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**~~rahmota~~** · 11-17-2007, 12:38 AM

Lovely. Cyberbullies. Another sign of the wasteland the internet has become.....

Sad to say I doubt there is any law the people can be charged with. Maybe a civil suit for pain and suffering if that will do any good. And that was supposed to be mature adults? bah....

**Greenday** · 11-17-2007, 12:59 AM

What the hell are people supposed to do when the law won't do anything about it? Ever see The Boondock Saints? Honestly, if a couple of guys started going around, and got rid of all the major crime leaders, I'd sure as hell support them. I personally don't see anything wrong with getting justice done yourself as long as it's not more than necessary. And in this case, I think the community should ban together and make these people miserable, for a long ass time.

Sick assholes. How could any sensible adult do something so stupid? Scumbags.

**IDrinkaRum** · 11-17-2007, 01:24 PM

Here is another update of sorts on the case. It's been posted on Yahoo! this time.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071117/...ternet_suicide

The local law enforcement are keeping the case open. The parents of the dead girl are trying to change the law & I really hope they sue the heck out of all the people who knew about it and not just the parents who came up with the idea.

**Rose Juwl** · 01-21-2008, 03:30 AM

Originally posted by IDrinkaRum View Post

I wish the dead child's parents would sue.

From what I remember of this story, when it happened, the girl who killed herself wasn't even supposed to be on the computer when the taunting part of this started. The girl was a regular in the grown-ups' ride to school, and the adults were supposedly 'watching out for their daughter, because the girl had been calling their daughter terrible things behind her back'.
I'm also pretty sure the parents of the dead girl TRIED to sue, but couldn't, due to there being no law against such actions (supposedly).
What made it all worse was the other parents were absolutely unapologetic when they were interviewed about the girl's suicide, even though they'd known her most of her life.

**Lace Neil Singer** · 01-21-2008, 01:52 PM

I will be unpopular for saying this, but I really hope the law isn't changed, cuz it's all part of the whole "no-one is to blame for anything they do" idea behind modern life today. I blame the parents of the girl, for not monitoring her computer time, especially on Myspace which is renowned for having pedophiles and fake profiles, and for not taking better care of her at the time. Suing will solve nothing; you can't get blood out of a stone (I doubt these people have much money) and won't bring their daughter back. All it would do is paint these people as greedy. Finally, unless this woman handed the rope to the girl and told her to kill herself, she is NOT responsible for the girl's suicide. It's a terribly society we live in now where no-one is held accountable for their own actions any more and someone must always be blamed.

Yes, bullying is bad; no need to tell me that, I suffered thru bullying for nearly all my school life, but suicide is always the choice of the person who carries it thru. Maybe it was an act of spite, or a cry for help, but the bottom line is that NO-ONE is to blame for it, cept the girl herself. She chose to throw the towel in and take the way out by killing herself, end of. Again, I'm sorry if I sound heartless, but those are the facts, seen purely from a non emotional angle. The woman who made the fake profile and who started off the taunting is guilty of online harrassment and bullying, and those are the charges that should be brought.

However, cuz her victim killed herself, she will carry that around for the rest of her life, same as anyone who knocked down a person with their car or who hit someone who later died. That will be her punishment.

**AFPheonix** · 01-21-2008, 06:14 PM

Suicide usually isn't an option for someone who's brain chemistry is on the up and up. She most likely was depressed something fierce, and those idiot parents of her friend exacerbated it. What they did was something I'd expect from a grade schooler, not a pair of adults. Yes, they are in part to blame for this girl's suicide.

It would have been nice if her parents had noticed, but they didn't, so I'm not going to blame them necessarily. They've got a hard row to hoe as it is, having lost their daughter.

**Lace Neil Singer** · 01-21-2008, 09:22 PM

They are not to blame cuz we don't know what was going thru this girl's mind. Maybe it was accidental, and she only meant to do it for attention or a cry for help; in any case, I still stand by what I said, NO-ONE is to blame for a suicide cept the suicide themselves.

**Seshat** · 01-21-2008, 10:02 PM

Mod request: Let's take the 'who is to blame for a suicide' issue to a separate thread - if we keep it in this thread, we'll derail it.

**Seshat** · 01-21-2008, 10:09 PM

Originally posted by Lace Neil Singer View Post

I will be unpopular for saying this, but I really hope the law isn't changed, cuz it's all part of the whole "no-one is to blame for anything they do" idea behind modern life today. I blame the parents of the girl, for not monitoring her computer time,

But your opinions leave the people who chose to bully with no blame. You're blaming the victims but I don't see you expressing any blame for the perpetrators.

I don't think that's fair.

However, cuz her victim killed herself, she will carry that around for the rest of her life, same as anyone who knocked down a person with their car or who hit someone who later died. That will be her punishment.

No, that will be a consequence. I see a strong difference between consequence and punishment.

These adults chose to bully a known-fragile teenager, knowing it was morally wrong. They were maliciously cruel. They freely chose to do something very, very wrong, and I think they deserve punishment, as well as having to live with the consequence.

The parents also have to live with the consequence, and the consequence is much harder for them than for the bullies. IMO, consequence alone is insufficient in this case.

**Lace Neil Singer** · 01-23-2008, 06:01 PM

I do see the perpetrators as committing a crime; you seem to have skipped over these parts of my post:

Bullying is bad

The woman who made the fake profile and who started off the taunting is guilty of online harrassment and bullying, and those are the charges that should be brought.

