Taking children to the movies

[Flyndaran]

The fact that every single study linking violent media to violent behaviour at BEST only implies correlation, and doesn't come close to proving causation changes your "facts." The closest they've come was one study that noted that after playing a violent game for a few hours, teens had a slightly higher aggressive response immediately after. Which was also true for the teens who'd been playing a competitive non-violent game.

I've seen studies that show that violent imagery has the exact same effect as real world violence in front of children. I don't count teens as children.
I mean preteens.

[BroomJockey]

I've seen studies that show that violent imagery has the exact same effect as real world violence in front of children.

How was the study conducted? Was it stark, realistic violence? Was it presented as fictional, when it was fake? Or did they just show some kids some pictures and see if they reacted the same? Because if you're not making it clear when the fake violence is fake, and it's realistic violence, of course they'll react the same. Kids that young would need it explained when it was fake, since they wouldn't have the experience to differentiate. That's why parents are encouraged to talk to their kids, and explain the difference between real and fake.

[DesignFox]

I wouldn't mind seeing a ban on under 5's...but only at seriously late hours. Like after 10.

I see no reason why a parent couldn't take their mature and well behaved child out to a film at 8 in the evening.

*shrug* I think it's a shame that we are even thinking about this. It used to be that if you were young you were in bed by a certain hour. If you misbehaved, you were punished. If you were a disturbance, you're parents took you OUT.

Now people just think they should do whatever they want and to hell with everyone else. Sorry. You chose to reproduce. You get to deal with it. You want to go to an R film? Hire a goddamn babysitter.

I seriously dislike going to an adult film, especially at an adult hour and having children (particularly unruly ones) around me.

Now, if I go to a kid's movie, I fully expect to be surrounded by screaming kids. I still expect their parents to at least make a token effort to keep them in line, but I have a lot more patience for nonsense. That being said, I still wait a few days/weeks for the hype to die down and I go to later showings so perhaps the kids won't be as young and uncontrollable.

Don't get me started on the parents that bring their young children (under 12) to adult concerts and events. Those people drive me bat-shit insane. I don't care how mature your child is, certain things just aren't appropriate.

ALL that being said, with the exception of late night hours, I don't think a blanket ban is appropriate. I was a good kid and I always hated being lumped in with all the bad eggs. Any person of any age creating a disturbance should be given the boot. Period. If a kid is only 5 years old at a mature film, in the middle of the day, and not causing a problem. Eh. Let the parents deal with the consequences. (although I still think they *should* hire a babysitter for R films)

[violetyoshi]

I disagree. Why should the kids who can behave be punished? My nephew is 4, and he loves going to the movies. Of course, my sister takes him to see stuff like G-Force and Transformers II that will keep his attention and are somewhat age appropriate. Yeah, he may be a bit young for Transformers but all he wanted to see was the robots and the explosions. And he really likes Bumblebee. Point is, he behaves, my sister is a good mom and makes sure that he behaves, and if he loses interest, they leave the theatre. Why should he be punished? Because other moms and dads are lazy? It's just not fair.

I do think that for R movies, no children under the age of..say, 12 or 13 should be admitted at all. Moms and Dads, if you want to see the movie that bad, hire a sitter. Or wait until it comes out on DVD.

At my theatre (this example is live theatre), no child under the age of 5 is permitted at all, except our Theatre for Youth performances. Babes in arms are expressly forbidden. However, nothing in our regular season is even remotely appropriate for young children except the TYP. I mean, would you take a young child to see Macbeth?

Oh, and if you're a grown-up who wants to see a kid's movie - wait until it's been out for a few weeks. Much less crowded.

It's not punishing the kids who behave. What kind of immature thinking is that? I'd expect your child to possibly go "WAAAH WAAAH! IT'S NOT FAIIIRRR!" but an adult?

Disagree with all the scientific studies you want. It doesn't change the facts.
Parents chose to have kids. They shouldn't get special priviledges because of it.



Children are not a protected minority. I don't want whining babies next to me, and I would happily pay a little extra to make sure it doesn't happen.
Not all teens are destructive, but many areas still have curfews.
Insurance premiums depend on statistics, so there is precedent.
People without children should have places devoid of screaming foul smelling rugrats. Also, every parent thinks thier children are angels. It's simply easier to ban them outright.

I agree so much!

I've seen theaters now card people who want to see a rated R film. I think it's high time, if the parents are too childish themselves to know it's wrong to take a small child to an R movie, then I guess the theater will have to be their parent for them.

