Ohio Hospital Will No Longer Hire Smokers

[Lace Neil Singer]

Getting cancer just affects me. It's not illegal. A hundred other people don't suffer as victims because I got cancer. Alcohol does not affect just me and many of the results are illegal. Fighting, assault, harassment, DUI, public intoxication, etc......

What he said. If I smoke ten cigarettes then get behind the wheel of a car, I'm less likely to have an accident than Jane Doe who downs ten vodkas and does likewise.

[Fashion Lad!]

Getting cancer just affects me. It's not illegal. A hundred other people don't suffer as victims because I got cancer. Alcohol does not affect just me and many of the results are illegal. Fighting, assault, harassment, DUI, public intoxication, etc......

Guess you all missed the point where after my class where I sit near a smoker, my head is in a vice because I can smell the cigarette smoke. That does directly affect me. I may be sensitive to it, but I'm not the only one in the world. And I have one friend that can have an asthma attack just from smelling the shit.

[linguist]

Getting cancer just affects me.

actually, in a situation such as in the op, it can affect more than just you.

say you're a nurse working in the hospital. you get cancer. do you think you'll be able to adequately care for the patients under your charge while you're sick? even if you are at first, there's going to come a point where either the treatment or the disease itself is going to render you too sick to be able to work, then everyone else has to pick up the extra slack of handling your patients on top of their own.

[AdminAssistant]

Guess you all missed the point where after my class where I sit near a smoker, my head is in a vice because I can smell the cigarette smoke.

I know it seems obvious but, change seats?

[Lace Neil Singer]

Exactly.

actually, in a situation such as in the op, it can affect more than just you.

say you're a nurse working in the hospital. you get cancer. do you think you'll be able to adequately care for the patients under your charge while you're sick? even if you are at first, there's going to come a point where either the treatment or the disease itself is going to render you too sick to be able to work, then everyone else has to pick up the extra slack of handling your patients on top of their own.

Are you serious? Smokers aren't the only people who get cancer. Are you including breast cancer suffers, skin cancer sufferers etc in your statement? So do you suggest banning being a woman (I know men get breast cancer too, but women get it more) and being out in the sun along with smoking?

[linguist]

Exactly.



Are you serious? Smokers aren't the only people who get cancer. Are you including breast cancer suffers, skin cancer sufferers etc in your statement? So do you suggest banning being a woman (I know men get breast cancer too, but women get it more) and being out in the sun along with smoking?

show me where i said that smokers are the only people who get cancer. i'm just saying that it does affect more than just the person who gets it.

statistically, cancer incidences are higher among smokers than nonsmokers, and there's even evidence that suggests a link between smoking and breast cancer, among other types of non-lung-involved cancers. as for the sun and skin cancer, a certain amount of sunlight is necessary and healthy--there's no amount of smoking that's healthy. as everyone has a different healthy exposure threshold, there's no way to really regulate sun exposure.

[Lace Neil Singer]

You posted that if a nurse gets cancer, then it affects more than just her. I merely pointed out that smokers aren't the only people to get cancer. As for statistics, they can prove anything you want; they don't really make it right for one group of people to be excluded. If say, HIV positive people were barred from getting jobs at this hospital, there'd be an uproar; yet, the risk to patients is considerably more than if smokers are hired.

[linguist]

If say, HIV positive people were barred from getting jobs at this hospital, there'd be an uproar; yet, the risk to patients is considerably more than if smokers are hired.

most hospitals already refuse to hire those with known hiv infections. if infection by hiv or any other dangerous blood-borne pathogen (such as hepatitis) occurs after employment begins, those workers are most often moved into positions that limit or eliminate patient exposure. it's common practice.

of course, it's the applicant's prerogative to not self-report their infection, but to my mind not doing so is at best irresponsible and unethical, and at worst criminally negligent.

[Fashion Lad!]

I know it seems obvious but, change seats?

Can't. It's a Linux Server class and she decided to sit right next to me. I can't just pick up my server and go to a different spot. It doesn't work that way.

[Lace Neil Singer]

Develop a few irritating habits; start clearing your throat, scratching your butt, farting, burping and whistling annoying tunes. She'll soon change her mind about sitting next to you. XD

most hospitals already refuse to hire those with known hiv infections. if infection by hiv or any other dangerous blood-borne pathogen (such as hepatitis) occurs after employment begins, those workers are most often moved into positions that limit or eliminate patient exposure. it's common practice.

of course, it's the applicant's prerogative to not self-report their infection, but to my mind not doing so is at best irresponsible and unethical, and at worst criminally negligent.

Link? I could also list the obese as a group not discriminated against. Jackfaire said he wouldn't want to take health advice from a smoker. Would you want to take health advice from someone who was obese?

[Daskinor]

How did this policy come to be.

At some point either by law or choice the hospital decided to make thier entire campus smoke free. This is a very popular trend here in America and I do not foresee it changing anytime soon.

By becoming smoke free, the owners of the property decided that no one is allowed to smoke on the property at all. This will include employees and visitors. As an extension of the smoke free rules employees are also not allowed to have the strong smell of tobacco smoke attached to themselves.

These polices are put into effect due to whatever research that hospital chooses to accept. Most cases they error or the side of caution to make sure that their patients have the best care possible. Even if it is a remote chance of something happening if they are exposed however slight.

This leaves us with the problem at hand, employees that smoke. This is a group of people who can not smoke at all during the work day. They can also not smoke in scenarios that can contaminate their hair or clothing before they arrive at work. This includes smoking in cars or in their own homes. Remember that these places will error on the side of caution. Even if you can do whatever you can to prevent contamination, any is to much.

So basically what it comes down to is this, do you;

A. Hire smokers, tell them that the hospital is 100% smoke free and employees are not allowed to smoke or smell of smoke. Having to fire them if found in violation.

B. Simply not hire smokers at all.


Another thing I want to point out is a misconception people tend to have. You do not have the right to smoke. You also don't have the right to eat chocolate drink vodka or have a BBQ. They are simply things you can do by virtue of not being illegal to do them. Actually you have only a little over a dozen. A right is a fundamental protection you have that can not be taken away by any law.

What is going on in all reality is a culture war, Smokers versus non-smokers. One group wants to do what they do in peace, and the second doesn't want to be bothered by the first. In turn the first group then does not want to be bothered by the second.

Because this is a culture war, any inch given up is to much. Fifty years ago it was OK to smoke in hospital. Then you could only smoke outside. Now most don't even allow you to smoke anywhere on the property. The next step is employees, a ground that just starting to be tread upon.


I will post more thoughts later.

[Gravekeeper]

I don't want to wade into this one too deep ( It is scary, and there are wolves ) but the key word here I think is contamination. Just because you aren't smoking around the patients, doesn't mean its not clinging to your clothes, hair, etc. Cigarette smoke ( and the lovely things in it ) doesn't magically go away when you put the cigarette out. It clings to practically everything and stays there till that everything is washed. Smoking outside doesn't help as much as you'd think, as it still sticks to you, and you bring it back inside ( and thus to your patients ).

Alcohol doesn't stick to your clothes and get everyone else buzzed that you hang out with for the rest of the day. -.-

So I'm afraid Dask is right. Option B is probably easier for a hospital.

[Fryk]

Yes, but easier doesn't always make it right.

[Gravekeeper]

Yes, but easier doesn't always make it right.

To be completely honest, when dealing with people's health? Yes it does. -.-