Will Anything Good Ever Come From The U.S. Invasion of Iraq

[Nyoibo]

I don't think anyone in this country---be they Democrat, Republican, Liberal, Conservative, Moderate, Libertarian, Anarchist, or whatever---would like or support Saddam Hussein.

They did once upon a time.

[Greenday]

Asking "Well, do you still want Saddam in power?" when arguing for the war is a false premise, because you're only looking at one part of a very large equation.

It's a damn good answer in a thread titled "Will Anything Good Ever Come From The U.S. Invasion of Iraq". We point out we got rid of an evil dictator, but then everyone else starts saying it's not a good enough reason to go to war. I don't care if it's a good enough reason to go to war, it's a good thing that came from the invasion of Iraq and that seems to just be dismissed.

[BroomJockey]

it's a good thing that came from the invasion of Iraq and that seems to just be dismissed.

When you cause a situation, in real life, you often don't get credit for fixing it. People tend to look poorly on people asking to be praised for fixing shit they broke.

[MergedLoki]

This is something I've had a problem with for a long time. I don't think anyone in this country---be they Democrat, Republican, Liberal, Conservative, Moderate, Libertarian, Anarchist, or whatever---would like or support Saddam Hussein. However, I don't like or support Robert Mugabe, either, but that doesn't mean I think we should go barging into Zimbabwe after him. Asking "Well, do you still want Saddam in power?" when arguing for the war is a false premise, because you're only looking at one part of a very large equation.

Yea I get what you mean. and im not saying the whole 'well he's a bad guy so were gonna get 'im' was a justifiable reason to invade iraq (it wasn't). i was just trying to not be 100% totally negative in my posting lol

[Gravekeeper]

When you cause a situation, in real life, you often don't get credit for fixing it. People tend to look poorly on people asking to be praised for fixing shit they broke.

Thank you for summing this entire thing up in one sentence. Here I was trying paragraphs and what not. >.>

[Slytovhand]

One thing I've never understood about this argument is that Bush Jr's dad was President. Isn't threatening the President of the United States cause for, I don't know, a little aggression?

No, not really.... certainly not enough to send hundreds of thousands of troops from all over the world into a war... don't you think???


We probably shouldn't go too in depth into the whole Afghanistan argument (I've already said my bit on it... and no, you won't be finding bin Laden any time soon... he's too valuable being kept out of the public's eye for the moment.. the CIA will have other jobs they need doing to have him caught), but whoever it was who thought that strategically an invasion of any country miles away from home is a smart thing to do needs to be fired! Afghanistan has been fighting wars for years... it's not going to just stabilise overnight.

The same with Iraq... and here's the big thing... it's not enough to just want something. Nor is it enough to provide a means to get it (ie, infrastructre), nor even the freedom to get it... you actually have to change an entire mindset (in this case, of an entire country) to think that it is actually possible, and.. that it's something that they can actually do themselves! That's something that can't be taught.. it can only be practiced. And that's going to take a fair bit of time. So... they need to have elections, and they need a stable government that actually empowers the people,and they need the support and safety while they do it.

The US 'liberated' the people... now they need to stay and make sure they understand what 'liberty' is! Otherwise... just piss off and let them fall down again.... and wait for WWIII to come...

Well said, AA (btw - Australia is nice and warm )

The U.S. is no where near noble or uncorruptible enough to act as savior to the world.

The irony of that is, the US has a bad tendency to ignore one of the main organisations that, at least on the surface, is a bit more noble and uncorruptible - the UN. It wasn't the UN pushing Hussein,and pushing, and pushing... so stuff it, let's declare war. If you'll all recall, most of the world isn't a part of this 'Coalition of the completely stupid'... and they actively protested it... but nooooo... Bush just had to go and do something (because Cheney and Haliburton didn't make enough profits last year...).

On one note about 'casualties'... what's the current stat on soldiers actually killed by the enemy, versus by their own bullet? I know war is a bad and nasty thing, but you've really got to wonder in this day and age why so many soldiers are committing suicide....

[MergedLoki]

On one note about 'casualties'... what's the current stat on soldiers actually killed by the enemy, versus by their own bullet? I know war is a bad and nasty thing, but you've really got to wonder in this day and age why so many soldiers are committing suicide....

could be enterance requirments are alot less? I mean frankly SOME of the people allowed in the military and access to deadly weapons amazes me. Because they're freakin psycho! (have a friend in the canadian military and he's said some people he had with him in basic shoulnd't be let anywhere NEAR a gun but hey we need body's.. i mean soldiers so in you go.)

also on that note (i dont know the USA requirments but have they changed since the iraq/afghanistan stuff started?) cuz up here in canada the requirments to get INTO the army are somethine like... do 19 push ups, 20 sit ups, umm.. 'X' amount of jumping jacks. (i dont remembr them all my buddy told me about a year ago). and it boggles my mind because i'm pretty badly out of shape and i could go this instant and pass the 'physical' exam. (now this is jsut the enterance exam it's not basic training that'll kick the shit out of you but still.) so i'm just wondering did the US relax their standards in order to get more people enlisted (as i know the army is desperately hurting for people. they missed their recruiting goals by.. how many thousand the last few years?).

sooo just saying maybe there's ALOT of people in the armed forces that really should NOT be there. and they can't handle the stress and pressure etc. etc.

[BroomJockey]

cuz up here in canada the requirments to get INTO the army are somethine like... do 19 push ups, 20 sit ups, umm.. 'X' amount of jumping jacks. (i dont remembr them all my buddy told me about a year ago). and it boggles my mind because i'm pretty badly out of shape and i could go this instant and pass the 'physical' exam.

You do know the actual point of that isn't to prove you're in shape, but to prove you're physically capable of doing certain things. Like you said, basic training is where they get you in to shape, so they don't need to worry about that at the admissions stage.

[joe hx]

I mean frankly SOME of the people allowed in the military and access to deadly weapons amazes me. Because they're freakin psycho!

Strange, I have a mental illness and thus am unable to join the military (I tried and they said no).