Get a Job! (RANT/VENT)

[rahmota]

Yes it is symbolic. A symbol of how the American Republic has fallen and been replaced by the American Empire. For the past 27 years aside from 8 years of sanity this country has been in the thrall of people who claim to represent the ideals of the republic and the people but in actuality are just social eltists who represent the ideals and goals of the rich and powerful.

Reagon, King Bush I, King Bush II, all have made cuts to social programs hurting thousands if not millions of poor people. They have seen a rise in deficit spending beyond anything ever seen before. Bush II managed to take a budget surplus hard won by the Clinton Administration and waste it on an illegal invasion and occupation of another country, tax breaks for the wealthy, rewards for companies moving overseas, among a variety of other wasteful extravaganzas.

Forgotten in this was the Gulf Coast during Katrina, drought relief for farmers, forest fire management, Lets see we've also seen the shuttle program and NASA in general getting forced to make do with second rate and outdated equipment, an erosion of basic civil rights and freedoms that would make huey long proud. A rise of our own religious zelotry equivalent to the Taliban, but since they hide behind the veil of christianity for their pogrom of hatred they receive tacit approval from the regime at home here.

All symbolized by changing one little letter.

[powerboy]

I do not have any college experience. But yet, I am working hard to start my own businesses. I have a lot of experience in the type of business, I am trying to start. I have always been taught, that working hard is better. Rather then getting things handed to you on a silver platter. America is not equal. All the assholes, gets everything handed to them. And the hard workers, get treated poorly. If you want a better life, then work hard for it.

[squall]

Reagan, although somewhat flawed, was not entirely a bad president. He revitalized an economy that under Carter had become stagnant and pulled us out of the Iran hostage crisis. He was one of those that sounded the death knell of communism across Europe. Communism, as mentioned earlier, is not a solution that works. It is a system that demands total unquestioning loyalty to country, and destroys some of the freedoms we associate with Western society. Everybody becomes a wage slave no matter the profession. As somebody pointed out earlier, the bottom 10 percent of America's population is always relatively the poor class. It can't always be helped, but there are many people who rely on government assistance and those that abuse the system. Some of the social programs could therefore be construed as a disincentive to work. This was a belief Reagan held, right or wrong is relative to whomever it affects. These same budget cuts are credited with the revitalization of the economy and the economic boom of the 90s, during which time King Bush the Lesser did little except stop Saddam's intrusion into the Persian Gulf, a wise move then. Could he have gone further, maybe. Would we be in the same quagmire we are today, possibly. Then comes Clinton and the "political correctness" idiotology that spread across college campuses and the liberal media outlets (another rant entirely). Monica aside, he did a good job....for a Democrat. And King Bush the Terrible....well, you know the story, and it is still playing out.

Rather than focus on the bad, I will say a few good things about what Bush II has done.

1. Established the Homeland Security Branch.
2. Named 2 Supreme Court justices to the bench, including a chief justice.
3. Worked to spread freedom in Afganistan. Afganistan has been a partial success. More children are going to school, including girls. There will always be extremists who do not want these freedoms, but I don't believe that extremists speak for everybody.
4. He (Bush II) and his administration have played a crucial role in the recent disarmament of North Korea's nuclear program. His work with Iran is ongoing, but I believe will produce some promising results, if not with this administration but the next. Clinton had begun working to this end, but was stonewalled by a Republican Congress who objected to whatever he worked toward. Believe it or not, Clinton feared Iraq had WMDs just as Bush II did. Hindsight is 20/20 in this situation.

[blas87]

The only people I want to slap silly and tell to get a job are people who cannot stop getting pregnant and having children and sucking up all of our tax dollars while they get to sit home all day and watch tv, get free daycare and free insurance and HELL discounted high speed cable and internet, when I have to work to pay for what I have and I can barely afford any of that!

[AFPheonix]

Rather than focus on the bad, I will say a few good things about what Bush II has done.

1. Established the Homeland Security Branch.

....which was something Clinton was wanting to come about, and Bush poo-poohed it...until we got attacked, and THEN he was all about the homeland security.

