Unions!

[muses_nightmare]

I'm not against all unions by any means, but you have to look at them individually. I used to work for a casino which was unionized, our union sucked Essentially it only did any good for employees who had been working there for years, anyone under at least 2 years got screwed. Though, that was probably due to the poor barganing on the part of the Union reps, or perhaps something to do with the company itself in barganing. The contract we had was awful. and the pay wasn't horrible, but it wasn't very good either, especially for the dealers (IMHO), even those who had been working there for 5+ years weren't making over $10/h, which in BC isn't much. I made more per hour working at a gas station.

Okay, going to stop before I get into a rant about the general crappyness of the place.

[protege]

Anyone who thinks unions are good...obviously hasn't driven around SW PA anytime. We were once the steel capital of the US. Seriously, at one time, everything metal had some Pittsburgh steel in it. Now, all of that is gone--steel production is a former shadow of what it once was. Nearly every small town had some sort of mill, prep plant, or mine. Most of those towns...are now ghost towns.

The reason? Simple. Unions had used strikes to drive wages up, and ensure that the plants were never modernized. By the late 1970s, cheaper steel from overseas started coming in, and caused prices to fall. Because our steel cost more, the plants eventually closed, and killed our economy. By the time the steel companies did something, it was too late.

...and it wasn't just Pittsburgh either. Eventually, Pittsburgh seems to be coming back. But, the smaller towns--McKeesport, Hazelwood, Aliquippa, Duquesne, to name a few--haven't been so fortunate.

Oh, and let's not forget about "Jock" Yablonski. For those who don't know, he wanted to clean up the coal miner's union, which at that time, was very corrupt. After opposing the then-president, he, along with his family, was murdered in 1969.

I guess my views of unions are tainted a bit. Not surprising, considering where I live. (I guess I should mention that I witnessed several mine strikes during the 1980s, a few of which were violent! The last one I remember, involved miners blocking roads, and hurling rocks at cars...most of whom had no involvement with the company! Grandpa was politically connected in that town, so they left us alone.)

I admit though, unions once had a purpose--now, they're a relic of the past. Are they really necessary now?

[bunnyboy]

I have only a few problems with Unions, and one of the biggest is the whole idea of "Union shops". IIRC the term is basically for any company which unionizes and makes it where ALL workers are unionized... experienced this in my last job as a Security Guard... most useless union ever, represented both that company and the company I had worked with previously...previous company was actually able to get in essence workers choice (ie workers can be members if they wish) while the one i was with at the time was a union shop... meaning if i had stayed with the one previous I could have chosen to unionize (which would have been better from what I've seen rather than get told sign here and here or look for another job.

so yeah big problem there, a business can't tell a union to piss off, but an employee can't tell a union to piss off if it's a shop.


Oh and I don't think anyone's stated this yet, ever wonder why many unions get a bad rep... one compound word, blacklisting... do your job well and make the lazy jagoffs look bad and you get the fun of paying dues without having representation...

Of course living in the Reddest of Blue states I can't come out and say it, but Unions nowadays are pretty much a relic of the past which keeps the hard workers down with blacklisting, and lets those who just want to coast through.

AAAAAND as a bonus, wonder why some grocery stores cost more... see if their distribution center is unionised... the one I did security for was pretty much local and the cost of food at these places was damn near 50% higher than any of the others... why... well you see according to the union for the warehouse workers, actually making a whole box of melons unsellable by eating half of one (esentially stealing) and leaving the rind and other half in the box was something that just wasn't enough to get fired for... multiply that by about 40 different items (some of which are whole pallets) and you'll see why unions in some ways HAVE messed up our economy a little.