Life Sentences for Minors

[Canarr]

But the insidious sensationalist alarmist press is another rant altogether.

Well, the press only supplies what their audience demands. If people didn't gobble up that shit, nobody would print or film it. But that's another rant altogether.

Under German law, children cannot be tried *at all* before the age of 14; the law simply can't touch them. They may be moved from their family into foster care, but they cannot be held criminally liable for their deeds. I find that a sensible idea; whether or not 14 is still the right limit in this day and age is a matter for debate, but the basic premise, IMO, is sound: below a cerain age, I do not believe it should be up to any human's discretion whether or not a child should be hit with the full force of the law - and some cases I've read from the US reinforce my belief.

Now, I do agree with GK: there's troubled, and then there's full-on psychotic, and the latter should have the book thrown at them no matter their age. There have been cases of juvenile delinquents with literally dozens of arrests and releases up until age 13, who then got hit with the maximum possible sentence on their very first offense after their 14th birthday, and I think that is justified - just because they couldn't be charged with their former crimes, doesn't mean they should be forgotten.

But although children should be given a certain leniency, there's gotta be a line somewhere. Once that is crossed, punishment must follow.

[Skelly]

There's something wrong with a justice system that declares two 13 year-old children as irredeemable for life.

It's a sign of a society that treats troubled teenagers like yesterday's garbage. The second that children stop being cute, they get tossed into the trash.

Many of them are. I wish we would lock up the fuckers here as well. We have too many little shits who rob, rape, steal, kill, assault etc. I would prefer if they were euthanized, but I'll settle for life in prison, without any luxuries.

[Skelly]

Under German law, children cannot be tried *at all* before the age of 14; the law simply can't touch them.

It's 15 up here in Sweden. People have called for lowering it to 12. Some people should be locked up from the age of 11 to the day they die.

[blas87]

People are ignorant if they think that kids and teens can't be the same sociopaths/pyschopaths and dare I even say serial killers that grown men and women have turned out to be.

You can claim Law and Order SVU gets a little too over the top with kids slaughtering their siblings or other family members or classmates, but there are sick kids out there, just as there are sick adults.

If you can't do the time, don't do the crime. Regardless of age. Middle school girl kills a classmate who "stole" her boyfriend, she can get the same sentence as a girl ten years older than her would if she'd done the same thing.

[draco664]

Many of them are. I wish we would lock up the fuckers here as well. We have too many little shits who rob, rape, steal, kill, assault etc. I would prefer if they were euthanized, but I'll settle for life in prison, without any luxuries.

It's 15 up here in Sweden. People have called for lowering it to 12. Some people should be locked up from the age of 11 to the day they die.

I reckon I could get behind the idea that people who advocate the execution of children should be locked up for life.

[Skelly]

I reckon I could get behind the idea that people who advocate the execution of children should be locked up for life.

About 14 years ago, 4 people over here, two minors, two adults, set fire to a building. 63 kids died in the flames, another 200 got injured. I'd gladly feed the guilty through a woodchipper, feet first.

[tropicsgoddess]

If it wasn't a heinous crime I'd be more incline to say that life sentences for minors is harsh. In this case, I think the punishment fits the crime. They murdered somebody in cold blood and still show no remorse for their crime,life with out parole is the only way for them. Being a minor shouldn't excuse them from facing the consequences of their actions, regardless of the crime.

[Gravekeeper]

I feel like there's something wrong with a society where one can have all the responsibilities and consequences of adulthood at 13, and yet none of the privileges.

What society would that be? Seeing as the prosecution has to push to get a minor tried as an adult to begin with. -.-

No one's saying every minor be tried as an adult. Only that in the case of particularly heinous crimes they should not be shielded from the law by virtue of being a minor. If they're old enough to act like a psychopathic killer, then they get tried as one.

[jackfaire]

There's something wrong with a justice system that declares two 30 year-old adults as irredeemable for life.

