Of bogus sexual harassment claims and a collage degree myth (long)

[HEMI6point1]

Don't want to make two threads so I'll just lump them into one and broke it up into two parts....

The tales of bogus SH claims:

One day while at work, a co-worker and I started talking about sexual harassment claims and the legitimacy of them. I told him that I read that 50% of them are thrown out for "lack of merit." He didn't believe me, so I told him to look it up. And he did, and he told me I was right.

See, a lot of people call me sexist for this but many women file sexual harassment claims for the dumbest things. These frivolous complaints make it tough for the legit complaints to go through, which is pretty crappy IMO.

Here are stories of women who filed sexual harassment complaints on men which were later tossed out but not before the guys accused got fired. These were from various TV talk show segments (some local, some national). Here's the stories (and no they were not NOW members, LOL):

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1. Woman worked at a place that I guess had casual Thursdays and Fridays. One man took a liking to her and complimented her on her appearance and looks ie: You look pretty/nice today etc.

Woman said she didn't think anything of it until she noticed he only complimented her if she wore something sleeveless and/or low-cut. So she filed a sexual harassment complaint because "he only noticed me when I was showing skin and it started to make me uncomfortable."

Host of said show basically asked what everybody in the room was thinking, "Do you honestly expect any heterosexual man to compliment you when you're completely covered up on the other days? You were basically complaining on a male for being.... male."

Woman then said, "Yeah every one of my girlfriends basically said the same thing. And while none of my other male co-workers complimented me as much as he did, they all did the same thing pretty much. I felt kind bad afterwords so I tried to have it retracted."

HEMI's take: Gee, 'Ya think?! They interviewed the man and he said it's been tough finding work because the job he got fired from listed the reason for termination as SH even though the original complaint was dropped.

ETA: I personally have no problem with telling a female CW if she looks pretty. No one complains.

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2. Woman was always being told she had the figure to go into modeling by various people (mostly men, probably). She mentioned it in passing to a male co-worker who then said on his off days he's a photographer, and one of the things he shoots is glamour shots of models. He offers her a session to shoot some test shots on her day off and gives him the website address to his portfolio.

Well the woman checked it out, and in her words "was horrified, there was mostly topless and nude women!" When she next saw him she said, "you pervert, how dare you suggest I show my tits for your damn camera?!" Man says to her, "What do you think glamour photography is? It's tasteful shots from lingerie up to nude." Well the woman complained to the head office and the man got the axe.

The host asked her, "And what if he took those pictures and they got noticed by a modeling agency and they wanted to hire you?"

Woman said, "Look if I wanted to take naked pictures of myself and send them in I would have already done so. I don't need some guy asking me to strip off in front of him."

HEMI's take: When a woman refers to glamour shots as "naked pictures" then it proves how clueless she is about the modeling industry. Oh, and the guy that got fired? First, all he was going to do was casual (jeans and tank top) pictures of her, hardly "naked." After he was axed, he decided to concentrate on his photography full-time, where his work was noticed and he got offered a gig for a major magazine.

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3. Woman said a man asked her out on a date after finding out she was single. Woman said, "I have plans so I'm going to have to pass." Man says "Well let me know when you don't have any more plans."

Well she cried sexual harassment because - get this - she was offended because according to her she was way out of his league and he should have known better.

The guy got fired because of the office's "zero tolerance" rule.

The host of the show asked her, "Haven't you heard of 'can't blame a guy for trying'? And what was so bad about him asking you out on a simple date?"

The woman said, "I know, but he was fugly! I lodged the complaint because he needed to know that when you can only afford to buy McDonald's you don't go for Filet Mignon." She also mentioned that many of her colleagues were pissed at her because her actions cost the company one of their best employees.

The host showed a picture of the man - who by now found a better job - and his girlfriend who was beautiful. The look on her face was priceless.

HEMI's take: Getting a man fired because you think you're too hot for him is just low, simple as that. And I would think the same thing too if the genders were reversed.

[HEMI6point1]

College degree myth: under pressure

One of my co-workers brought this up. He said he was talking to a friend of his who is an HR head for a company. He asked his HR friend, "let's say two people apply for the same position. One guy has no collage degree but has 6 major certifications, has both tech support and field experience plus customer service experience so he would need very little training. The other guy has 1 very minor certification, very little experience and has a basically basket-weaving degree from a well-known school. Who would you hire?"

