Schools giving students unexcused absences...

[protege]

Children should be allowed to have lives outside of school, even if that includes *gasp* missing a few days!

Tell that to the teachers I had growing up. They all seemed to think that we should be working on their pet homework assignment over break. As soon as any sort of holiday break came up, they'd give us additional homework over it. Seriously? Can't this shit wait?

But, I have taken days off "just because." In fact, I took off the last 2 weeks of my junior year in high school. Finals week was already over, and I was simply tired of people picking on me.

[Rageaholic]

Because, increasingly, a teacher's pay depends on Little Jimmy's aptitude in the materials that are supposed to be taught. As linguist said, every student gets ~ 4 months off of school and that's plenty of time for vacations, trips, etc.

And as been said, taking little Jimmy out of class for a vacation is not the same as a kid who constantly skips school. And while it sucks that the teachers pay depends on the students, applying such a blanket rule is unfair (but typical of the public schools). It should not be the students responsibility to make sure the teacher gets paid.

I always find it mildly amusing and sad that irresponsible parents never want to be called out on their irresponsibilities.

I always find it amusing that the schools think they have the authority to tell family's when they can go on vacation.

Tell that to the teachers I had growing up. They all seemed to think that we should be working on their pet homework assignment over break. As soon as any sort of holiday break came up, they'd give us additional homework over it. Seriously? Can't this shit wait?

But, I have taken days off "just because." In fact, I took off the last 2 weeks of my junior year in high school. Finals week was already over, and I was simply tired of people picking on me.

Don't you just love how those teachers acted as if their class is the most important thing in the world. I had a music teacher who actually outright said that the school play was more important than anything else the students could be doing. For one, it wasn't even part of school (it was at night), and two, to actually think that her stupid play was the most important thing a student could be doing, let alone more important than any other subject in school just reeks of arrogance.

Not all teachers are like that of course, but the ones who are just piss me off.

[stephenr]

The only time I ever really missed a lot of school was when I was in kindergarden. I had a diaphragmatic hernia that needed to be repaired. My small intenstines had gotten wrapped around my lungs through a hole in my diaphragm so I had to miss school for the surgery and recovery. Scary times but I don't remember much of it. I missed 26 days that year because of it. I wound up passing kindergarden because all those days were excused but the way I look at it when it comes to a kid missing school and it being considered unexcused because he doesn't have a doctors note or a death in the family, it really depends on the circumstance like if he has a cold or what not then it should be excused. I remember when I went to my finals sick as a dog, I felt like a zombie because I was so sick but they wouldn't let me make up the finals even though I was only absent 10 days that year out of the 18 you could miss. I passed all my finals. The irony was I felt a lot better the next day.

[Hobbs]

So someone like CH's girlfriend is being an irresponsible parent for wanting to spend a day with her child once every few months, when she doesn't get to normally due to the regular work/school schedule?

I'd say that's just the opposite of irresponsible, actually.

Okay, fail for not reading the reply to CH about his GF's situation. I said she could do it, and if she's going to museums etc, that's awesome. What I said was, if she does that, she shouldn't bitch because the school gives her kid an unexcused absence. There was no physical or emotional reason why he needed to miss classes that day.

Furthermore, taking a child for a "vacation"; how is that productive to their education?

Rage, I find it amusing that parents think they're so entitled that calenders, exams, tests, and classwork has to revolve around their own personal schedules. It's the perfect example of an EW in an educational setting.

[Rageaholic]

Rage, I find it amusing that parents think they're so entitled that calenders, exams, tests, and classwork has to revolve around their own personal schedules. It's the perfect example of an EW in an educational setting.

The parents are the entitled ones? Why? Because they plan a trip during school and don't want their kid to get penalized? Wow! What how entitled can they be?

The real EWs are the school heads who think they can tell everyone else what to do and think that their bullshit should take priority over everything else.

I don't see how not wanting to put up with that crap is being entitled. Especially since the school is funded by the parents tax dollars. They should at least have the right to plan a fucking vacation without the school heads breathing down their back like godzilla.

[KnitShoni]

Rage, I find it amusing that parents think they're so entitled that calenders, exams, tests, and classwork has to revolve around their own personal schedules. It's the perfect example of an EW in an educational setting.

Sometimes it isn't about entitlement. Sometimes there's really no reason for the child to be in school that day. Case in point: My husband takes my stepson out of school two days early at the end of the fall semester to go hunting. Why? Because all the tests he has to take (that he's not exempt from due to high grades and attendance, which tend to be most, if not all of them) are done earlier in the week. Those last two days, which are half-days, are left for holiday parties. So, the kids sit there, for four hours each day, basically screwing around. Why should he have to sit there doing nothing when he can go spend time with his father and grandfather? What could possibly be learned those last two half-days?

