maybe now fertility clincs will think twice

[Flyndaran]

you had better let the medical community know that-they're under the impression that menopause is when the ovaries are totally depleted of eggs.

Menopause

"What causes menopause?

A woman is born with a finite number of eggs, which are stored in the ovaries. The ovaries also produce the hormones estrogen and progesterone, which regulate menstruation and ovulation. Menopause occurs when the ovaries are totally depleted of eggs and no amount of stimulation from the regulating hormones can force them to work. "
....

That's not what causes menopause. Menopause may cause that.
Menopause is caused hormonally. You don't have that limited number of eggs. Also, woman continue to produce eggs after birth unlike what so many were taught.
So google isn't always right.

...
And you are not entitled to any of my money to support your progeny when you kick off 'cause your dumb arse had kids when you were physically unfit to do so, and it's my personal freedom to have fewer unhoused rugrats running around because some fucking idiot put her desire to shoot living beings from her crotch instead of using her brain. This woman in absolutely no way was fit to be a parent, either physically (dying proved that), or mentally (bankrupting herself proved that). If she'd managed to have a kid just by fucking every sailor in port, then I'd hail a medical miracle of natural conception so late in life, then call her an idiot still for having kids so late in life. But at least she'd have had money to look after them, instead of creating a burden on an already stressed social-safety net.

Did dying prove my father was unfit? No.
I still say that reproduction is a human right. You see it as a priviledge to be limited as you so wish. I don't see any line of technology before which is okahy no matter what, and after is a horrible no no.
Technology is just as much part of humanity as inheritable genetics.
Even in a socialized healthy care society you are forced to pay for others bad decisions. Do you not give emergency treatment to drunk drivers? Do you not allow birth control, because they would otherwise make the bad decision to have sex anyway? I doubt it.
Either way, I doubt any of us are willing to change what appear to be fundamental frames of reference.

[BlaqueKatt]

wrong thread somehow

[BlaqueKatt]

That's not what causes menopause. Menopause may cause that.
Menopause is caused hormonally. You don't have that limited number of eggs. Also, woman continue to produce eggs after birth unlike what so many were taught.
So google isn't always right.

lol what

webmd
What Causes Menopause?

A woman is born with a finite number of eggs, which are stored in the ovaries. The ovaries also produce the hormones estrogen and progesterone, which regulate menstruation and ovulation. Menopause occurs when the ovaries no longer produce an egg every month and menstruation stops.

Mayo clinic
Menopause begins naturally when your ovaries start making less estrogen and progesterone, the hormones that regulate menstruation. The process gets under way in your late 30s. By that time, fewer potential eggs are ripening in your ovaries each month, and ovulation is less predictable. Also, the post-ovulation surge in progesterone — the hormone that prepares your body for pregnancy — becomes less dramatic. Your fertility declines, perhaps partially due to these hormonal effects.

so you're saying the mayo clinic and about 50 other medical references are wrong-but you have nothing to back it up-yeah I'll believe that-especially since I'm currently in perimenopause myself.

[Flyndaran]

...
so you're saying the mayo clinic and about 50 other medical references are wrong-but you have nothing to back it up-yeah I'll believe that-especially since I'm currently in perimenopause myself.

They disagree with the more modern real world studies I've read and seen.
No tissue is truly limited in number. Even brain cells reproduce slowly when they were thought limited after childhood.
I suck at research skill.

http://www.livescience.com/health/05...on_growth.html
http://www.physorg.com/news154020997.html

http://www.newscientist.com/article/...treatment.html
This suggests that it's something other than having an empty egg carton that leads to menopause.

[BroomJockey]

No tissue is truly limited in number.

I believe that ovaries are different in that the eggs are already there from birth, the body just ripens and prepares one each month. They're never actually produced once the ovaries are finished growing.

[Flyndaran]

I believe that ovaries are different in that the eggs are already there from birth, the body just ripens and prepares one each month. They're never actually produced once the ovaries are finished growing.

I could have sworn I heard of a study that suggested they did. But since I can't find the darn thing, I'll have to just suffer your disbelief.

[Pedersen]

Just because you might pay for it in some way, does not give you the right to chip away at my human rights.

I believe in personal freedoms trumping everything butothers' rights when verifiablly proven and only when it isn't against fundamental human rights to life, reproduction, marriage, etc.