Next time, I'd appreciate if you'd read my post instead of just posting a knee jerk reaction based on emotion. The parents are at fault for not monitoring the computer time of their CHILD, who also was disturbed and suffering from mental illness. The woman who created the fake profile started off the online bullying, but unless it also spilled over into real life, online bullying is nowhere near as bad as face to face. I think I read elsewhere that it did, in which case the parents should have involved the school and taken their child off the internet, rather than just "monitoring" their child's online time, which could mean anything. Once again, I will state that no child should EVER be allowed on Myspace, supervised or not, cuz it is not a site aimed at children.

And yes, I have been the victim of both online and real life bullying, and it was the real life one that drove me to self harm and an eating disorder. The online one was solved by not going to that site any more. Yes, I'm an adult and the victim in this case was a child, but that merely supports my statement that the parents should have taken her off the computer.

Finally, I don't blame the bullies for the injuries caused by my self harm during the time I was at achool; I myself used the razor blade and knives on my arms and ankles. No-one handed me a knife or blade and made me do it. However, the bullies certainly were responsible for making my life at school an unbearable misery, and that is what these bullies are also responsible for, and should be charged as such.

**Greenday** · 01-23-2008, 10:27 PM

Originally posted by Lace Neil Singer View Post

I do see the perpetrators as committing a crime; you seem to have skipped over these parts of my post:

Next time, I'd appreciate if you'd read my post instead of just posting a knee jerk reaction based on emotion. The parents are at fault for not monitoring the computer time of their CHILD, who also was disturbed and suffering from mental illness. The woman who created the fake profile started off the online bullying, but unless it also spilled over into real life, online bullying is nowhere near as bad as face to face. I think I read elsewhere that it did, in which case the parents should have involved the school and taken their child off the internet, rather than just "monitoring" their child's online time, which could mean anything. Once again, I will state that no child should EVER be allowed on Myspace, supervised or not, cuz it is not a site aimed at children.

Finally, I don't blame the bullies for the injuries caused by my self harm during the time I was at achool; I myself used the razor blade and knives on my arms and ankles. No-one handed me a knife or blade and made me do it. However, the bullies certainly were responsible for making my life at school an unbearable misery, and that is what these bullies are also responsible for, and should be charged as such.

I think what Seshat was getting at is, by being charged with online harassment and bullying, they might as well not get charged at all. The "punishments" for those two are the biggest slap on the wrist ever. If the parents of her ex-friend weren't such twits, the girl would have still been alive. To get a slap on the wrist, for leading a kid to suicide, makes a complete mockery of the justice system.

I'll put it this way. YOU try watching every single thing a teenager does.I mean, what were the parents supposed to do, stand behind her and watch her every time she surfs the web? How can you say that Myspace isn't meant for teenagers? If it isn't meant for them, who the heck is it meant for?

As for online bullying not being as bad as bullying in real life, if online bullying can lead to someone killing them self, I can't even imagine what's possible for people who are bullied in real life. Not everyone is the same. From what it sounds like, the girl in the story didn't have any friends in real life. This person on Myspace was her only friend who treated her well and really liked her. Then to all of a sudden lose that friend and have that friend hate you, now having no friends at all, that's pretty crappy. She didn't even stand a chance.

**Lace Neil Singer** · 01-23-2008, 11:17 PM

There are filters you can put on the computer; netnanny's the most popular one, but there are others. And yes, if that's what it took, they could have stood behind her chair and watched her like a lot of parents do when their CHILDREN are online. Would you let your kids walk into a room full of strangers and just leave them there alone? No, so why is the net any different?

**Greenday** · 01-24-2008, 01:18 AM

I guess that stuff would work for a few kids, but then again, you have kids like me who hack their school's firewalls for fun and then laugh when teachers ask how you got passed all the firewalls. I was good at hiding it though.

Being realistic though, who has time to stand over their kids and watch every single thing their kids do? Most people don't. Most parents are working so if the kid is home after school, no one is there to watch everything they do.

And I'm guessing her parents just didn't talk to her about talking to people online. A lot of parents didn't grow up with the internet so it still confuses them. My mom still always warned me about meeting people online and I've been chatting with random people from the internet since I was 13 years old. I mean, I've been on CS since I was 15.

Basically, what I'm getting at is, where there's a will, there's a way. Even if you supervise your kids at home, they can just go to a friend's house, they can go to the library, internet cafes, etc. There's plenty of places for them to go to. You just can't stop a kid from doing what they want on the internet if they really want to do it.

**Seshat** · 01-24-2008, 02:00 AM

Greenday's interpretation of what I meant is essentially correct: the 'punishments' you advocate for the perpetrators are insignificant.

Also, from my memory of the story, there would have been nothing for the parents to 'monitor' up until the end of the event - the climactic event that so upset the victim.

As I recall, all the victim or her parents would have seen would have been a standard teenage romance, played out over internet messaging rather than the letters or phone calls of earlier generations. What should the parents have shielded her from? Classic, typical teenage behaviour? Learning about romance and dating in a way which, as far as they could see, was relatively safe so long as they knew where she physically was and looked over her shoulder to check that the notes were within reasonable bounds? (No cybersex, for example.)

Finally, on the question of who's at fault in self-harm: let's take that to the suicide thread as well, if you want to discuss it. Someone will need to create the thread if it's a topic to be discussed.

And on the question of 'is online bullying worse than physical': that's another thing to take to another thread. It's a separate, though related topic. My personal opinion is that online bullying is equivalent to verbal/emotional bullying, and I've known people who couldn't escape it just by leaving a particular site: their bullies traced them quite tenaciously.

However, any further comments on that topic will go to a separate thread.

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This story makes me sick.

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