His HR friend says he would pick the guy with the degree, even though the other guy is much more qualified. When asked why, the HR guy said "By having a degree he shows he is able to handle pressure and/or challenges well. You can always train. With the other guy, he’s qualified on paper but what happens if he is faced with a tough situation or deadline? He’s more likely to be like, ‘forget this shit’ and quit."

I told him his friend is way off and downright insulting. Why? Having a collage degree doesn’t mean you’re smart and can handle pressure, and not having one doesn’t mean you’re dumb and will crack under pressure.

I let him know something: Some people just aren’t test takers. To which my co-worker said, “The people who spout off that line are usually lazy.” BS, some people I know aren’t “test takers” and they have found great jobs.

Another thing is that some people (like myself) don’t want to sign up to get a degree in – for example – electrical engineering (something I would like to do) and then have to write term papers on George Washington and William Shakespear as well. I can understand having math courses, but what does the other stuff have to do with electrical engineering?

I understand one can go to a reputable technical school like Devry and they cut out all the bullshit, but they charge extra due to the convenience of getting right down to the meat of what you’re trying to learn.

I have talked to people who have degrees and they can’t find work, because prospective employers tell them they’re “overqualified.” Then when someone comes along that doesn’t have a degree, they brush them off. Silly, huh?

HEMI’s take: It’s pretty sad when employers brush off good candidates just because they don’t have what amounts to many times a $60,000 piece of paper (Can anyone say liberal arts? Haha). The myth that people without degrees can’t handle pressure or difficult situations is crap, and no matter how much training a job can give nothing beats real-world experience. If these people were to give these candidates a chance, they might be pleasantly surprised.

[AdminAssistant]

Well the woman checked it out, and in her words "was horrified, there was mostly topless and nude women!" When she next saw him she said, "you pervert, how dare you suggest I show my tits for your damn camera?!" Man says to her, "What do you think glamour photography is? It's tasteful shots from lingerie up to nude." Well the woman complained to the head office and the man got the axe.

The host asked her, "And what if he took those pictures and they got noticed by a modeling agency and they wanted to hire you?"

Woman said, "Look if I wanted to take naked pictures of myself and send them in I would have already done so. I don't need some guy asking me to strip off in front of him."

HEMI's take: When a woman refers to glamour shots as "naked pictures" then it proves how clueless she is about the modeling industry. Oh, and the guy that got fired? After he was axed, he decided to concentrate on his photography full-time, where his work was noticed and he got offered a gig for a major magazine.

When I hear the word "glamour shots" I think of those really overdone photos they used to do in the mall. Anybody else know what I'm talking about? At any rate, asking a co-worker to pose for partially or fully nude pictures is completely unprofessional.

Collage degree myth: under pressure

You mean, I can get a degree in how to artfully cut out pictures and assemble them on postboard? Exciting!

I let him know something: Some people just aren’t test takers. To which my co-worker said, “The people who spout off that line are usually lazy.” BS, some people I know aren’t “test takers” and they have found great jobs.

Y'know...tests aren't going away. I hate standardized tests. Hate them. However, I knew that my educational future rested on the results of a test (the ACT) so I took a damn class, practiced, and got it out of the way. I hate that a select few individuals are wanting us to turn our educational system on its head because they "can't take tests." Testing is a crucial part of the process, since that's the only way to prove that a student has acquired necessary learning.

Another thing is that some people (like myself) don’t want to sign up to get a degree in – for example – electrical engineering (something I would like to do) and then have to write term papers on George Washington and William Shakespear as well. I can understand having math courses, but what does the other stuff have to do with electrical engineering?

I understand one can go to a reputable technical school like Devry and they cut out all the bullshit, but they charge extra due to the convenience of getting right down to the meat of what you’re trying to learn.

I didn't want to take physics or college algebra or biology. But, that's what you have to do to get a bachelor's degree.

I would not call DeVry "reputable." Then again, I am highly suspicious of all of the for-profit schools that offer certificates instead of actual degrees.

(Can anyone say liberal arts? Haha).

