Homeowner's association vs disabled child

[Glados]

Homeowner's association is forcing family to remove a playhouse used for their child's therapy.

This angers me. I cannot comprehend the heartlessness that is required to deny a three year old an item that is helping with therapy simply because the HOA doesn't want detached structures. It doesn't look bad and it's not hurting anyone.

[HYHYBT]

HOAs are evil, pure and simple. It is none of your neighbors' business what buildings you have on your property (unless they are causing a danger). It is none of your neighbors' business what color your house is, or how often you cut the grass, or how many trees you have, or any of the other things such organizations push on people. Going to another recent thread, they are another example of something that ought not to exist because, although they are theoretically optional in that you could live somewhere else, they aren't really.

However, in this case, if the problem is only that it's not attached, why not move it up against the main house and get out the hammer?

[Rageaholic]

Wow, more dumbass bureaucrats who use their useless rules to inconvience those they should be working for.

Nothing new here.

[Duelist925]

However, in this case, if the problem is only that it's not attached, why not move it up against the main house and get out the hammer?

Thats the kinda thing my dad would do--dont like it being detaches? OK.

(half an hour, a two by four, and a screwgun later)

Go fuck yourself. Its attached.

One of the few benefits of being decended from rednecks.

[Panacea]

The best cure for an HOA is not to move into one.

Which means finding an older neighborhood that is still decent, whose CCR's have expired. These places do still exist (I live in one).

But yeah, these HOA's are just an excuse for jerks on a power trip to give other people grief.

I'll never buy a home with an HOA.

[Rapscallion]

The concept of HOA is actually a good one. I could do with an incentive to get my garden sorted out because - quite frankly - I'm a scruff in that regard.

The real problem with HOAs, from what I hear from people, are the people who run them. The HOAs that become notorious are the ones run by people who have no give, and are enjoying their power trips by creating their own standards and forcing them on others.

Rapscallion

[bhskittykatt]

This could easily have happened in the neighborhood I grew up in. They had all sorts of crazy rules. They'd consider this playhouse a detached structure and wouldn't allow it, since you can't have those.

(As an example of their idiocy, my friend's family fell in love with this cedar-stain siding, and got approval to stain their siding that color. They had it for a week before they were told to change it because when the morning sunlight hit it the house looked too orange. No I am not kidding.)

[Andara Bledin]

It's always the people.

The HOA just provides a framework for small people who want to feel big and powerful to do so.

^-.-^

[FArchivist]

Wow, more dumbass bureaucrats who use their useless rules to inconvience those they should be working for.

Nothing new here.

HOAs aren't bureaucracies and don't have bureaucrats in them. They're privately contracted neighborhood organizations. In order to be a bureaucrat, you have to be a member of a public agency engaged in the formation and implementation of public policy.

[Gravekeeper]

I'm going to go against the grain here and look at this without the sympathy card blinders on. The parents were aware of the HOA and its rules, they agreed to the HOA rules, yet they still went ahead and built this playhouse because they "Figured it wouldn't be a problem.". Instead of checking with the HOA first before dropping 5 grand. That's pretty stupid, frankly.

That said, the HOA are being a bunch of dick buckets and could have tried to be helpful here and suggested something like making it an attached structure instead so it fullfills the letter of the law so to speak.

HOAs aren't bureaucracies and don't have bureaucrats in them. They're privately contracted neighborhood organizations. In order to be a bureaucrat, you have to be a member of a public agency engaged in the formation and implementation of public policy.

Incorrect.

Bureaucracy (bjʊəˈrɒkrəsɪ)
— n , pl -cies
1. A system of administration based upon organization into bureaus, division of labour, a hierarchy of authority, etc: designed to dispose of a large body of work in a routine manner
2. Government by such a system
3. Government or other officials collectively
4. Any administration in which action is impeded by unnecessary official procedures and red tape

-.-

[jackfaire]

The best cure for an HOA is not to move into one.

Problem is that doesn't work anymore. When my folks bought the house we lived in when I was in high school about 3 years in the neighborhood went HOA since they couldn't force us to agree to it as we had been there before us there was nothing they could do.

However now I live in a neighborhood that wasn't HOA but the city is now recognizing HOAs and making them a part of city governement not with any real oversight but basically legitimizing them in such a way as the whole city will be covered in them. There won't be anywhere you can live where you won't have to answer to a HOA unless you move to another city.