[Hobbs]

<snip>

Do you bitch about it being an unexcused absence? If so, that's entitlement, if not, then good on you.

[protege]

Don't you just love how those teachers acted as if their class is the most important thing in the world. I had a music teacher who actually outright said that the school play was more important than anything else the students could be doing. For one, it wasn't even part of school (it was at night), and two, to actually think that her stupid play was the most important thing a student could be doing, let alone more important than any other subject in school just reeks of arrogance.

My elementary school music teacher was like that. He was constantly keeping us late. He would actually *refuse* to dismiss us for lunch, and then couldn't understand why most of the school couldn't stand him. Sorry asshole, but we need to eat. We're not about to run across the street (the music rooms were in a different building), and miss lunch because you're on a fucking power trip. Of course, this is the same guy who chewed out a girl because she was shaking the maracas "wrong," so it doesn't really surprise me

[Hobbs]

I don't see how not wanting to put up with that crap is being entitled. Especially since the school is funded by the parents tax dollars. They should at least have the right to plan a fucking vacation without the school heads breathing down their back like godzilla.

Ah! I was wondering when someone was gonna use the ol' "My taxes pay your salary!" argument. The last-ditch argument against a public servant.

They're merely listing the absence as "unexcused" which it is. It's entitlement to think that you are a precious snowflake and that school rules, which apply to everyone, do not apply to you.

A vacation isn't a "right" in any sense of the word. I suggest you re-take your civics class.

[Rapscallion]

Don't you just love how those teachers acted as if their class is the most important thing in the world. I had a music teacher who actually outright said that the school play was more important than anything else the students could be doing. For one, it wasn't even part of school (it was at night), and two, to actually think that her stupid play was the most important thing a student could be doing, let alone more important than any other subject in school just reeks of arrogance.

Not all teachers are like that of course, but the ones who are just piss me off.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narciss...ality_disorder

If it's that condition, it's about one percent of teachers.

Rapscallion

[Rageaholic]

Ah! I was wondering when someone was gonna use the ol' "My taxes pay your salary!" argument. The last-ditch argument against a public servant.

They're merely listing the absence as "unexcused" which it is. It's entitlement to think that you are a precious snowflake and that school rules, which apply to everyone, do not apply to you.

A vacation isn't a "right" in any sense of the word. I suggest you re-take your civics class.

The unexcused absences lead to the school failing the student and making him repeat the grade. At worst, it could even be considered breaking the law (according to one of Maggie's eariler posts). All this over a few absenses that the school doesn't approve of.

I don't think I or anyone else is special, but I call BS on the rules. Those rigid rules shouldn't apply to anyone at all. It's just the school heads being controlling assholes to the people who pay their salary.

Now, I don't believe that teachers and all that are the taxpayers bitch. But there's something wrong with the picture when they are given hell for taking their kids out of school a few days just because they don't approve of it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narciss...ality_disorder

If it's that condition, it's about one percent of teachers.

Rapscallion

Sounds like Sheldon Cooper from Big Bang.

That could explain some of them (the music teacher), but I think a lot more suffer from this (especially the heads).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Control_freak

[Greenday]

Ah! I was wondering when someone was gonna use the ol' "My taxes pay your salary!" argument. The last-ditch argument against a public servant.

They're merely listing the absence as "unexcused" which it is. It's entitlement to think that you are a precious snowflake and that school rules, which apply to everyone, do not apply to you.

A vacation isn't a "right" in any sense of the word. I suggest you re-take your civics class.

It's a BS rule, that's why. No one should have to suffer because their school refuses to let them take a day off with their family. If they do badly in school because of it, that's on them. There's important stuff to worry about in schools and kids taking a day or two off because of a vacation isn't one of them.

I can't think of one valid argument for not excusing an absence to do a vacation.

[Hobbs]

The unexcused absences lead to the school failing the student and making him repeat the grade. At worst, it could even be considered breaking the law (according to one of Maggie's eariler posts). All this over a few absenses that the school doesn't approve of.

I don't think I or anyone else is special, but I call BS on the rules. Those rigid rules shouldn't apply to anyone at all. It's just the school heads being controlling assholes to the people who pay their salary.

Now, I don't believe that teachers and all that are the taxpayers bitch. But there's something wrong with the picture when they are given hell for taking their kids out of school a few days just because they don't approve of it.

