Not tipping is now a service to the waiter... what?

[fireheart17]

The authors take on tipping might work in a place like Australia. That's only because minimum wage is about $16/hr and the hospitality union pretty much negotiates a wage increase every couple of years to coincide with the raising cost of living.

Sort of. The only place I've seen a tip jar in Adelaide is at a group of cafes. But they usually provide great service regardless so I'll sometimes put a couple of dollar coins in.

As far as this article goes, I'd be willing to bet that the article writer believes that anyone on welfare is a lazy bastard as well, when places will refuse to hire somebody.

[smileyeagle1021]

$7.00/hr, I believe, however the "tipped job" minimum wage is $3.00/hr or so.

Federal minimum wage is now $7.25, raised this year... minimum wage for tipped employees (once again federal, states can and do set higher) is $2.15

[Lace Neil Singer]

Fumblebee, I don't think anyone would blame you for not tipping in your case. If they're ignoring you and being rude to you, fuck 'em.

Shortly after I joined CS, I posted my own story where I not only didn't tip due to bad service, I also complained to the manager. I actually felt guilty about it, but everyone on the board -- even those who waited tables -- backed me up.

I once had a waitress who anticipated a tip by stealing my change. I was eating alone, and my meal cost a tenner. I only had a twenty, and the waitress took it and didn't bring me back my change. I was going to tip her a couple of pounds cuz the service had been good; I asked her where my change was and she said, "Oh, I thought that was my tip." I told her it wasn't, and said I wanted my change. She replied, "I can't give it back, it's in the tip jar now."

That was when I went to the manager, who was extremely apologetic and comped my meal completely, giving me a refund. He said he'd speak to the waitress; I never saw her there again. I guessed that she'd been doing this for some while. It was extremely presumptious of her; in any case, she didn't get away with it with me, but I expect there'd been other patrons who didn't want to make any fuss who didm't complain, and she got away with it.

[smileyeagle1021]

Lace, that is wrong on so many levels... not just that she assumed a tip, but that she assumed a 100% tip... I have never seen service good enough to warrant a 100% tip (highest I've ever done was 33%)

[Giggle Goose]

When she brought the drink back out, she accidentally spilled it all over the table and all over my wife. The waitress was freaked out about it, but we made it clear that we understood that accidents happen.

I wish I had waited on YOU the night that I spilled a whole tray of waters on a 4-top. I quickly got them moved to another table and apologized profusely. None of the water actually got on them, but I didn't want them to have to sit near a mess like that. When I took their order for food, they said "we're not going to be wearing, it are we?" Hardy har har.

Anyhoo, thanks for the laugh with that article, Smiley. I was reading all the comments and the asinine way that douche was replying to them. I laughed so hard my roommate came in to see what could possibly be so funny

[Sarah Valentine]

This may be just my opinion, but that whole website from the link is full of fail.

[lupo pazzesco]

Not just YOUR opinion, Sarah...same here.

As to the article? As a former waitress, I can't help but be irked to a degree. That was, by far, one of the hardest jobs I've EVER done for so little pay, and having to wait on characters like him is a large reason why I don't think I'll ever wait tables again.

[EmiOfBrie]

Back when I could afford it, I used to regularly tip 33% at a local bar that did a limited food menu after 10pm, mainly because the person who took the order was the cook himself, and he was very polite and never flinched when we asked for a custom order.

After a few times doing that tip standard, the cook decided to start giving us double portions *heh*.

[KabeRinnaul]

Lace, that is wrong on so many levels... not just that she assumed a tip, but that she assumed a 100% tip... I have never seen service good enough to warrant a 100% tip (highest I've ever done was 33%)

I did 50% once. But I was dropping by a diner at 2:30 in the morning, in the town I used to go to college at (running late on a long road trip and everything else had closed). So it wasn't a big bill to begin with, they were working grave, and I knew the place.

My usual method is to just round up to the next dollar, and add onto that depending on service and such. It usually winds up at about 25-30%.

[Jester]

Jester weighs in....

