Arby's refuses to feed homeless couple

[AFPheonix]

I understand why the manager wouldn't let them work for liability reasons. That's completely understandable. And it's possible this wasn't the first time these guys had come sniffing around for something, either.

What I don't understand is why didn't the person who felt the need to write the article didn't pony up a few bucks for some sandwiches for the couple if he was so concerned about it. That would have been by far the best solution.

[powerboy]

I do not blame Arby's for refusing to let them work or to give them food. If they did work, there is that possibility that one would get hurt. Then they would sue and would win. Then if the manager did give them free food, then he could have been in trouble for doing that. Plus there could be the chance that every other beggar would come doing the same thing to get free food or money.

[RecoveringKinkoid]

Last time I bought a homeless person food he commented on my breasts. Fun times.

Awesome. See? There's some freaking gratitude right there.

And they wonder why nobody wants anything to do with them.

[blas87]

It could be that, Kinkoid.

Or it could be that more often than not, they won't accept directions to a food pantry or soup kitchen or homeless shelter, they'd rather just bum smokes and money off of people.

[smileyeagle1021]

Oh, genuinely desperate people love me... the rest hate me. The two most common beg tactics I hear are "I need bus money" or "I need money for food" so I've gotten in the habit of carrying no cash, but then having my credit cards and a few transit tokens... and you can tell if the guy is legit when he asks for bus money and sometimes they genuinely are happy when you say "sorry, I don't have any extra cash, but I do have an extra day pass" or "sorry, don't have any cash, but I can run over to McDonalds if you'd like". Granted, the vast majority of the time they'll give me a dirty look and say no, I need the money... but on that one off time when the person's eyes light up with joy that they got that much needed bus pass or meal makes it worthwhile (then again, I'm also guilty of telling the really obnoxious ones that church welfare services are at 8th south and 8th west)

Oh, back to Arbys... don't blame them in the least... Arbys isn't a charity, they aren't in the business of feeding the poor, they are in the business of making money by selling sandwhich goodness.

[RecoveringKinkoid]

Exactly. And around here, they tend to do that because the local shelters have the audacity to require people they are helping to stay sober and drug free, and also to accept help seeking work.

I know, the nerve, right?

[ben_who]

I'm a liberal, my friend is a neocon. We were both walking down the street when we were panhandled. As happens in our fair city, you can't walk down the street for five minutes without someone begging money off you.

We both gave our excuses and pardoned ourselves from the scene. Afterwards, she admitted to me that she felt bad that she hadn't handed over any money. Meanwhile, I was the one thinking, "Aw, get a job, ya bum."

To repeat: I'm a liberal, my friend is a neocon. So...yeah.

Then I got to thinking about it a bit more. Our city provides a network of social services including homeless shelters, soup kitchens, and job programs, as well as financial assistance and life training. They also provide rehabilitation programs.

All of these things are paid for by a combination of tax dollars, corporate sponsorships, and charitable organizations. I fully support the use of my tax dollars going to support welfare organizations. My friend, on the other hand, doesn't support the use of tax dollars for any purpose under the sun. The very idea of paying the price of living in civilized society is abhorrent to her. Nor does she donate to charity.

So it can be argued that I don't hand money to panhandlers because I would prefer that the money I do give, through my taxes and charitable donations, go through appropriate channels. The idea is that this way, I avoid walking down the street with a trail of panhandlers following me, none of which I can really help in any material way. My handing them a buck isn't going to lift them out of their dire straits, but my handing that same buck to the Salvation Army might contribute towards them getting a hot meal and a place to sleep tonight, as well as access to whatever job programs the Salvation Army might make available to the homeless.

This could just be me trying to rationalize that Miss Conservative and I had each other's expected reactions to a panhandler. Still, I think it's a good rationale. I don't expect the safety net to catch everyone, but I think it'll catch more people than dropping a quarter in a tin cup.

Love, Who?

[Flyndaran]

Exactly. And around here, they tend to do that because the local shelters have the audacity to require people they are helping to stay sober and drug free, and also to accept help seeking work.

I know, the nerve, right?

Of course, because drug addiction is so easy to just quit. It's a mental illness, and I doubt you would tell someone like me with crippling anxiety to just get over it. Treatement and medication just doesn't cut if for many people.

[BroomJockey]

Treatement and medication just doesn't cut if for many people.

Then what else IS THERE? Are we to magically wipe away their addiction? If treatment doesn't help someone's addiction, then there's only three choices
1. Isolate that person in an asylum, since they are incurable, and the nature of addiction is such that they'll inevitably take actions to satisfy that, in increasing severity. So to protect society, we need to make sure these people do not go around stealing and worse to satisfy that addition.

2. Freely give them however much is required to satiate their addiction. Which will eventually lead them to OD, due to the diminishing returns of narcotics/alcohol/etc as the body becomes used to the drug. So we're basically funding people to destroy themselves.

3. Completely abandon them, leave them to their addictions, and whatever they need to do in order to get their next fix, society takes no responsibility for, except for breach of laws.