I'm tired of this notion that it's reasonable for parents to behave like children when they have children. Reacting to not being able to get what they want when they want it, by throwing a verbal tantrum like an upset 2 year old.

I feel it should be considered child abuse to take a child to a horror film or violent movie. If a parent took their child to see someone get murdered, or into a violent area of town for something, we'd be concerned about that. If it's on screen, somehow that makes it less of a problem? Even more so for the fact, that in movies the violence is extremely graphic and dramatized.

So, the parents who think they can get their way by throwing tantrums, screaming "IT'S NOT FAAAIIRR!" or other childlike claims to why their children should be allowed to see adult films.

Frankly, as I see it, since most parents behave like children, it's like having 2 or 3 children going to see an adult movie, rather than it just being their children.

[AdminAssistant]

It's not punishing the kids who behave. What kind of immature thinking is that? I'd expect your child to possibly go "WAAAH WAAAH! IT'S NOT FAIIIRRR!" but an adult?

*snip*

I feel it should be considered child abuse to take a child to a horror film or violent movie. If a parent took their child to see someone get murdered, or into a violent area of town for something, we'd be concerned about that. If it's on screen, somehow that makes it less of a problem? Even more so for the fact, that in movies the violence is extremely graphic and dramatized.

To the first section: a) I have no children, so the "your" child comment is irrelevant. b) I'm not saying, "WAAHHH". I felt I was pretty articulate. A policy that bans children from certain films just because a small percentage of children either misbehave or aren't properly parented is unfair to those that do behave and are properly parented. Kick out the ones that misbehave, let those who do behave stay. Easy as that.

To the second point: How exactly are you going to raise your kids? Keep them in a padded room and teach them that the world is all peace and love and unicorns that crap rainbows? Look, I'm not saying every child should be forced to watch Magnum Force (although I watched it as a kid). Then again, my parents were guilty of "child abuse" by today's standard: we watched PG 13 movies, regular television, the news, and even *gasp* got dirty, ate bugs, got into fights, and were actually exposed to life. Shoot, even Pixar movies feature murder, violence, and death. A good parent teaches their children the difference between real life and make believe. Movies are make believe. They aren't real. It's all pretend. Of course, kids today aren't allowed to pretend, have imaginations, or daydream, so it's no wonder that the line is getting fuzzy.

[Android Kaeli]

Nothing in life is fair, to put it bluntly. Take my work for example: the people who don't call in sick all the time get lumped together with the people who do without actually being sick and thus have to get a warning because they are calling out sick because they are too sick to come to work.

Unfair? Yes, quite, but because people abused the system for so long, things had to be enforced even with the people who don't abuse anything. There are kids that can behave, sit still, and understand but because other parents have brought their children in that really can't behave, sit still, and understand, unfortunately those well behaved kids will get lumped into the misbehaving group. It's not quite fair but in all seriousness people can blame those who don't follow the guidelines for messing it up for everyone else.

I, myself, want to focus on the movie in front of me. I fully expect to walk into a G-rated movie and have kids there, that's not a problem for me. I fully expect to walk into an R-rated movie and have people there that are at least fourteen or above seated, not very young kids. You (I'm using this term broadly, please), as a parent, should not place high expectations on a child under the age of five or six to be perfectly still and quiet for an hour and a half to two hours at a mature movie or understand what's really going on. You, as a parent, can explain all you can to the child but if they are too young to take a firm hold on the concept on the screen in front of you, then don't bring the child to the movie.

[BroomJockey]

Shoot, even Pixar movies feature murder, violence, and death.

Disney movies. Brutal. Lion King? Scar is ripped apart by his own minions, after murdering Simba's father in front of him. Little Mermaid? Ursula's impaled by a ship. Beauty and the Beast? Guy's tossed off a cliff. On to rocks, I believe. Hunchback of Notre Dame? Villain in to Hell. Nearly literally. Sleeping Beauty? Big-ass dragon. I could go on, but someone might question how I know so much about Disney movies...

[Flyndaran]

I never meant to imply I support blanket banning of children for theaters.
I simply believe that owners should have the right to ban children if they so choose. Obviously, banning kids from kids movies would be bad for business, but that's their choice as well.
I don't care how freakishly behaved that one kid is. Most aren't, and I don't have the time or patience to conduct in depth studies of every kid that "buys" a ticket. What is everyone suggesting? That an owner waits until dozens of movie goers have their night ruined, then ban the brat and their parents?
You chose to have kids? Great, but I didn't.