I saw this, and immediately went and read the article. And then spent a fair amount of time responding to it. As you might expect, my response was sharp and to the point. I was civil, but I pointed out many of the author's errors, both factual and judgmental. I also encouraged him to contact me to continue the debate. To make sure he didn't miss my comment, I also messaged him to tell him about my comment. Needless to say, I was a bit peeved. For anyone who doesn't know, I've been in the food service industry longer than some of the CS.com members have been ALIVE.

Yeah, feel free to go read my comment.

He says he taught that waitress a lesson by leaving her a $.30 tip...uh, no, you taught that waitress that you are a cheap bastard.

To be fair, the waitress in the article pretty much sucked. However, from what I gathered of her attitude, I doubt she learned any lesson other than the one you think she learned. Sadly, undertipping bad service rarely teaches bad servers a damn thing. Something that, as a good server, drives me fucking nuts.

I have to ask, though, out of simple curiosity, why you're visiting a fundamentalist Christian website, Smiley... I'd think you'd try to avoid those?

Three words: "Know your enemy." I myself am on the email list of various organizations that I loathe and completely disagree with. It's always good to know the playbook of the opposition, don't you think?

I thought the employer had to pay tipped employees up to minimum wage if they didn't make it in tips.

Yes and no. I've been over this before, but once again: if over a full pay period (not one shift or even one week if the pay period is longer than that) the server's hourly pay plus declared tips do not add up to an hourly average of the minimum wage or more, the employer is required by law to make up the difference. This is rare thing. How rare? In 24 years in the industry, I have never had it happen to me or anyone I have worked with. And I have worked in places that are high rent and low rent, and in long-term jobs in three different states.

The only time it came close with me or my coworkers was when I was working at a hotel that was completely redoing the main bar/restaurant, and we set up a faux bar/restaurant area in the lobby. For those shifts, we generally read a book. Because we almost never had customers. (We had two other bars in the hotel, so our shifts at those bars balanced things out paywise.)

If it's like some of the places I've had friends work at, failing to make enough in tips that they have to cover the difference is grounds for termination, because obviously if you were providing quality service you wouldn't need the company to make up for lack of tips...

Or as sometimes happens, the server was declaring little or no tips, which the employer knew was absolute crap. In essence, servers who do this are trying to not only avoid paying taxes on their tips, they are trying to get a higher paycheck from their employer....in effect, stealing from their employer. I am not saying YOUR friends did this, Smiley, merely that this is what I have seen happen. It really is hard to make less than minimum wage at most restaurants.

The authors take on tipping might work in a place like Australia.

Since the author lives in Tennessee, I doubt he was referring to dining out Down Under.

I figured that because of Americas crappy minimum wage (is it like $6/hr? Even less?), that tips were just a fact of life when you go out to eat. The customer is essentially paying for the service.

The federal minimum wage is more, but the federal minimum wage for tipped employees is far less. Keep in mind that various states have different minimum wages for tipped employees....some stick to the federal low, and some (California, for example) go higher.

Didn't matter to us if the waiter was going to pass the letter on or not (figured he wouldn't)

Unless he was an idiot, he didn't pass it on.

If you are ever in a situation where you receive bad service, handing a letter to the server or leaving a comment card on the table is virtually a guarantee that no one in authority is going to hear about it.

Always get comment cards to managers or corporate. Or talk to the manager directly. It is human nature to not pass along a bad report about yourself to someone who can punish you for it. I doubt I am the only one here who hid a bad report card from their parents.

I'd think it would be tough to prove you *didn't* get enough tips; after all, they're so often done in cash.

True, but tips still have to be declared, and if you declare too little, either your employer or the Tax Man is going to start asking questions you probably don't want asked.

I have actually seen servers try to declare less than their charged tips, which is of course stupid. Can you be any more obvious?

I once had a waitress who anticipated a tip by stealing my change. I was eating alone, and my meal cost a tenner. I only had a twenty, and the waitress took it and didn't bring me back my change. I was going to tip her a couple of pounds cuz the service had been good; I asked her where my change was and she said, "Oh, I thought that was my tip." I told her it wasn't, and said I wanted my change. She replied, "I can't give it back, it's in the tip jar now."