2. Named 2 Supreme Court justices to the bench, including a chief justice.

I will grant that he made a good choice in Chief Justice Roberts. I don't always agree with the man, but I respect him and think that he's pretty brilliant. the fiasco with finally picking Alito on the other hand, after trying to get a crony or two installed is a whole 'nother story.

3. Worked to spread freedom in Afganistan. Afganistan has been a partial success. More children are going to school, including girls. There will always be extremists who do not want these freedoms, but I don't believe that extremists speak for everybody.

Afghanistan could have been successful if he'd just stayed there rather than go get a hard on to attack Iraq. Now he's just fucking up in both places. Afghanistan is becoming less safe, The southern part of the country is experiencing a resurgence in the Taliban. Teaming up with the warlords is coming to bite the military in the ass, as opium production in Afghanistan now supplies 92% of the world's heroin. Yeah, way to go there, guys.
And gee....there's still the matter of not catching a certain guy with a beard after 5 years.....

4. He (Bush II) and his administration have played a crucial role in the recent disarmament of North Korea's nuclear program. His work with Iran is ongoing, but I believe will produce some promising results, if not with this administration but the next. Clinton had begun working to this end, but was stonewalled by a Republican Congress who objected to whatever he worked toward. Believe it or not, Clinton feared Iraq had WMDs just as Bush II did. Hindsight is 20/20 in this situation.

CHINA played a significant role. Bush really didn't do more than Clinton did. If it hadn't been for China telling Numbnuts that they weren't going to be supplying them with food and oil anymore if he didn't start playing nice, then we wouldn't have gotten anywhere again.

[rahmota]

Rather than focus on the bad, I will say a few good things about what Bush II has done.

1. Established the Homeland Security Branch

The Department of Homeland security (they are not their own branch of govt no matter how much they would like to be.) Our own home grown secret police. While a single department to coordinate and control all domestic defense is good the way Bush II developed it has been a failure.

Government Accountability Office revealed widespread misuse of government credit cards by DHS employees, with purchases including beer brewing kits, $70,000 of plastic dog booties that were later deemed unusable, boats purchased at double the retail price many of which later could not be found, and iPods ostensibly for use in "data storage".

In November 2006 the DHS had also mobilized tens of thousands of temporarily hired agents to conduct surveillance and practice clandestine operations on a person living on disability in Long Beach, California. The operation lasted three months, reached Canada and Taiwan, and was estimated to have cost several hundreds of millions of dollars, and yet the person in question was later assessed to have no connection with threat activities.

Failure of the response to Hurricane Katrina. Only the rich and powerful have seen any rebuilding not to mention the general bungling and mistakes made during the initial days following Katrina.

2. Named 2 Supreme Court justices to the bench, including a chief justice.

Somethign that whomever was in the office was going to have to do. And like AFP said Roberts is an okay choice, Alito is just a consolation prize after Bush II tried to get his buddies in power.

3. Worked to spread freedom in Afganistan.

Well he was working on that until we invaded and occupied Iraq. Then all that good work went to hell in a handbasket as we removed support and its now settling down into a nice long quagmire like Iraq where the US controls certian safe zones but outside those zones its the wilderness.

4. He (Bush II) and his administration have played a crucial role in the recent disarmament of North Korea's nuclear program.

ANNNNH! Sorry would you like to try again? North korea disarmed after gaining enouh political power and agreements frm china and South Korea to supply almost a million tons of heavy fuel oil to north korea. All the US has done is point weapons of mass destruction at NK, Try to starve NK by placing an embargo on them, insult them and call them an axis of evil etc.... All very non-diplomatic actions by King Bush II.