[AFPheonix]

To be honest, I'm not sure why someone would want to drag their kid to a theater anymore, especially with the advent of really decent and affordable tv's, sound systems, and Netflix.
There's not much advantage to going to a theater anymore. My sister and I went to see Harry Potter the other day, but that was mostly just to go take advantage of the air conditioning. Otherwise, they're expensive, the food costs about double what it should, and you have to deal with the general public, which can be trying at times.

[Lace Neil Singer]

I agree with Android Kaeli, sometimes life isn't fair. Life is also unfair that I, a childfree woman, end up being penalised in certain cases; such as on special offers (most are directed solely at families) or on getting holiday time during the summer (people with children have presidence).

f a cinema or indeed, a restaurant, puts in a "no kids after 9pm" curfew, then sorry, but the good kids are going to have to be lumped in with the bad. Enforcing a case by case rule would take far more work and manpower to do so rather than a simple blanket ban; simply disallowing small children after 9pm would only take the regular cinema staff, however having to go in and drag out badly behaved bratlings would take extra staff as well as be extremely unpleasent for the poor unfortunate peons saddled with this job.

It's kind of like being at school and the whole class being kept in at break cuz someone flipped a rubber at the teacher and didn't own up. Unfair? Yes. Is life fair? No, but we have to live with it.

[violetyoshi]

To the first section: a) I have no children, so the "your" child comment is irrelevant. b) I'm not saying, "WAAHHH". I felt I was pretty articulate.

You took what I said literally, what I meant was you were theoretically complaining like a child. Also, I don't see why this should matter to you if you don't have children.

A policy that bans children from certain films just because a small percentage of children either misbehave or aren't properly parented is unfair to those that do behave and are properly parented. Kick out the ones that misbehave, let those who do behave stay. Easy as that.

Easy as that? You would want to face up against a mother or father in denial of their brat's behavior? It's not so easy, talking to a parent in a full on delusion that their child never misbehaves.

To the second point: How exactly are you going to raise your kids? Keep them in a padded room and teach them that the world is all peace and love and unicorns that crap rainbows?

Just because I'm female, and have the ability to create children, doesn't mean I will choose to do so. The parents who's children misbehave tend to be the children who are kept in,"a padded room and taught that the world is all peace and love and unicorns that crap rainbows". Children who are taught that they're not always going to get their way, and that *shock* all adults aren't going to go "AWWWW IT'S A BAAAYYYYBBEE!" and excuse everything they do. In fact, some adults may step up and discipline them, because their parents won't.

Look, I'm not saying every child should be forced to watch Magnum Force (although I watched it as a kid). Then again, my parents were guilty of "child abuse" by today's standard: we watched PG 13 movies, regular television, the news, and even *gasp* got dirty, ate bugs, got into fights, and were actually exposed to life. Shoot, even Pixar movies feature murder, violence, and death. A good parent teaches their children the difference between real life and make believe. Movies are make believe. They aren't real. It's all pretend. Of course, kids today aren't allowed to pretend, have imaginations, or daydream, so it's no wonder that the line is getting fuzzy.

I agree with you about kids not being able to pretend or have imaginations, I just have to say in regards to that, what about ADHD? Inventing a disease for kids for not sitting down, or speaking out. As for the people who do have ADHD, it might be true for them, but many kids are labeled with it simply cause it's easier than hiring good teachers.

It's much more than a small percentage of children who misbehave, I guess you must have that maternal blindness to the misbehavior of children. Seeing the world through mommy-tinted glasses maybe? Most people do not have a tolerance for the behavior or loud noises of children.

I have Hyperacusis, a sensitivity to sudden loud sounds, like the ones children are known to create. It's easy to say, "Well just avoid children" when you don't realize that every area of society has now been deemed child friendly. You can't go out to a nice restaurant without a screaming child sitting in the seat over by you. Now your suggesting one of the last places an adult can go without the screeching of bugaboos, should also be child friendly?

What's next, are you going to advocate bringing baby to bars and strip clubs?

[anriana]

You took what I said literally, what I meant was you were theoretically complaining like a child. Also, I don't see why this should matter to you if you don't have children.

I guess you must have that maternal blindness to the misbehavior of children. Seeing the world through mommy-tinted glasses maybe?

Uh what?

Now your suggesting one of the last places an adult can go without the screeching of bugaboos, should also be child friendly?

Children can already go to movies so I'm not sure what is changing here.

[BroomJockey]

There's not much advantage to going to a theater anymore.

As someone who worked in various theatres for over 5 years, I take exception to that. I shall now counter!