Technically every human being is capable of change regardless of what badly written romantic comedies state.

If we are going to start saying that after a certain time individuals should be reexamined to determine if they really are still a danger to society and others it should be applied to everyone not just limited to those whom we choose to say, "Well they are just kids"

I don't think the fact those people were kids when they committed horrendous crimes has anything to do with why they wouldn't commit the crime now. Some people genuinely regret the actions they have taken.

I think the 3 strikes rule is good but grossly misused. I think there could be better applications of it. I think that there are places where the justice system could be improved.

But I don't think being a legal kid should grant special treatment under the law.

[Gravekeeper]

Technically every human being is capable of change regardless of what badly written romantic comedies state.

A psychopath is not capable of change. Its not a matter of remorse or regret. Like it or not, some people are simply built wrong. Sad as it is. Jail time will not change that. Nor will anything else.

[jackfaire]

A psychopath is not capable of change.

A psychopath will still grow and change but in ways that don't make sense to us.

Also remorse and regret aren't always what is driving the change.

20 year old kid kills a guy in a gang war because it was a gang war it's not considered self defense even though that's exactly what it was.

20 years later he is not the same angry little kid but he has never regretted the killing itself because it was a him or the other guy situation.

[Gravekeeper]

A psychopath will still grow and change but in ways that don't make sense to us.

Also remorse and regret aren't always what is driving the change.

20 year old kid kills a guy in a gang war because it was a gang war it's not considered self defense even though that's exactly what it was.

20 years later he is not the same angry little kid but he has never regretted the killing itself because it was a him or the other guy situation.

Thats not a psychopath though. A psychopath does not have regret or remorse because they do not understand in the first place why what they did was wrong nor see any reason why they should not do it again. A psychopath does not feel empathy or remorse to begin with. They are not someone you can fix or redeem in any way shape or form. They will hurt people because they don't understand why they shouldn't hurt people and don't understand why you don't understand that they deserve to have the priviledge of hurting people.

[Seifer]

20 year old kid kills a guy in a gang war because it was a gang war it's not considered self defense even though that's exactly what it was.

20 years later he is not the same angry little kid but he has never regretted the killing itself because it was a him or the other guy situation.

That's not a very good example, unfortunately. Gangs are notorious for holding on to their members will all their might, so a gang wouldn't let a member go just because he went to prison. Gangs are active in prison, too, so the hypothetical 20 year old would still be living among other gang members. Once he got out of prison, he'd probably still be hounded by the gang. If he wanted to get out of said gang, he'd be putting his own life in danger to do so.

So, he might not be the same angry kid he was at 20, but he'll still be dealing with "gang life" and the pressures placed upon him by those in his gang.

[jackfaire]

So, he might not be the same angry kid he was at 20, but he'll still be dealing with "gang life" and the pressures placed upon him by those in his gang.

1) it depends on the gang

2) he is under no obligation to tell the gang he is getting out

[Lace Neil Singer]

Thats not a psychopath though. A psychopath does not have regret or remorse because they do not understand in the first place why what they did was wrong nor see any reason why they should not do it again. A psychopath does not feel empathy or remorse to begin with. They are not someone you can fix or redeem in any way shape or form. They will hurt people because they don't understand why they shouldn't hurt people and don't understand why you don't understand that they deserve to have the priviledge of hurting people.

This.

If anyone is having trouble in realising what defines a psychopath or sociopath, the following links might be useful.

Profile of the Sociopath

Difference between a psychopath and a sociopath

Interestingly, I was once diagnosed with antisocial personality disorder; wrongly, as it turns out. Not every murderer labled as a sociopath or psychopath is one; perhaps a mental health check every so often would be in order to determine whether they are or not.

Gravekeeper is right when he says that these people can't be "made better"; they are broken people, who have something missing from their minds which means that they commit acts that "normal" people wouldn't think of doing. The only way to protect the public from them is to lock them away forever.