Theft, pure and simple.

And even when it is an honest mistake, such behavior is unacceptable. Which is why when I have trained servers I have always told them to NEVER ask, "Do you need change?" It is presumptuous. I always always always say "I'll be right back with this. Hell, for all you know, they stuck a hundred dollar bill in the book to cover a $12 meal. Of COURSE they are going to need change.

I have talked to many non-servers who dine out who also feel that asking "Do you need change?" is presumptuous and some even consider it rude.

To ASSUME a tip is utterly ludicrous, rude, and unprofessional. Especially when the amount proffered is more than twice the amout of the check, as it was in Lace's case.

By the way, to say that they can't give it back because "it's in the tip jar now" is beyond ridiculous.

I have never seen service good enough to warrant a 100% tip (highest I've ever done was 33%)

Not saying I earned it or deserved it, but I once got a 1000% tip. Yes, I said THOUSAND.

[muses_nightmare]

To ASSUME a tip is utterly ludicrous, rude, and unprofessional. Especially when the amount proffered is more than twice the amout of the check, as it was in Lace's case.

Assuming a tip is something that will cause me to not tip at all, and have a talk with the manager. I was out with my boyfriend and his mom awhile back, and she paid using a credit card, but was tipping with cash, when the server saw no tip on the credit card receipt she actually said "no tip?" Yeah, now there won't be.

It can also affect other staff members, for example at the casino I worked at a server asked for a tip from a player, it pissed him and everyone else at that table off so much that none of them tipped any of the employees for a week, and the regular players kind of know each other, so it was a pretty lean week tip-wise.

[Peppergirl]

It can also affect other staff members, for example at the casino I worked at a server asked for a tip from a player, it pissed him and everyone else at that table off so much that none of them tipped any of the employees for a week, and the regular players kind of know each other, so it was a pretty lean week tip-wise.

Ok - now THAT was totally shitty on the players part. I completely understand and agree that the server was way out of line and should have been reprimanded, but to band together and punish a bunch of people who had nothing to do with it?

Huge dick move.

[muses_nightmare]

Ok - now THAT was totally shitty on the players part. I completely understand and agree that the server was way out of line and should have been reprimanded, but to band together and punish a bunch of people who had nothing to do with it?

Huge dick move.

Well yeah, I'd agree with you there, I'm sure everyone that got stiffed agreed to. But it happens unfortunately.

[smileyeagle1021]

and she paid using a credit card, but was tipping with cash, when the server saw no tip on the credit card receipt she actually said "no tip?" Yeah, now there won't be.

The one thing I will say to that is that in the future, it may be better to write down "cash" on the tip line so that the server knows that you aren't stiffing them when they run your card. It shouldn't make any difference in how they treat you, but I can understand how seeing a 0 tip might make a server a bit twitchy.

[Jester]

Twitchy? Sure. But there are going to be people who don't tip. That is a fact of life and a fact of this business we're in.

But you can't go questioning the guest. You can't follow them into the parking lot demanding a tip, you can't ask for a tip, and you can't question them when they don't tip you. NOTHING good can come of this. Nothing. Zero, zip, zilch. It is unprofessional and potentially dangerous if the customer is a violent sort.

True story, which I love telling: my uncle was a great guy. The kind of tough old bird that would walk around in the Boston winter in pants and an undershirt, and not think twice about it. Anyways, Uncle was a 10%/20% tipping guy. There was no 15% in his world. You either earned a 20% tip by doing a good job, or you sucked and got 10%. End of story.

Well, one day he was out with his family and the waiter was less than impressive. Uncle left 10% on the table, and was on his way out. The waiter came up to Uncle angrily waving the 10% tip in Uncle's face. "THIS is all I get?!?" Not one to be easily flustered, Uncle calmly took the money from the waiter's hand and asked, "You are not happy with this?" The waiter, still angry, said, "No, I am NOT!" Uncle calmly looked the waiter in the eye, said, "Then you get nothing," put the money in his pocket, and walked out the door.

My uncle rocked!