My sister and I went to see Harry Potter the other day, but that was mostly just to go take advantage of the air conditioning.

You make my first point. Climate control. Many activities where you leave your home are not so accommodating.

Otherwise, they're expensive, the food costs about double what it should,

I assume you know that concessions are literally about 95% of the revenue for a theatre, which is why they're so expensive. Salaries, operating capital (ability to buy everything from popcorn seeds to napkins to soap for the washrooms), maintenance, rent, and profit all need to be supplied from there. On a new movie, they're lucky to get 10% of the ticket sales. That goes up the longer they have it, but by the same token, fewer people are seeing it.

and you have to deal with the general public, which can be trying at times.

Yes, but at the same time, going to see a movie in a crowded theatre has more impact. At a comedy, the entire crowd laughs. Dramatic movies can have the entire audience weeping, a good action movie can send an electric jolt of adrenaline through the crowd. And it's always more powerful when a group experiences the same emotion. You feed off each other. Even if you don't know a single other soul in the auditorium, for that 90 minutes, you're connected.

Other advantages are:

being able to see a new movie right away, since it's still an average of 3-6 months before a movie is released on home video. Not so long for adults, but kid-wise, for something like Harry Potter? They'd resent being forced to wait.

Seeing it on a large screen. Televisions are getting larger and clearer, yes, but they're still a tiny fraction of a movie screen. It's even more pathetic if you compare them to IMAX.

Ditto with sound systems. The average theatre has 12 high-end speakers to dedicate to the film, as well as advanced audio processors and a special mix that isn't copied on to DVD since commercial equipment simply doesn't have the number of speakers available, nor the dynamic range.

The food. It IS expensive, but few people have an oil popper at home, and fewer the salt used on the popcorn, so it can be a treat when you go. And if you don't want popcorn, lots of theatres (in Canada anyways) have everything ranging from a coffee shop/ice cream shop to pizza and burgers. Or just eat before you go.


Now, as for the actual topic, I don't think I'd have an issue with making the last showing of the night in each auditorium adult-only (with adult defined as an adult ticket). Usually those are dead, and not many children going to them anyways. So it'd be a decent means to play up the last showing, and get some extra business in there.

[AdminAssistant]

Also, I don't see why this should matter to you if you don't have children.

*snip*

Seeing the world through mommy-tinted glasses maybe? Most people do not have a tolerance for the behavior or loud noises of children.

What's next, are you going to advocate bringing baby to bars and strip clubs?

Well, I do have a nephew and step-niece, and they're good kids. Nephew, in particular, likes going to the movies. It's fun, you get the little popcorn and soda, and it's something special for him.

I actually have a very low tolerance for screaming and/or misbehaving children, I think because my parents were extremely strict. All I can think is, "If that were me, my Mom would be dragging my butt to the bathroom right now." And as I've said before, I don't have kids, nor do I want children in the immediate future. I don't have "mommy-tinted" glasses or maternal anything. I don't agree with saying that no child under 5 should be permitted in any movie for any reason, except a few special screenings.

I actually agree with blanket bans after a certain point at night...9 pm or so. Kiddies should be in bed by then. Nor do I advocate bringing babies to bars, strip clubs, or any other such child-inappropriate place. I'm not sure where in my post you picked that up.

I don't like that everything in society (well, American society, won't speak for Brits or Aussies) seems to revolve around kids, that I don't qualify for any tax credits or government assistance because, despite my near poverty level salary, I don't have kids. I think it's unfair that workers with children take precedence when it comes to vacation time or sick time. But, I do think that saying, "Small children misbehave in the cinema, so let's ban everyone under the age of 5" is a bit extreme.

Yes, but at the same time, going to see a movie in a crowded theatre has more impact. At a comedy, the entire crowd laughs. Dramatic movies can have the entire audience weeping, a good action movie can send an electric jolt of adrenaline through the crowd. And it's always more powerful when a group experiences the same emotion. You feed off each other. Even if you don't know a single other soul in the auditorium, for that 90 minutes, you're connected.

Emphasis mine.

Congrats, Broom, you just quoted one of the main arguments for the necessity of live theatre.

[BroomJockey]

I don't like that everything in society (well, American society, won't speak for Brits or Aussies)

But you'll speak for Canada?

Congrats, Broom, you just quoted one of the main arguments for the necessity of live theatre.

Actually, for any activity with a large audience. I'd enjoy live theatre more if I didn't always get stuck in the back, where I can't hear y'all