Gosh, you mean, all of my friends that went and got arts degrees wasted our time? Oh no! I guess that I better call all of my friends that are lawyers, graphic designers, working actors, producers, arts administrators, stage managers, directors, or otherwise working professionals that we all wasted our time on a $60,000 piece of paper, and that we didn't gain any life skills that have helped us get into the profession of our choice.

[HEMI6point1]

When I hear the word "glamour shots" I think of those really overdone photos they used to do in the mall. Anybody else know what I'm talking about? At any rate, asking a co-worker to pose for partially or fully nude pictures is completely unprofessional.

Um, the man offered the woman an opportunity to have some test shots done. Doesn't mean she has to go nude or even show boobage. Glamour modeling can be tasteful posing in anything from jeans and a tank top to nightgowns, lingerie (slips, bras etcs) to full topless and nude. The woman I referenced jumped to conclusions and thought "Oh no he wants me to get my tits out!" even though he meant something casual (tank top and jeans shots), something I forgot to mention in my OP. I have since corrected it.

You mean, I can get a degree in how to artfully cut out pictures and assemble them on postboard? Exciting!

So I made a typo. The horror! And I fixed it anyway.

Y'know...tests aren't going away. I hate standardized tests. Hate them. However, I knew that my educational future rested on the results of a test (the ACT) so I took a damn class, practiced, and got it out of the way. I hate that a select few individuals are wanting us to turn our educational system on its head because they "can't take tests." Testing is a crucial part of the process, since that's the only way to prove that a student has acquired necessary learning.

I agree with you on this, except that I don't think people want to turn our educational system on it's head because they're not good at taking tests.

If I studied hard and took a test I personally feel I would do good as well.

I didn't want to take physics or college algebra or biology. But, that's what you have to do to get a bachelor's degree.

I would not call DeVry "reputable." Then again, I am highly suspicious of all of the for-profit schools that offer certificates instead of actual degrees.

Devry gives you a legit bachelor's degree once you graduate. I know some people that went there and now they're in great jobs. You have to be careful though, I almost went to sign up for ITT until I discovered they're garbage.

Gosh, you mean, all of my friends that went and got arts degrees wasted our time? Oh no! I guess that I better call all of my friends that are lawyers, graphic designers, working actors, producers, arts administrators, stage managers, directors, or otherwise working professionals that we all wasted our time on a $60,000 piece of paper, and that we didn't gain any life skills that have helped us get into the profession of our choice.

Can't say about your friends (after all, I don't know them) but take a look at all the articles from the past 2 years that almost all say that a liberal arts degree is not worth the money compared to an engineering degree....

[AdminAssistant]

Can't say about your friends (after all, I don't know them) but take a look at all the articles from the past 2 years that almost all say that a liberal arts degree is not worth the money compared to an engineering degree....

Ah, now money is slightly different. No, I will never make as much money as someone with an engineering or chemistry degree. However, I can get a job in my field, and I will be much happier than if I had gotten a degree in something more "practical" but that I hated. This is, obviously, a sore spot with me. A liberal arts degree can be very practical; it just depends on what you want to do with it.

[HEMI6point1]

Ah, now money is slightly different. No, I will never make as much money as someone with an engineering or chemistry degree. However, I can get a job in my field, and I will be much happier than if I had gotten a degree in something more "practical" but that I hated. This is, obviously, a sore spot with me. A liberal arts degree can be very practical; it just depends on what you want to do with it.

Well, another thing to think about is people try to get any degree (even if it's classified as a basket-weaver) because they hear articles that say, "It doesn't matter what degree you have as long as you have a degree."

That is a very stupid statement because people follow it like it's gospel and wind up with degrees that are are completely useless for the jobs that they are applying for.

One girl at my job is bragging on how she's going to college for a degree in Holocaust Studies. I didn't even know that was a major until she told me. I feel sorry for her because I don't know any job that will consider that outside of history teaching.

The only time those articles are correct, like my OP states, is when companies want documented proof "you are able to handle pressure" and that's what a college degree supposedly shows them.

[Hobbs]

[B]

(Can anyone say liberal arts? Haha).