[Dreamstalker]

Thats the kinda thing my dad would do--dont like it being detaches? OK.

(half an hour, a two by four, and a screwgun later)

Go fuck yourself. Its attached.

That's what my dad would do too; his house is stucco, but I'm sure he could find a workaround involving a pole "attaching" it to the deck (the definition of 'attach' is to join; the pole is joining the two structures. Didn't say it had to be structural)

[Panacea]

Problem is that doesn't work anymore. When my folks bought the house we lived in when I was in high school about 3 years in the neighborhood went HOA since they couldn't force us to agree to it as we had been there before us there was nothing they could do.

However now I live in a neighborhood that wasn't HOA but the city is now recognizing HOAs and making them a part of city governement not with any real oversight but basically legitimizing them in such a way as the whole city will be covered in them. There won't be anywhere you can live where you won't have to answer to a HOA unless you move to another city.

Right, in your case the HOA had to be agreed to by your parents, because there was no CCR's (Covenants, Conditions, and Restrictions) written into the legal paperwork governing the sale of your house.

When a developer starts a new neighborhood, he often includes CCR's in the Bill of Sale. If the buyer signs it, he is basically agreeing to the CCRs and they are legally binding.

Sometimes CCR's have an expiration date: this was the case in the neighborhood where I bought my house. Initially, the neighborhood had CCRs, but they expired and the HOA made no effort to renew them so they disbanded. Sometimes they fall out of enforcibility if the HOA disbands: that happened in my parents neighborhood. They couldn't elect a board, and stopped collecting dues and basically went out of business. If the HOA doesn't enforce the CCRs, they can lose their ability to do so, which is why some HOA's are such hard asses; too many exceptions and the courts won't recognize their legal authority.

If a neighborhood wants to start an HOA and establish CCRs (which DO maintain and improve property values), then everyone has to agree in writing in order for the HOA to have any enforcement authority.

My response to that if asked will be to "get hosed." I'm not subjecting myself to that kind of nonsense.

If you buy a plot of land and build your own house, unless the land itself comes with a CCR, you are under no obligation to follow or respct the CCRs of your neighbors.

I'm not sure a city granting HOA authority and forcing property owners to abide by them would have legal force. If my city tried that on me, I'd have it in court so fast your head would spin.

[FArchivist]

That said, the HOA are being a bunch of dick buckets and could have tried to be helpful here and suggested something like making it an attached structure instead so it fullfills the letter of the law so to speak.

The covenant probably restricts that, I would imagine.

4. Any administration in which action is impeded by unnecessary official procedures and red tape

A HOA is not an "administration". A HOA is a private corporation with a CCR charter. An administration refers to public administration. What a HOA does ISN'T an official procedure and ISN'T red tape; their dictates do not have the force of law and have to be enforced via civil litigation, mainly because CCRs are contracts and not laws.

We have to be careful about what words we use because describing HOAs as "bureaucrats" and "administrations" gives them a halo of legality above and beyond what they are due, as if they were the equivalent of local and county governments. They're not. They have as much power as any corporation you have a contract with to enforce their dictates. While they can be difficult to fight against due to the automatic assumption of contractual agreement and reciprocity, we need to stop upholding the viewpoint that they are immune from prosecution and litigation, as actual bureaucrats and administrations are.

I'm not sure a city granting HOA authority and forcing property owners to abide by them would have legal force. If my city tried that on me, I'd have it in court so fast your head would spin.

It's been tried. Attempts to force HOAs on people have failed.

[Gravekeeper]

A HOA is not an "administration". A HOA is a private corporation with a CCR charter. An administration refers to public administration.

Mhmm.

ad·min·is·tra·tion   [ad-min-uh-strey-shuhn]
noun
1. the management of any office, business, or organization; direction.
2. the function of a political state in exercising its governmental duties.
3. the duty or duties of an administrator in exercising the executive functions of the position.
4. the management by an administrator of such duties.
5. a body of administrators, especially in government.

The dictionary is winning. ;p

We have to be careful about what words we use because describing HOAs as "bureaucrats" and "administrations" gives them a halo of legality above and beyond what they are due, as if they were the equivalent of local and county governments.

By....describing them with the actual words that describe them?

While they can be difficult to fight against due to the automatic assumption of contractual agreement and reciprocity, we need to stop upholding the viewpoint that they are immune from prosecution and litigation, as actual bureaucrats and administrations are.

Did anyone say they were?