Genetic Sexual Attraction

[Greenday]

What's with knocking on Christians? You guys do realize gang-rape and incest aren't parts of their religion? It has nothing to do with being a Christian...

[IDrinkaRum]

How about the Royal Families of Europe, back in the Middle Ages and so forth? Phillip II of Spain took as his 4th wife, his own niece! After a few generations of interbreeding, the royal families should have seen the results of their marrying in the family. However, because Spain & Portugal were isolated for such a long time, I do understand the interbreeding. But after Don Carlos II of Spain? Yeah, fortunately, the Hapsburg line started to fan out/die out, so some of that problem went away ... eventually.

[anriana]

What's with knocking on Christians? You guys do realize gang-rape and incest aren't parts of their religion? It has nothing to do with being a Christian...

It is "knocking on Christians" to point out stories from their Scripture?

[Greenday]

It is "knocking on Christians" to point out stories from their Scripture?

I really didn't see how it had a point for the thread. I mean, what does the scripture really have to do with being a Christian? Christians don't live their lives by how everyone in the bible acted. In fact, the bible is meant to learn lessons from. The way it was said, it just seemed like it was an attack on Christianity, saying that because it is in their scripture, that's what Christians do.

[Plaidman]

Lot offered his daughters to save the angels from rape. After all, homosexuality is a /far/ worst crime then rape. ( End Sarcasim)

Anyway. meh. Whatever. I will never get mad or be disgusted by people who fall in love. Love is the greatest treasure in the world, and you get spiteful and disgusted by it? So what if its /wrong/ in ones eyes. It really is the same as Homosexuality. People get disgusted by that. Beastitly is connected. Pedophile is the same. The difference between the three, is that mutual incest is, well, mutual. Both adults ether know or don't, and accept it. Beast and Child, however, only one would have the mentality to agree.

Some of you, are starting to sound like the hate crimes of past, where its ether against god, or /morally/ wrong. They are in love. Do you all really want that to be crushed and destroyed?

Then there are those times, where two kids are given up for adoption. Thirty years later, they meet, and fall in love. Nether of them know. They get married. They have kids. When they are 80 years old or whatever, they finally found the truth. Now they have great grand kids, and their daughter is the one who brought mankind to Pluto. (It was hot. We needed ice....).
Are you going to shun them, and spit on their grave?

~Plaidman. Awaiting flames and counterants, and most likely, ignornation.

[anriana]

I mean, what does the scripture really have to do with being a Christian?

Seriously?

[the_std]

~Plaidman. Awaiting flames and counterants, and most likely, ignornation.

I think that anyone who finds their very attraction gross is a little closed-minded. But if the couple decides to have kids, then the gloves are off. Their child has a much higher chance of being genetically disadvantaged, and the poor kid doesn't have a say in it.

You mentioned adoption. If they're really that in love that they want kids, why not adopt? I know, I know, it's harder than people say it is, but it would still be kinder to a child than conceiving one who has a high risk of being disabled.

Or a surrogate parent. There are options.

As for the Pluto people... Well, they didn't know until it was far too late. Can't fault them for that. However, if their daughter purposefully has kids with their son, then yes... It comes back to the "kid not having a choice" thing.

[AFPheonix]

Lot offered his daughters to save the angels from rape. After all, homosexuality is a /far/ worst crime then rape. ( End Sarcasim)

Anyway. meh. Whatever. I will never get mad or be disgusted by people who fall in love. Love is the greatest treasure in the world, and you get spiteful and disgusted by it? So what if its /wrong/ in ones eyes. It really is the same as Homosexuality. People get disgusted by that. Beastitly is connected. Pedophile is the same. The difference between the three, is that mutual incest is, well, mutual. Both adults ether know or don't, and accept it. Beast and Child, however, only one would have the mentality to agree.

Some of you, are starting to sound like the hate crimes of past, where its ether against god, or /morally/ wrong. They are in love. Do you all really want that to be crushed and destroyed?

Then there are those times, where two kids are given up for adoption. Thirty years later, they meet, and fall in love. Nether of them know. They get married. They have kids. When they are 80 years old or whatever, they finally found the truth. Now they have great grand kids, and their daughter is the one who brought mankind to Pluto. (It was hot. We needed ice....).
Are you going to shun them, and spit on their grave?

