't think procreating is a god-given right.

I totally agree, DesignFox.

I really, honestly, do not understand the urge to spread out your DNA. Having a baby? Yes. If you can't have one biologically, guess what? There are many babies out there that need good, loving homes that you can foster or adopt. If someone is deemed healthy enough to carry a carry a child to term and raise it to adulthood, weighing factors like age, lifestyle, income, etc., and can afford the IVF and fertility treatments, then groovy. But insurance shouldn't pay for it. And post-menopausal women shouldn't be having babies. I can't even imagine how much that would screw up your hormones.

Heck, I don't even want a baby, and if I did want a child, I would adopt one. Who wants to go through, *ick*, pregnancy? *shudder* No way in hell I'm putting my body through that.

[DesignFox]

I totally agree, DesignFox.

<snip>

Heck, I don't even want a baby, and if I did want a child, I would adopt one. Who wants to go through, *ick*, pregnancy? *shudder* No way in hell I'm putting my body through that.

Yay, someone understands and agrees with me!

Also, I really don't want to go through pregnancy either. Thought scares the hell outta me. My body has enough issues, I don't want to add the weight gain (shit it took a lot of work just to lose 15 lbs and feel comfortable in my skin again), organ squishing, nutrient leeching stress of bearing a child, thanks.

Then again, I also don't want children. I think if my mind goes crazy, I might prefer to adopt. But, I'm human and fickle. Who knows what I'll want in 5 years.

Though truth be told, I think I'll still only want what I want now...horsies!

[Cat]

Agreed...I dislike fertility treatments greatly (then again, I am biased...I am adopted! )


As ya'll know, I'm one of those gals who doesn't wants kids.....pregnancy kinda freaks me out (plus I don't want to give up booze, caffeine, or fish)

[DesignFox]

Agreed...I dislike fertility treatments greatly (then again, I am biased...I am adopted! )

<snip>

One of my good friends throughout High School and college was adopted, as was his sister. I never knew why his parents did not have children of their own (by choice, fertility issues, no clue) But I always thought it was cool that they took two kids who were (in their cases, anyway) unwanted by their biological parents, and gave them a loving home.

[Cat]

Yup, my worthless (thats for another thread) brother and I are both adopted (and not biologically related!!)

But then again, I have no right to tell people what they can and cannot do to their own bodies....but one would *hope* common sense would factor in.....

[joe hx]

I really, honestly, do not understand the urge to spread out your DNA.

some say it gives people a sense of immortality.

it also seems that the point of life is to create more life. i'm not talking philosophical here. all life reproduces, all species seem to have an innate desire to reproduce.

[BlaqueKatt]

Also, I really don't want to go through pregnancy either. Thought scares the hell outta me. My body has enough issues, I don't want to add the weight gain (shit it took a lot of work just to lose 15 lbs and feel comfortable in my skin again), organ squishing, nutrient leeching stress of bearing a child, thanks.

forget that-think of the midnight feedings, diaper changes, potty training-I've been through all that-if I ever want another kid it will be adoption and a kid over the age of 4.

[RecoveringKinkoid]

I realize that this is probably not the norm, and a lot of women have problems, but I felt like a goddess when I was pregnant.

That's not to say I was completely comfortable. I wasn't, it was a hot summer. But overall, for the most part, I kind of dug it. And I liked my body. I felt beautiful.

So, DesignFox, it's not an automatic sentence of physical horror. I mean, everyone's different, but I guess some women at least don't find it so bad.

[LeChatNoir]

Heck, I don't even want a baby, and if I did want a child, I would adopt one. Who wants to go through, *ick*, pregnancy? *shudder* No way in hell I'm putting my body through that.

I'm 12 weeks pregnant...and I totally agree. It sucks. Don't get me wrong, I want the child I'm having (unplanned though it is), but pregnancy blows. At least so far. I'm still waiting for the magic glowy part of it.

Anyway, I feel so bad for those little twins. That woman was not in her right mind, imo...if she couldn't think past her own desire to be a mother, to what would be best for any children she might have. And to commit fraud in order to become a mother? That seems to cheapen the whole thing. 66 year old women don't need to be giving birth. Adoption is there for a reason. Fostering is there for a reason.

Guh, the whole thing just pisses me off.

[Cat]

I do feel bad for those twins, wonder if we'll keep hearing about them as the years progress

[Boozy]

If someone were to ask those twins in twenty years, "Did your mother make the right decision in having IVF at that age?", I suspect they'd be fully in support of it.

That doesn't mean everyone everywhere should start having babies, but when it comes to human lives and the ability to procreate, nothing is black-and-white.