Now lets look at the bad things Bush II has done:
1: Allowed the torture to take place at the Abu Garib and Gitmo concentration campes
2: Moved detainees to other countries where torture can take place without oversight.
3: Tried to exclude himself formt eh McCain Detainee Amendment
4: No child Left Behind...Need we say anythign more about this wasted failure.
5: Cut taxes to the wealthiest percentages of the nation.
6:PATRIOT ACT: The destruction of civil rights in america
7: Military COmmisions act of 2006: Effectively removing Haebeous corpus for those determined to be enemy combatants.
8: Failure of any effective response to the gulf coast after KAtrina.
9: Destroyign the environemetn by rolling back over 30 years of advancement by the EPA. Attacking the endangered species act and clean air and water acts for example. See http://www.bushgreenwatch.org for more examples.
10: The recent attorneydismisal for political maneouvers.
11: And goign all the way back to 9/11 his inability to react or act when informed of the attacks on the WTC.

Reagan, although somewhat flawed, was not entirely a bad president. He revitalized an economy that under Carter had become stagnant and pulled us out of the Iran hostage crisis.

Okay first off Reagon had nothign to do with the resolution of the Iran Hostage crisis whatsoever except taking the credit for other people's work. Namely Algerian diplomat Abdulkarim Ghuraib opened fruitful, but demeaning, negotiations between the U.S. and Iran. This resulted in the "Algiers Accords" of January 19, 1981, which entailed Iran's commitment to free the hostages immediately.

Trickle down economics aka voodoo economics aka reward the welathy and starve the poor is a part of the republican legacy.
Savings and loan crisis where thousands of hard working americans saw their life savings vanish in a puff of smoke.
The stock market crash of 1987.
National debt increase. Trade deficit increase.
And that wonderful waste of taxpayer moeny and time the war on drugs which has done nothing except bloat the government, remove civil rights and ruin more lives than the drugs themselves have probably done.

Powerboy: You are right the assholes do get thigns handed to them on a silver platter. One of the perks of being rich and powerful and elite in a country that rewards being rich and socially acceptable and punishes those who try to work hard for a living. I applaud you for trying to start your own business. I have run two business before the farm and know what you are having fun with. Good luck and hope it works out.

Blas: There are always those who take advantage of any system and I dislike those as well. What I am railing about is those people who are trying to make their lives better but thanks to roadblocks put in place by capitalism in general, our society and the administration and corporate policies in specific.

But what in the world are you talking about free cable and high speed internet? I am aware of no program state or federal that gives people those two items. And many of the programs I am aware of require participation in work education or scut work programs (where the recipient is treated as a slave of the state or indentured servant if you prefer) so they do not get to sit aroud all day and just watch tv. Unless there is a medical reason why they cannot work. Especially if they get free daycare (which is another thing I am not aware of any state or federal program doing)

[Nightwolf]

(Things are not fair here in the US.) Thats for sure, and also, (Who says life is supposed to be fair?) Thats fine and dandy and all, but, lets just tally up what lil ole me is going to be making this year shall we.....

$9600.00 this year. Wow, I can really afford to live and support a family on that.

See, the thing is, I've tried to get other jobs, 60+ resumes and not a single phone call. I've tried to get another part time job, but once again, I get no phone calls. I call these places and get nowhere. I refuse to go work at McDonalds or another fast food joint, and maybe thats my fault because I'm being too picky, but I don't believe I should have to resort to those levels.

See, this "being poor" thing isn't my fault. And if anyone says it is, by all means, tell me what I did to make this my fault?

I'm more than qualified to work in Human Resources, had plenty of experience, and am very passionate about that line of work, yet, I can't even get an interview and why? Because I have no degree. Same thing goes for any sort of IT work. I've tried. I've spoken with people in the upper management portions of the IT places. When I tell them about my experience, they light up, then when they ask if I have a degee, I tell them no and their face turns into a frown. Then i'm told I need to have a degree to get in.

Yeah, I don't have to have a degree to work three jobs, but I refuse to work myself to death. As a part of my (crazy, insane, radical) HR ideas, I shouldn't have to work myself to death to get ahead in life and provide for my family. I don't live for work.

