Peanut Butter Sandwiches Banned from Schools

[siead_lietrathua]

How do you determine acceptable risk? Unless peanuts are banned *entirely and everywhere,* people with such a severe allergy are at risk of running into danger somewhere in their lives. So there aren't any at school. And presumably there aren't any in the home either. How about a friend's house, or a restaurant, or any number of other public places both a child and someone who eats peanuts might happen to be?

this is where things like letting people know your allergis comes to play. the schools know people with allergies are there. so they take steps. if i know a friend with allergy xyz is coming over i cook accordingly. its not difficult or inconvenient to accomadate those with allergies. or we dont go to a restaraunt with cross-contamination possiblities.

to address the smell/dust one, i have a friend with severe allergies to musterd and canola. she drove past an orchard where they grow canola and had a massive hive breakout and had to pull over to med herself before the breathing difficulties hit. so some people react worse than others.

[Peppergirl]

Honest to God, I don't know how some of us of a certain age ever survived to the age we've reached, what with all of the allergens and such.

[Aethian]

Oddly enough on another forum I belong to a girl was having this problem in her college classes. She's allergic to both seafood and peanuts, the peanut one a late allergy. Someone in her class brought in food which was allowed by the professor. The person was sitting right next to this girl and the food from a seat away started the hives. With her throat tightening she went to reach for her epi pen and was yelled at for causing a disturbance.

After class and after getting her pen she brought the issue up to the professor who did nothing. She brought it up to her counselor who did nothing. She has now had to bring a ADA specialist to the college to get them to say to please not bring certain foods to certain classes cause you could cause fatal injury to a classmate.

After that announcement the girl was then shunned. So mature for college level students...

She has managed to survive these allergies. She stays out of certain stores with open fish counters, knows which aisles to avoid, and when she starts to feel a attack she moves herself out of a situation.

So tell me is your PB&J so damned important someone has to die for it?

[SongsOfDragons]

Oh dear. The division over this is rather palpable...

I'm not a parent and it has been ages since I was in compulsory school. Though peanut butter to me is more a breakfast thing - peanut butter on toast!! Yum. I always found that pb sandwiches that have been left in a warm lunchbox for several hours turn out...a bit soggy. My favoured sandwich filling is cheeeeeese

Genuine query though: say the kids are old enough to avoid and not share etc, and the major issue is the dust. Peanut butter is a thick goo, surely with no dust to speak of? :S Bags of nuts, yes I can see that, but spread?

I am also fearing the no-milk/gluten/eggs/etc thing. Hopefully the school toffs will see sense before they realise they've banned everything edible from the canteen...XD

[fireheart17]

Genuine query though: say the kids are old enough to avoid and not share etc, and the major issue is the dust. Peanut butter is a thick goo, surely with no dust to speak of? :S Bags of nuts, yes I can see that, but spread?

Generally it's more a case of "better to be safe than sorry". I can see someone with nut allergies having a cruel trick played on them by being given peanut butter or nut-laced goods. (even at that age)


As for the one regarding various food intolerances, usually the kids are smart enough to know that whatever is in their lunchbox is safe to eat. I've seen coeliac kids being given special treats whenever class parties have been on, so they don't feel left out.

Egg is a legitimate problem, although again, usually by the time they hit high school, they're content with whatever's packed in their lunchbox.

[Iseeyouthere]

I'm in agreement with "Better safe than sorry.". Food trading, accident consumption... often leads to a fatal mistake.

And who else needs to die before people will see this?

[Mishi]

Generally it's more a case of "better to be safe than sorry". I can see someone with nut allergies having a cruel trick played on them by being given peanut butter or nut-laced goods. (even at that age).

I could see that happening, because some kids really don't care about the consequences of their actions. The other problem (even with little kids) is kissing. There was a case in the last couple of years where a teenage boy ate a peanut butter sandwich and unthinkingly kissed his girlfriend a little while later. Unfortunately, she passed away.

[Lace Neil Singer]

The main issue I can see is that alternatives to peanut butter would cost more. Maybe the school could help out with that, or the parents of the allergic child? I have to say, I find it a bit unfair when parents of allergic children glibly say, "Well, you can always give your child Very Expensive Alternative instead, you know" as a response to nonallergic parents saying their kids won't eat anything else. Why not put your money where your mouth is instead? Not everyone can afford to buy specialist foods, you know.

[SongsOfDragons]

I've had hazelnut butter before, it's really sickly. XP My local Sainsbury's does an almond butter I think, I might investigate it next time I go.

[Andara Bledin]

Honest to God, I don't know how some of us of a certain age ever survived to the age we've reached, what with all of the allergens and such.

A lot of people didn't survive, which is part of why we have these rules, now.

That, and allergies were not as common as they are now.

I have to say, I find it a bit unfair when parents of allergic children glibly say, "Well, you can always give your child Very Expensive Alternative instead, you know" as a response to nonallergic parents saying their kids won't eat anything else.

