The US Economy

[Seshat]

695 Billion Dollars is how much has been spent on the war so far as of 02/01/08.

Think you could get a free GP appointment, dental checkup and optometric check for every man, woman and child in the country out of that?

[rahmota]

Boozy: Reality has very little to do with some people's perception of the world..

Dale: I know what you mean the occupation of Iraq has cost quite a bit of dough, and the intangible costs are probably irrerparable and uncountable. Human lives, diplomatic issues, hard feelings among muslims. How lovely.

Ohio has 88 counties. That means each county would get 159,090,909$ My home couty has according to the last census a population of 40,875 that means each person in my county could have gotten a check for $3,892.,13 talk about an economic stimulus package.

AFP: Yeah definately.

Seshat: Well given the 38 hundred figure I came at I could go to the doctor, eye doctor, dentist, and still have enough left over to go to the gym for several months.. Or fill every tank on every vehicle I own with premium gas. Or get a used car or two. Get two horses. Pay my property taxes and haveenough leftover to go to a nice dinner. So yeah definately could use that money....

[CancelMyService]

Speaking of subsidies, I don't see it get a lot of press that the whole Ethanol/Corn based fuel craze that GM is trying to push with all their big gas guzzler brands is just another ridiculous subsidy to the giant corn farming companies. We'll still end up paying out the nose, and fuel companies will still be gouging people.


The whole fuel industry is a giant scam on a level no one really understands. There's the basic "GRR oil companies making profit" level that most people get, and there's the deliberate idling of refineries to create false shortages (and price hikes) that people don't want to believe our government would allow.

Consider after Katrina hit (along the Gulf Coast where a lot of the shipping lanes for oil were located) the government was able to tap into its reserves to keep prices from skyrocketing until repairs were made. The government could get gas prices back to $1 a gallon if they want to, but considering practically everyone in charge has some form of holdings in oil, they'd be stupid to do it.

[rahmota]

Cancel: Well I am a supporter of biofuels production as a lot it is being done by small startups or farming cooperatives. So the fuel companies are not really being involved in a positive way as more biofuels means less petrofuels and their profits go down.

I'll agree that the corn producers that benefit the most are the large corporate farms but in this case it does benefit a lot of others some. Now I'll agree that my profits from soybeans are not up tremendously. but futures for biofuel producing crops are going up as it takes hold.

In Biofuels I'll say the risks do not outweigh the benefits as a whole.

The last two paragraphs I'll agree totally with you on.

[AFPheonix]

The problem with using corn for ethanol is that it uses net more energy to produce than it itself generates as a fuel. It's a pretty fertilizer and water hungry crop.

I don't know about soybeans, my understanding is that they're easier to grow and use less resources than corn. It's not grown in my area, mostly it's dry crops like winter wheat, barley, and oats. We also grow a lot of hops, walnuts, wine grapes and christmas trees. We're also one of the largest producers of philberts. Soy? Not so much.

Some of the natural grasses are able to be turned into ethanol from what little I've read. I frankly think that would be a better use of some acreage than corn, especially near wildlife refuges. Allow wild critters to graze, and hay it occasionally.

[Seshat]

Almost any plant matter can become ethanol: it's more a matter of how efficiently it can be fermented than whether it's possible.

Almost any plant oil can become biodiesel, as well. And many plant oils can be used in the variants of diesel engines that will take unmodified clean vegetable oil: just press it, filter the oil, and bung it in the tank.