"Occupy" turning to violence

[linguist]

So because the cops don't film their jobs and throw the videos on youtube, it doesn't count? LOLno. Considering this was the first thing I saw on the news when I turned the TV, I'm going to ahead and accept it as fact that this group was closer to being rioters than peaceful protests.

you always accept what you're told without question? maybe cops should film their work. it would certainly clear up and doubts about lies to justify use of force, as if that's never happened before. but of course they won't, because then they'd actually have to follow the rules themselves.

and you never did answer my question regarding whether you actually watched the video. if you haven't, allow me to describe:

a man is lying on the ground bleeding profusely from the head. less than 20 feet away, a group of cops are standing there watching him without making any attempt to render aid. when a group of fellow protestors comes over to help him (not one of them coming anywhere near any of the cops), one cop steps back, looks around as if to make sure nobody is watching, then lobs a flash grenade right into the middle of the group.

how exactly is that a justified use of force?

[Andara Bledin]

Considering this was the first thing I saw on the news when I turned the TV, I'm going to ahead and accept it as fact that this group was closer to being rioters than peaceful protests.

Nothing like the police overstepping their bounds to turn a peaceful protest into a full-blown riot.

My brother watched a man bleed to death in the middle of the street while the police on the scene prevented the EMS team from helping him because they didn't think he was worth helping. You'll have to pardon me if I refuse to accept anything as stated without a little evidence.

^-.-^

[protege]

Oh no! I attacked the cops and they fought back!
Oh no! I prevented the cops from doing their job and the cops did something about it!

I'm sure there are some assholes who look for an excuse to beat people, but some of them deserve it. That's like the G20 idiots here awhile back. They were hurling rocks and bottles at the police, sending burning dumpsters into police cars...and they bitched and moaned about how the police fought back. They came here to cause trouble, and then attempted to play the "victim" card. Sorry, but fuck that shit.

[Greenday]

They came here to cause trouble, and then attempted to play the "victim" card. Sorry, but fuck that shit.

Exactly. And they are threatening another violent protest again.

[linguist]

. They came here to cause trouble, .

every single one of them? you know this for certain?

even if some did, it doesn't justify use of potentially deadly force on those who are not causing trouble, especially (as in the video i posted) those who were doing nothing more than trying to help an injured man.

Exactly. And they are threatening another violent protest again.

you still haven't answered my question. did you watch the video, or at least read the description of it? if so, how was that use of force justified when those shown were doing nothing but trying to help someone?

[Nyoibo]

Considering this was the first thing I saw on the news when I turned the TV, I'm going to ahead and accept it as fact that this group was closer to being rioters than peaceful protests.

Because of course the media would never lie or show bias in any way

[Canarr]

Well, in the video that linguist posted, there was absolutely no rioting going on; so, no reason to throw a flash-bang into the middle of a group attempting to aid an injured person.

However, I can't really make out who throws that thing, or from where. So, don't know how the commenter on the video identified one of the cops?

[Gravekeeper]

Well, in the video that linguist posted, there was absolutely no rioting going on; so, no reason to throw a flash-bang into the middle of a group attempting to aid an injured person.

However, I can't really make out who throws that thing, or from where. So, don't know how the commenter on the video identified one of the cops?

Turn on HD and fullscreen it, you can see the cop toss it. You can also hear people yelling to help the guy. A flashbang can do some serious damage at close range, especially if someone tosses it by your head while you're laying on the ground. -.-

Also, if you follow the link off of the Youtube video to the entire video you can see the whole lead up to the incident. To be fair, the cops did warn the protestors, though I'm not sure how many heard the guy. But also to be fair, the protestors were peaceful and did nothing at all except refuse to move. They did absolutely nothing to warrant tossing a flashbang at an injured man. Let alone anything to warrant the use of flashbangs at all instead of just gas to disperse them.

Oddly, the police also did not advance and stayed behind the barricade just lobbing artillery? If they had advanced in a riot line, they could have pulled that injured guy to safety and gotten him to the paramedics.

Also, despite Greenday's blanket generalization, there are multiple Occupy protests going on in multiple cities and seeing as its not exactly an organized movement, the make up and tone of each group obviously differs. As does the police response in every given city. So generalizing either way doesn't work.

NY cops have clearly been raging assholes from the get go for example. But I'll give the benefit of the doubt elsewhere until they do something like, well, throw a flashbang at an incapacitated civilian. -.-

[bara]

I am of the opinion that law enforcemt should start video recording everything. I cant remember exactly which video it was, but I did see some bright blue paint in a riot helmt that had obviously been recently applied.

What Ive noticed though, and I could be wrong on this point, is that no 'violence' occurs until after police show up. This is why I feel police should record things. But as someone else said, then they would have to follow the rules themselves.

In one case, the police told everyone to leave so the park could be cleaned or something, the people left and then returned, presumably as the article didnt mention it, after the park had been cleaned. Then the cops started arresting people, which caused problems.

[Gravekeeper]

Gah, now that I watch that in HD again, they aimed at that dude TWICE? What the fuck? Right after the flashbang, you can see a tear gas canister come flying in from the bottom of the frame right at the injured dude again.

[Gravekeeper]

I am of the opinion that law enforcemt should start video recording everything. I cant remember exactly which video it was, but I did see some bright blue paint in a riot helmt that had obviously been recently applied.

They should, however, an unsettling amount of officers seem to do whatever they can to avoid being filmed.

[Hyena Dandy]

Considering this was the first thing I saw on the news when I turned the TV, I'm going to ahead and accept it as fact that this group was closer to being rioters than peaceful protests.

GD, that is some... Pretty faulty logic there. The fact that you saw it on the news means they were rioters?

[Gravekeeper]

GD, that is some... Pretty faulty logic there. The fact that you saw it on the news means they were rioters?

Even if you do ignore that various themes and agendas of US news networks, the protests have been going on for well over a month. US News has zilch interest in them unless something violent happens. So turning on the news a month and a half into it and going "Ah ha!" because of on incident in one city is indeed pretty faulty logic.

[Hyena Dandy]

I thought we were only talking about that incident here, that seems to be what Greenday was referring to, since he said that he assumed that THOSE protesters were rioting, not that they're all simultaneously rioting.

[Gravekeeper]

I thought we were only talking about that incident here, that seems to be what Greenday was referring to, since he said that he assumed that THOSE protesters were rioting, not that they're all simultaneously rioting.

Yes, I could be mistaken there. But Greenday's view entire thread has been generalized so far.