And for all those who say you need to work hard to get ahead......no, you need to kiss ass to get ahead. My old boss is total proof of that. In every single job he's been in, he's been promoted to the top, and he does nothing. He is the laziest SOB I've ever seen when It comes to work. He passes it off on others, takes the credit for it, and because of all his sucking up, the bosses won't believe he didn't do it. Myself and a close friend worked 10x harder than he ever did in his job, and as underlings we got screwed over more times than I can count. What does he get...another promotion for taking 2 hour lunches, working 4 hour workdays, and not answering his phone during emergencies. yeah, things certainly aren't fair, but I think a little equality would be nice in these cases.

[Boozy]

$9600.00 this year. Wow, I can really afford to live and support a family on that.

Yikes. I've been there.

I firmly believe that anyone who works full-time year-round should be able to support themselves financially. If they can't, then the minimum wage is too damn low.

Seriously, what the hell is the whole concept of a minimum wage for if not to make sure that someone who works hard can afford food and shelter?

I suppose this may be a topic for another thread. I'll shut up before I completely hijack this one.

[Dreamstalker]

I've spoken with people in the upper management portions of the IT places. When I tell them about my experience, they light up, then when they ask if I have a degee, I tell them no and their face turns into a frown. Then i'm told I need to have a degree to get in.

Sounds like what I'm running up against with needed experience. In order to get job experience I need to work in a position, yet they're not hiring unless I can prove I have said experience. Rinse and repeat...

I have a CS degree and can't even get a job in the retail side of computers, never mind what I want (hardware tech). Freelancing is nice, but there isn't enough work where I am. Right now I'm sinking money that I don't really have into cert training (and wrangling with the state disability agency to get that money back, as I was promised in May).

Yeah, I don't have to have a degree to work three jobs, but I refuse to work myself to death. As a part of my (crazy, insane, radical) HR ideas, I shouldn't have to work myself to death to get ahead in life and provide for my family. I don't live for work.

That makes sense and is in line with my work beliefs as well.

My bf doesn't have any sort of degree and wonders why he's not getting hired (basically, the only jobs he deems 'worth it' require experience, certs and education which he doesn't have).

[rahmota]

Nightwolf. Oh I feel for you on that my friend. I run a farm. The "profits" from that farm dont even count because by the time I meet expenses at the end of the year I'm usually under 500$. Yes thats right I dont even clear a grand on the farm when i take what i get from the crops and spend it on taxes, fuel, seed, etc.... So I have to try and work off the farm (As well as full time on the farm) but its that stupid little piece of paper that so many companies would rather see on your wall than any sign of actual experience. What is the point of wanting an experienced person if you are going to reject them just because they dont have some prestigious little piece of paper that says they graduated from the right social club or the right school.

Dreamstalker: Again its the same vicious cycle. You have to have this experience, but you cant get this experience unles syou jump throuhg this incredibly high set hoop that only those with the right background and social standing can get or otherwise you have to work three times as hard.

I wish the both of you the best of luck. Also know you are not alone in the boat. There's way too many people in there with you right now.

Boozy:

Seriously, what the hell is the whole concept of a minimum wage for if not to make sure that someone who works hard can afford food and shelter?

I suppose this may be a topic for another thread. I'll shut up before I completely hijack this one

Please either start that thread or put it here. We've gotten all over the place and a minimum wage is a job related issue. Honestly I'm not going to get bent about a bit of thread drift.

Capitalists would tell you that the minimum wage is why there are no real jobs any more , that prices are so high because of Minimum Wages, and that companies shouldnt be forced to pay a minimum wage. Thats BS otherwise we'd wind up seeing a heck of a lot more working poor on the wwelfare rolls than there already is as companies try to cut payroll costs to beyond the bleeding minimum. If there was not some kind of control on a company forcing them to pay a fair and livable wage they would treat everybody like sweatshop employees because really and honestly what option would people have? Dont work for a comapnny that wont pay a fair wage? Well if the law of the land doesnt force a company to do that then no company will do so. So you hav eno option but to work for substandard, submenial, sublivable wages. Can you honestly tell me that any companny in america today would offer all the benefits and wages they do if they where not forced to do so by the government?