I'm a liberal arts major. Know what I'm doing once I graduate? I'm going to be a Space and Missiles officer. Lemme see you do that without a college degree...oh wait, you can't.

[HEMI6point1]

Aren't you in the air force? You already have a leg up in getting a job like that.

Either way, good for you. Not something I would do personally, but if you like it....

[Hobbs]

Aren't you in the air force? You already have a leg up in getting a job like that.

Either way, good for you. Not something I would do personally, but if you like it....

Officers in all branches of the Armed Forces need a college degree.

A leg up...? I got issued the job.

[AdminAssistant]

One girl at my job is bragging on how she's going to college for a degree in Holocaust Studies. I didn't even know that was a major until she told me. I feel sorry for her because I don't know any job that will consider that outside of history teaching.

Actually, Holocaust Studies is a really hot field right now. (There's a scramble to document anything and everything from the few remaining survivors.) One of my professors is about to publish her second book on the subject.

There's nothing wrong with teaching history. However, someone with a Holocaust Studies degree could also work for museums, libraries, or advocacy/remembrance groups. That could be a helpful side major to someone studying any of the social sciences, especially in an historical context. Not everybody is obsessed with getting the best paying job. A lot of us just want to do something that makes us happy.

Besides, who said you had to get a job in the exact field you want to work in? As I previously mentioned, I know many people with a bachelor's in theatre who have gone to law school. Many English majors end up getting a master's in library science. Some people have a bad case of academic burnout and open their own business.

Successfully completing a college degree, especially a post-graduate degree, is really damn difficult. It does show a level of hard work, dedication, and stick-to-it-ness. Trust me, I know.

Oh, and nobody gets a degree in basket-weaving. It's Creative Folk Art, tyvm.

[Hobbs]

What AdminAssistant said. My history degree is a bitch.

[BlaqueKatt]

Testing is a crucial part of the process, since that's the only way to prove that a student has acquired necessary learning.

no, just no-all it proves is that you can memorize answers/facts and regurgitate them on command-it does not prove you "learned" anything

this article is for grade school children but it still holds true for college level-as they still use standardized multiple choice tests. All that proves is you can memorize, can you use that knowledge? If not you didn't learn anything.

"The two primary problems with U.S. students' learning are not addressed. First, international and national studies have shown that U.S. students in general do not do well at analysis, synthesis, evaluation, application of knowledge or problem-solving -- that is, at real thinking in subject areas"

"More importantly, if students do not learn how to use algebra to solve problems, but just memorize formulas they may soon forget, then the tests will not support truly high standards."

this one is about college testing.

"We conclude that standardized tests of generic intellectual skills do not provide valid evidence of institutional differences in the quality of education provided to students. "

Measuring learning outcomes in higher education

recommends...standardized multiple choice tests-yup that shows you know how to apply what you've learned and not just memorized a bunch of crap to spew back onto paper.....

[Hobbs]

May I see your credentials in education then, Miss Blaquecatt, or can you only spout other people's research? As the brother of an educator, I can pretty much tell you that testing is a valid diagnostic tool for a person's learning.

[Rapscallion]

May I see your credentials in education then, Miss Blaquecatt, or can you only spout other people's research? As the brother of an educator,

Anyone got a spare irony meter? Mine just broke.

Rapscallion

[AdminAssistant]

I didn't say that standardized testing was fantastic, but it is a fact of life. Learning how to take tests (i.e. working the system) isn't such a bad thing. I had to pay, what, $250 for my ACT class? And spent...6 weeks doing that over a summer? The score I got as a result paid for 4 years of tuition, fees, room, and board with a stipend.

No, I hear people complain about testing of all types. I'm sorry, but we have to give some kind of test, whether it is subjective (short answer/essay) or objective (multiple choice, true/false, fill in the blank). Yet, every time we start preparing for mid-terms or finals, we get the chorus, "It's not fair that so much of our grade is based on the test. I'm just not a good test taker!" There are tons of classes on test prep. All of us hold 2-3 office hours a week, usually more before a midterm or final. We all make ourselves available to help students. You can even go through the disability office and request to take the test elsewhere with extra time. But very few take that initiative. It's frustrating to be expected to cater to 30 special snowflakes who think that everything in the class should revolve around them.