It's always amusing when somebody manages to make two contradictory statements in a public forum. It's more amusing when those posts are so very close together. The only way it would have been more amusing is for them to be one after the other in the same post.

So, let's see: We have the individual freedoms to do something with your life, to be successful, to pull yourself to the top of the heap and actually enjoy the fruits of your labors. Unless someone else needs the fruits of your labors, in which case, tough shit, your rights to those fruits is taken away to give someone else the basic human rights that you thought you had.

Bravo, Flyn. Bravo. What's next, tea and no tea simultaneously?

[BroomJockey]

I could have sworn I heard of a study that suggested they did. But since I can't find the darn thing,

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/ar...tudy_suggests/

Five years ago, someone found out that mice keep growing new eggs. Still no evidence that human women do.

[the_std]

I believe that ovaries are different in that the eggs are already there from birth, the body just ripens and prepares one each month. They're never actually produced once the ovaries are finished growing.

This is true. Females actually have all the eggs they will ever produce in their bodies before they're born.

[Flyndaran]

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/ar...tudy_suggests/

Five years ago, someone found out that mice keep growing new eggs. Still no evidence that human women do.

In other cases it's normally assumed that experiments on non-humans apply to humans UNTIL they are proven not to apply.
Though I would be more sure if the study was done on primates.
But evolutionarily it would make more sense for humans to have this ability than mice not less.

[Nyoibo]

I know this is an unpopular viewpoint, but I don't think procreating is a god-given right.

I see it as a God given right, and if you can't have a kid, God has spoken damn it "The Lord giveth and the Lord taketh away".

[BroomJockey]

In other cases it's normally assumed that experiments on non-humans apply to humans UNTIL they are proven not to apply.

Noooo... that's only if it's a new theory, not disproving a standard already accepted.

[AdminAssistant]

Well, let's look at it this way. If you shuffle off your mortal coil while your children are minors, then the state has to pay to house them and find them new homes. Therefore, the state has the right to have some say in who goes to ridiculous extremes to reproduce.

Y'know, it reminds me of the Extreme Makeover: Home Edition when a family had four kids with a chronic genetic condition. I don't remember what it was, but it was pretty rare and very expensive to treat. My question....if you had one child with a severe genetic condition, wouldn't you stop having kids? I can't even begin to understand the logic. One of my friends actually wants to have a kid after she finishes her dissertation, and her husband does, too, but he's absolutely terrified that he'll pass on the cleft lip he had as a child. (It was pretty severe, and the scar is still very noticable).

[Boozy]

I could have sworn I heard of a study that suggested they did. But since I can't find the darn thing, I'll have to just suffer your disbelief.

Flyndaran may be correct. Very recent studies indicate that women might produce more eggs throughout their adult lives.

http://jezebel.com/5209853/research-...eggs-as-adults

However, these findings have yet to be proven.

The generally accepted theory has always been that women are born with a finite number of eggs in their ovaries and once they run out, they hit menopause. At the very least, the studies show that this theory is a little too pat.

[Flyndaran]

I see it as a God given right, and if you can't have a kid, God has spoken damn it "The Lord giveth and the Lord taketh away".

Even jokingly, I don't appreciate the inclusion of religion into a potentially legal thread.

Well, let's look at it this way. If you shuffle off your mortal coil while your children are minors, then the state has to pay to house them and find them new homes. Therefore, the state has the right to have some say in who goes to ridiculous extremes to reproduce.

No it doesn't. It doesn't get to dictate human rights. Procreation is a human right. I accept that advanced technology is not a human right. I suppose if she could pay for it, then I woudn't have even a slight problem with her, in my opinion bad, decision.

Y'know, it reminds me of the Extreme Makeover: Home Edition when a family had four kids with a chronic genetic condition. I don't remember what it was, but it was pretty rare and very expensive to treat. My question....if you had one child with a severe genetic condition, wouldn't you stop having kids? I can't even begin to understand the logic. One of my friends actually wants to have a kid after she finishes her dissertation, and her husband does, too, but he's absolutely terrified that he'll pass on the cleft lip he had as a child. (It was pretty severe, and the scar is still very noticable).

I don't believe cleft palates are genetic. They are a devolopmental hiccough.
Intentionally having deformed children is a horribly bad decision. But it's their decision to make. Fighting that right/urge will always be a losing battle. Evolution will always win out.