Hospital aborts wrong baby

[HYHYBT]

So even putting the best face on it, it's still pretty bad all around.

Seems like the thing to do would be to wait, and keep a close eye on things, so that *if* the one died they could do something then.

[Andara Bledin]

yes and if they attempted to remove the deceased fetus...

Except for the fact that none of the articles give any indication that there was a great likelihood that there would be any deceased fetus to cause issues. Yes, there was a possibility that the one twin might not have lived until birth. That's also a possibility with completely healthy babies as well.

Based on the information that has been presented in the articles I read, the one twin had a heart defect that would likely have resulted in a tough life for that child. Or it might not have. Death prior to birth does not seem to have been a particularly high risk; at least not high enough to make an abortion at 32 weeks the preferable choice.

Granted, we're all working with less than full information, but nothing that's been reported indicates that either baby was in immediate peril.

^-.-^

[Kaylyn]

Thanks for the clarification, Andara and others. I managed to completely overlook the hospital name being mention in the DM article. Twice, even. ><

I can't really add much to the discussion, as there isn't much to go on here, and really, only the mother and the doctor really know what was best in the situation. All I can say is it was a tragedy for her to lose both her babies because of this. I know if it were me, I would have waited and seen what happened rather than trying to terminate one of the fetuses, especially that late in development. And yes, I'm pro-choice as well. But I'm not her and can't make her choices for her. Perhaps there was another, more personal, reason that we don't know about that caused her and her doctor to come to this decision.

[Beckpatton]

Yeah sorry, guess I could have found a better article, I first heard it here on the news, and I basically just took the first article I googled for my post. But it's definitely a real situation, at a hospital here where I live.

The whole thing is just tragic!

[FArchivist]

I guess I see this opening a floodgate, and where do we draw the line? Babies with serious medical conditions, to babies of the "wrong" gender.. (I heard a report earlier this year of a couple terminating a pregnancy because it was a boy when they wanted a girl!! and that was after IVF!)

You don't. Either you're pro-choice with all that implies or you are not. Decide which you prefer.

[Andara Bledin]

You don't. Either you're pro-choice with all that implies or you are not. Decide which you prefer.

Bullshit.

The world is not black and white.

Being pro choice is not the same as being in favor of late term abortion or abortions for purely frivolous reasons.

In some cases, there are those who are pro-choice only in circumstances of danger to the mother or extreme defect of the child.

^-.-^

[Sleepwalker]

What is a frivolous abortion?

I never cease to be disgusted at the number of people who want to force children on people who don't want them. Cruel to child and parent. Not wanting to undergo pregnancy and/or parenthood is a perfectly valid reason to abort.

[Greenday]

What is a frivolous abortion?

People who use abortions as a form of contraception instead of condoms and/or birth control.

[Boozy]

"I'm pro-choice, except when the woman is a total slut and is using abortion instead of birth control."

How is that pro-choice? You are still substituting your judgment about what she needs to do with her body for her own.

You either admit that women are in control of their own bodies or you don't. That's pro-choice, and that's what FArchivist meant.

[Beckpatton]

You don't. Either you're pro-choice with all that implies or you are not. Decide which you prefer.

True, very true. Just because I'm uncomfortable with other peoples decisions, I'd be a hypocrit to take that choice away. I will always be Pro-Choice as it's better than no choice.

[Andara Bledin]

What is a frivolous abortion?

People who go, "Oh, hey, it's a girl and I wanted a boy, so I'm going to flush this perfectly healthy baby that I would otherwise give birth to if it matched up to my expectations" are frivolous. That's like giving your kid to the foster system because he turns out to have red hair or he doesn't have blue eyes.

People who use it as a form of birth control, particularly when they do so early in the pregnancy, are not. They're not necessarily going about things in the smartest manner, but that is one of the purposes of abortion in the first place.

^-.-^

[Greenday]

"I'm pro-choice, except when the woman is a total slut and is using abortion instead of birth control."

How is that pro-choice? You are still substituting your judgment about what she needs to do with her body for her own.

You either admit that women are in control of their own bodies or you don't. That's pro-choice, and that's what FArchivist meant.

Pro-choice doesn't have to mean "Abortions are awesome for any and all reasons!" For many people it can mean, abortions in cases of rape, incest, way too young to have a baby, severe birth defects, but not because you just don't feel like taking a pill every day or using a condom.

[Hyena Dandy]

You don't. Either you're pro-choice with all that implies or you are not. Decide which you prefer.

That's nonsense. People should be able to have opinions more nuanced than just a binary "I want this in all cases" or "I want this in no cases."

Its ridiculous to demand people's opinions always be consistent with YOUR view of the world. They could be perfectly consistent, and just not be seeing the dilemmas the same way as someone else.

[FArchivist]

Bullshit. The world is not black and white. Being pro choice is not the same as being in favor of late term abortion or abortions for purely frivolous reasons.

Pro-choice means that you support other people having the choice of abortion for themselves, regardless of reason. You may disagree with their reason, but that's not really relevant - it's their choice and that's all that matters.

In some cases, there are those who are pro-choice only in circumstances of danger to the mother or extreme defect of the child.

Yeah, that's a standard pro-life position. No, you don't have a choice to have an abortion, except in these certain cases. That's not really pro-choice.

Directly from the literature: To be "pro-choice" is to believe that individuals have unlimited autonomy with respect to their own reproductive systems as long as they do not breach the autonomy of others.

Emphasis mine. Unlimited autonomy means exactly that: unlimited. If I condemn the woman in the article for having an abortion, then that makes me a complete hypocrite. It was her choice. If I am pro-choice, I have to respect and support that choice, even if I do not agree with the reason.

That's nonsense. People should be able to have opinions more nuanced than just a binary "I want this in all cases" or "I want this in no cases." Its ridiculous to demand people's opinions always be consistent with YOUR view of the world. They could be perfectly consistent, and just not be seeing the dilemmas the same way as someone else.

See what I just said above.

[Andara Bledin]

I like how you "directly quote" from "the literature" and fail to provide any links to said literature.

Of those sources I found for the quote as you stated it, there were a number of anti-choice websites holding that concept up as a straw man for easy defeat, since a more nuanced, and more realistic, position is much harder to fight against. The only neutral source further expanded that part of the pro-choice position is for the legality of abortion through the first two trimesters, not unlimited abortion.

Also, regardless of whether the abortion was legal or not (which was never called into question), this is about the advisability. Just because you can doesn't mean you should.

^-.-^