~Plaidman. Awaiting flames and counterants, and most likely, ignornation.

Actually this is a very insightful post.
And to be honest, the risk for potentially increasing the chance of recessive genetic diseases doesn't really increase a huge amount, at least at the first set of inbreeding couples, since social mores for preventing that have kept us more or less pretty heterogeneous.
Of course with successive line breeding you increase the risk geometrically....

My only concern with incest, at least in the case of parent and child, is that one of the participants is coming from a position of control and possible coercion. I don't think true consent can happen in those cases.

[BlaqueKatt]

I really didn't see how it had a point for the thread.

<reviews thread>
Wow silly me we weren't talking about incest then?

Incest laws in this country have largely religious origins. In England, incest was punishable only in ecclesiastical courts, which ostensibly applied the law of Leviticus prohibiting persons more closely related than fourth cousins to marry.(from this article)

But if the couple decides to have kids, then the gloves are off. Their child has a much higher chance of being genetically disadvantaged, and the poor kid doesn't have a say in it.

Wow I guess I should be punished then, you see I have Autism, any child I have has a 25% chance of having autism. I do have a child, he didn't have a say in being born. A report from the Journal of Genetic Counseling indicates that cousin couples have just 2 percent more of a chance of have children with birth defect as compared to unrelated couples.

forgot to add with direct brother-sister the 2% chance doubles to a whopping 4%

Saying someone shouldn't have a child that may have issues as far as genetic disorders. I guess I should have asked you before having my son. Anyone with mental ilnesses better not have kids-some of them(schizophrenia is one-which often doesn't even show up until mid to late 20'S), give the child up to a 50% chance of inheriting the disorder. What you're proposing is eugenics. I would gladly take only a 2% higher chance rather than a 1 in 4 chance that I have now. I'm sure my friend with a schizophrenic father would rather have a 2% chance rather than the 50-50 she has now.




and we do have genetic testing now that can determine what may be transmitted.




oh and Plaidman-you win one internet.

[the_std]

What you're proposing is eugenics.

Actually, I'm not proposing anything. I suggested that incestual couples try different methods of having kids, but I'm certainly not saying, "Outlaw incest!" or anything along those lines. I was merely explaining why I find it somewhat reprehensible, and why others might too.

Y'know, I'd thought about the other disabilities that can be passed on genetically, but declined to comment because almost every person in this dear wide world has one. Again, I never said that these people could not have kids, merely that they might consider not having kids for the sake of the kids.

Oh, and I never actually thought of cousin + cousin as incest. In fact, I have two cousins who married before they knew they were cousins. They have two charming little girls who don't have anything wrong with them, as far as I can see. I was thinking more along the lines of dad + daughter or mom + son.

[Greenday]

I just don't see why Christians need to re-evaluate their beliefs because there's a story in the Bible involving incest. I don't know, maybe because to my church, we use the Bible as stories to teach us lessons, not to do exactly as everyone did. It just seems like you guys are saying that Christians have to be incestuous because it's in the Bible that some person did it.

[AFPheonix]

If you can find me a quote where someone said that Christians need to reevaluate their faith because of an OT story in this thread, then go for it. All people are saying is that incest has happened throughout history, including biblical times.

At most they are criticizing some Christians who never actually read their bibles and thus have an overly rosy view of the document.

[BlaqueKatt]

All people are saying is that incest has happened throughout history, including biblical times.

Pretty much-that and I find it interesting that incest laws are religiously based(see previous post), and that the separation of church and state is not being applied.

[Greenday]

And any Christians in here may want to re-read the story of Lot, who had sex with both of his daughters(and had children with both of them) after leaving Sodom-and that was considered perfectly ok....

The story doesn't suggest at all though that Christians should do that. It doesn't even hint towards incest being right. So why is it being pointed out as making Christians being hypocrites?

I wouldn't call these laws religiously based. There are a ton of people who are against it for non-religious reasons.

[BlaqueKatt]

I wouldn't call these laws religiously based. There are a ton of people who are against it for non-religious reasons.

read the law article I linked to-they are religiously based-ecclesiastical courts, which ostensibly applied the law of Leviticus---oddly that sounds like religion to me.