Well, you can get soynut butter at the same price point as peanut butter, and the sunbutter (sunflower seed) usually runs about $1-2 more.

Considering that the allergic kids parents are already paying for those alternatives at every single meal, I don't think it's all that much trouble for people who are blessed with children who don't have allergies to put out the extra nickel or less for 5 meals out of the typical 21 per week.

^-.-^

[siead_lietrathua]

heck who says kids have to have a friggan sandwich for lunch. really. plenty of other cultures feed their kids every day without PBJs

[Mishi]

...Vegemite!!
Seriously though, there are a lot of picky eaters out there (I have one of them) and a lot of parents that don't have or don't make the time to find easy alternatives. I'm lucky enough that I can stay at home and experiment with lunches. I'm so happy that Jazzy understands about allergies and not sharing food at school, because it means that there's no arguments about why she can't take certain foods.

[draco664]

My initial reaction was "this is stupid" but the more I think of it, the more I change my mind.

I see no reason why the children HAVE to have peanut butter during the school day. There are alternatives that are safe for everyone, and would introduce some variety into their lives.

Cost? PB is cheap. Some people may have trouble affording other foods.
Convenience? PB keeps well at room temperature, something other foods don't.
Picky Eater? Some kids go through phases where they only want to eat certain foods, and sometimes parents have enough on their plate to deal with than spend an hour trying to get a kid to eat.

The thing is, PB is freaking *legal*, and getting pissy about it and trying to ban it because it *could* kill someone is the epitome of fucked up.

I DO see a reason for it to be banned--there is a distinct possibility of a kid dieing from it. Even the most attentive kid, who washes his hands after every meal, etc, can slip up once, or have some kid with a sandwhich run into him, and have an allergy set off. And As pointed out before, some allergies are sensitive enough that peanut dust can set it off.

So why are you not jumping up and down about banning cars? Have you seen the statistics of yearly children deaths on the roads? It puts the PB allergy "problem" into perspective. You can carry an epi-pen or two to stave off an anaphylactic attack, but no pocket-device will stop a car from turning you into a pink smear.

I deal with risks, risk mitigation and risk treatment every day in my job. Idiotic comments like wanting to ban X because of a chance X could harm someone make me damned angry.

So...unless someone can come up with a reason why kids have to be able to have peanut butter during the school day, as opposed to just at home, then...I see no reason not to ban it.

How about, because I don't want someone as willfully blind as that making decisions for me that impact my life?

In terms of risk mitigation, I can understand why you'd want to ban PB from classes with identified allergy sufferers where the kids are too young to understand why Little Timmy can't touch nuts. My eldest daughter just finished kindergarten last year, and of the four classes at the kinder, two of them had identified PB allergy sufferers. One had a dairy intolerance, and there were many seafood allergy sufferers. Kids in those classes couldn't bring those foods. It didn't stop the kids in other classes doing so, however.

But having people seriously consider a blanket ban that would affect the choices of millions of people just so a handful don't have to inconvenience themselves by taking personal responsibility is, to put it bluntly, so fucked up you couldn't get it more fucked up if you buggered it with a wire brush.

[Nyoibo]

I'm just curious where it's going to stop with the food bans, eventually it's going to get to the point where they're going to have to ban food altogether because someone is allergic to it.

Perhaps we should start looking at why there are so many more allergies now?

[draco664]

Oddly enough on another forum I belong to a girl was having this problem in her college classes. She's allergic to both seafood and peanuts, the peanut one a late allergy. Someone in her class brought in food which was allowed by the professor. The person was sitting right next to this girl and the food from a seat away started the hives. With her throat tightening she went to reach for her epi pen and was yelled at for causing a disturbance.

I find that account difficult to accept. Yelled at for getting something from her pocket? Or yelled at for suddenly making hoarse breathing noises and gasping.

In either event, a simple, "I'm having an allergic reaction to that person's food. Sorry." Get up. Move. Use epi-pen. Problem solved.

After class and after getting her pen she brought the issue up to the professor who did nothing. She brought it up to her counselor who did nothing. She has now had to bring a ADA specialist to the college to get them to say to please not bring certain foods to certain classes cause you could cause fatal injury to a classmate.

After that announcement the girl was then shunned. So mature for college level students...

She expected others to modify their behaviour simply to accomodate her. I'd have shunned her too.

Personally, I can't stand the smell of cigarette smoke. I literally gag and vomit. But when I'm outside and someone is smoking nearby, I bloody move so I'm upwind. I don't expect them to change their behaviour to suit *me*.

She has managed to survive these allergies. She stays out of certain stores with open fish counters, knows which aisles to avoid, and when she starts to feel a attack she moves herself out of a situation.

So tell me is your PB&J so damned important someone has to die for it?

So tell me is your lack of personal responsibility so damned important that everyone else has to give up their rights to accomotate it?

Anyone with a PB allergy stupid enough to eat a PB&J sandwitch deserves a Darwin Award.