[TNT]

I agree it can be very hard to find a job. I'm not making this post to say that it's easy. And this story should be taken for what it is... a very local story in a very small town. It would be impossible to take any general implications from it because there aren't any.

Still, the problem at the call center where I work is that we have way too many jobs and way too few applicants. We're trying to hire over 200 people in 2007, but we probably won't make it... we're supposed to have 15 people in our training classes and we generally wind up with 12.

It's got nothing to do with credit history (don't ask me how I know that). The only requirements are a high school diploma and the ability to tell a computer from a Pepsi machine. The starting pay is relatively high for the area (30K a year in a city where "luxury" apartments rent for $600 a month), and the benefit package is one of the best in the country.

We've got all these jobs waiting for someone to fill them, but I still hear a lot of people tell me, "there just aren't any jobs here." Granted, call center work isn't for everybody. But, given the choice between that and unemployment, I know which one I'd take (I know which one I did take).

[Dreamstalker]

What is the point of wanting an experienced person if you are going to reject them just because they dont have some prestigious little piece of paper that says they graduated from the right social club or the right school.

I have a CS degree from what is supposed to be a liberal-arts school. Haven't considered the thinking "a CS degree from an arts school?"...yeah it may not make sense, but give me a pile of parts and I can either build it, or tell you why it won't work.

In a field like IT (for example, but this could apply to almost anything), I would think that real-world experience--of which I have plenty--would carry just enough if not more weight than certs (IMO, the hiring process for technicians should include a hands-on portion). I've seen/heard tales of people who got certs just for the paper/hiring advantage, and can't actually do the work (or are capable, but make a massively obvious mistake and don't see what they did wrong).

[rahmota]

TNT: It must be a regional thing. The midwest is dying here when it comes to good jobs, average jobs or even really bad jobs. Unless you drive trucks or are a nurse or a truck driving nurse then you are having a rough time getting in.

Whats really sad is that there are many companies that have openings but no budget for payroll as the honchos have decided on a hiring freeze to cut costs. So less people to do more work for fewer rewards. How joyful.

Dreamstalker: Yeah I know what you mean about the certs and all. there are diploma mills on the web and real world as well that can give you a certificate in anything you want. But you find someone who has been there done that and knows how to fix it again but they dont have that stupid piece of paper then the company just doesnt care. Its all about appearance versus ability to some people.

[TNT]

TNT: It must be a regional thing. The midwest is dying here when it comes to good jobs, average jobs or even really bad jobs. Unless you drive trucks or are a nurse or a truck driving nurse then you are having a rough time getting in.

Whats really sad is that there are many companies that have openings but no budget for payroll as the honchos have decided on a hiring freeze to cut costs. So less people to do more work for fewer rewards. How joyful.

I'm not so sure it's a regional thing... trust me that if I were thinking about changing jobs, I'd have no idea where to go in my town. I still look at the help wanted ads every Sunday, and most of them are for... truck drivers and nurses.

Mostly, I got lucky and connected with a company that's currently hiring people by the thousands all across the country. Here's the odd part: most of those people are getting hired because we're eliminating outsourcing. That's not a typo... we're eliminating outsourcing. Imagine that.

Even better for me, I got there slightly before the plans were announced and the hiring frenzy started. It's all a very long story, but my original job was as day to day temp in a position the temp agency assured me was singularly futureless -- I'd never have to worry about being hired full-time because it wasn't going to happen. I basically got the job because a) I showed up at the agency that particular day and b) no one else wanted it.

I stayed because I started picking up rumors that things were not as futureless as they seemed. Almost two years later, things are still working out pretty well.

I mention that only because I think part of it's luck, and part of it's finding opportunity where there doesn't appear to be any (or at least opening the door when opportunity does knock).

[rahmota]

TNT: Wow thats great. I find it funny that just through sheer dang luck you got in but thats about the way it goes I guess.

your company is ending outsourcing? I wonder why. Was there a reason given or that you've heard? This is the first I have heard of a company doing that.

PS do they have any offices in SW Ohio?....