For the record, #3 is basically what we do now, except the subset of "can't be cured" is expanded to "doesn't want to be cured." So why should we waste resources on those who refuse to/ are unable to kick an addiction? There's a limited amount that society is prepared or able to do to help those who need it. Why is making sure these people aren't squandering the efforts provided by making their situation worse a bad thing?

[Flyndaran]

...
For the record, #3 is basically what we do now, except the subset of "can't be cured" is expanded to "doesn't want to be cured." So why should we waste resources on those who refuse to/ are unable to kick an addiction? There's a limited amount that society is prepared or able to do to help those who need it. Why is making sure these people aren't squandering the efforts provided by making their situation worse a bad thing?

Who really doesn't want to be cured? Most of those probably think that it's impossible so why not delude themselves into thinking they don't want to change.
What should be done for me, then? My medication and therapy just keep me from twitching in the closet. I can't get a job, have horrible trouble just taking out the garbage, sometimes have attacks that buzz my metabolsim so much I once lost 13 pounds in 9 days even after accounting for water weight.
If it weren't for my mother paying for everything even though I turned 35 today, I would be on the streets or dead by now.

[BroomJockey]

Who really doesn't want to be cured? Most of those probably think that it's impossible so why not delude themselves into thinking they don't want to change.
What should be done for me, then? My medication and therapy just keep me from twitching in the closet. I can't get a job, have horrible trouble just taking out the garbage, sometimes have attacks that buzz my metabolsim

You'd be surprised about who doesn't want to be cured. Tends to be people who think the drugs are helping them with a problem more than conventional treatment would, or people who think they like how the drugs make them feel.

As for you, you're on prescription medication for a diagnosed problem. I don't really see how you're like an addict refusing to get clean. In Canada, you'd likely qualify for a program along the lines of AISH (Assured income for the severely handicapped). Maybe not that specific program, since I think it applies to physical handicaps, but there are social programs out there to assist you already. If you WERE on the street, then I'd place the same conditions on you I do on anyone else. Get you on to a proper treatment program, kick any "recreational" drugs you were on: alcohol; crack; meth; etc. Once you're off those and somewhat stable, find the established programs best suited to assist you. Government subsidized housing, if available, etc.

[RecoveringKinkoid]

Flyndaran, are you really comparing yourself to a junkie or an alchoholic or an icehead?

Seriously?

[Flyndaran]

You'd be surprised about who doesn't want to be cured. Tends to be people who think the drugs are helping them with a problem more than conventional treatment would, or people who think they like how the drugs make them feel.

I'll try to take your word for it. I haven't met that many addicts. After having some bad experiences with incompetent therapists, I must have a little sympathy for the self-medicating.

As for you, you're on prescription medication for a diagnosed problem. I don't really see how you're like an addict refusing to get clean. In Canada, you'd likely qualify for ....

Here in the U.S. I've tried for years to get on social security assistance. I've been told repeatedly that my problems aren't that bad. My latest appeal sees a real live judge later this month. Wish me luck with proving that I'm incapable of getting a job.
What about those that get tired of the "medication roulette" of horrible side effects and limited efficacy? I can see how they may eventually just give up and would rather suffer their albeit crippling problems than some of those horrible side effects.
For example, one drug helped not at all, but caused me to vomit every 15 minutes for over 24 hours. Ever had your stomach feel exhausted?
One other time a drug worked perfectly... for one week... then I developed a reaction to it and it simply stopped working.
Most of the time the drugs simply did nothing.
I swear, if I didn't hate its taste so much and have such a high tolerance, I could easily have became an alcoholic. The feeling of a simple buzz removes most of my painful anxiety, and that lack of feeling alone could be very addictive.

[Wingates_Hellsing]

There are charities for charitable acts, businesses exist to do business. So I don't see why in the world Arby's should have given anyone anything without having it paid for.

For the record I'm largely liberal (with a twist of libertarian) in that I'm fully behind giving my government money so that it can do the stuff we need/want it to do. Help people? use tax money. Keep people safe? here's some tax money. Keep a roof over you congressional head until you get back to $400,000 annual? Have some tax money.

So the best response to a beggar at the incorrect place would be, and I've used this:
"I only have spending money, but I hear there's some government money at XXX"

So far, 90% have either become angry at not getting money or angry that I have some and won't give it to them (I don't like to lie when given the chance as I'm a compulsive exaggerator) and the rest (1) thanked me for my time and proceeded down the street in the general direction of XXX.

I have to admit that I myself haven't payed much in the way of tax (one chunk last year and another 6 months ago) I'm generally content with the amount that was taken before my 'county of awesomeness' employee refund. If I had some more I might donate some...

[MaggieTheCat]

You'd be surprised about who doesn't want to be cured.

For the record, my parents are like that. They are both heavy smokers and absolutely refuse to even want to quit. They've never tried because they don't want to. They don't want to believe that it's bad for their health. My dad has some pretty serious health problems, among others, he has heart disease and kidney/lung cancer. His dr. told him the first and foremost thing he has to do is quit smoking. My dad completely ignored him and wouldn't even try. He still smokes as much now as he did before he was diagnosed. And if anyone tries to reason with them, they get PISSED.