It's a BS rule, that's why. No one should have to suffer because their school refuses to let them take a day off with their family. If they do badly in school because of it, that's on them. There's important stuff to worry about in schools and kids taking a day or two off because of a vacation isn't one of them.

I can't think of one valid argument for not excusing an absence to do a vacation.

If you let the absences pile up, then yes it is bad, and your student should be failed. You're the one being irresponsible in allowing them to miss school so often. IF I remember correctly, the total amount of unexcused absences is 10, or perhaps 15. If you've let your child miss 15 days of school a semester, that's pretty much an entire month of missed classes! Even 10 missed days is half a month. Even accounting for the last four or so days of nothing-days, that doesn't make up for the other 6 days you're being irresponsible. Why should they be passed when other kids went to school and did their work?

Greenday, let's make this perfectly clear; there is no obligation for a student to NEED to take a vacation during the school year. They already get federal holidays (most) Thanksgiving, Christmas Winter holidays, Spring Break and let's not forget the Summer holidays. Think of it another way; if you had taken a day off of work, NCNS, and upon returning told your boss you took it off for vacation, would you expect him to accept that as a valid excuse?

All I hear from y'all is quibbling. Don't break the rules and there'd be no problem.

[Greenday]

If you let the absences pile up, then yes it is bad, and your student should be failed. You're the one being irresponsible in allowing them to miss school so often. IF I remember correctly, the total amount of unexcused absences is 10, or perhaps 15. If you've let your child miss 15 days of school a semester, that's pretty much an entire month of missed classes! Even 10 missed days is half a month. Even accounting for the last four or so days of nothing-days, that doesn't make up for the other 6 days you're being irresponsible. Why should they be passed when other kids went to school and did their work?

Greenday, let's make this perfectly clear; there is no obligation for a student to NEED to take a vacation during the school year. They already get federal holidays (most) Thanksgiving, Christmas Winter holidays, Spring Break and let's not forget the Summer holidays. Think of it another way; if you had taken a day off of work, NCNS, and upon returning told your boss you took it off for vacation, would you expect him to accept that as a valid excuse?

All I hear from y'all is quibbling. Don't break the rules and there'd be no problem.

No one said anything about piling up absences with vacation. We said a day or two. I've skipped school before with permission from my mom. In college, I skipped classes albeit rarely. Boohoo, I wasn't there for lecture. If I missed an inclass assignment that was graded that day, I missed it and took the small hit to my grade. I made sure to get notes from a friend and still did the assigned homework. No different from what someone sick would have to do. No one gets hurt by this.

Considering all kids the same holidays, that means parents have to fight over who gets to take days off, sometimes many months in advance. And don't compare school to work, that's apples to oranges.

All I hear from the people siding with the school is...nothing related to why these rules are valid.

[AdminAssistant]

No one said anything about piling up absences with vacation. We said a day or two.

No one gets hurt by this.

No, I'm fairly certain that several people have said they would pull their kids out for an entire week.

And you get hurt by that. Not only are you missing whatever was taught, but you also earn a reputation as a slacker and a skipper with the prof. And that can hurt you more than anything, especially if you need something later.

School is work. The attitude that school is anything else is what's breeding the EW, pain in the ass students that I eventually have to deal with.

As Hobbs pointed out, a vacation is not a civil right and it is not a "need." Thousands of kids every year can't even afford to take trips. Should we be sponsoring all of these kids to go to The Great American Monuments in order for...?? cultural enrichment? Damned if I know. Schools do make a point to make field trips, usually one or two per year, to a local site of interest. For me, that would be the Civil Rights Museum, the State Capital, various camps/parks, theatre, art museums, etc. If something else came along that my folks wanted me to see, we went later. You make it sound like parents work 24/7 during the ENTIRE summer. Sorry, but no. Even if you can't take a week of vacation during summer break, you still have days off.

Perhaps it's because I see education as the way out for so many people. It's the way out of poverty, out of a bad neighborhood or community, out of an unhappy home. Busting ass in school everyday was the only reason I was able to go to college, since I earned a full-ride scholarship. Busting ass in college got me into a good master's program. That got me into a Ph.D. program at a top R-1 university. Even if you aren't an academic, a good high school/college education opens a hell of a lot of doors. Treating school as something that we do when we "feel like it" is a piss poor attitude to have. A lot of people worked and fought so that every single child in this country can earn a high school diploma at no cost to them - subsidized by all American taxpayers (not just Momsy and Dadsy). If millions of tax dollars are going to fund the opportunity for your child to get an education, the least you can do is make sure that his ass is in his seat unless there's a damn good reason for it not to be.