Fatties and their Haters

[Snowbird]

Society is getting larger, supersized by the day. Obesity is a problem and it's more than physical for most people. With their self esteem and confidence wrapped up in the blanket of extra weight, it is a very touchy subject for most overweight people. Why is it then that it is socially acceptable to blast obese people for something that they obviously are having a hard time controlling? I repeatedly read and hear people talking about how disgusting it is, how it makes them sick to see it, how utterly repugnant these other people are and it makes me wonder why this is alright.

It's hard enough to carry the extra physical weight but when jeering and sneering judgment is openly applauded, it doesn't surprise me in the least that some of these people are too ashamed to go out in public, let alone to work out in that venue. I just wish that people would leave the harsh comments for those that deserve them, rather than those that are just trying to live and get through each day.

I should probably also say that I'm not advocating obesity. I'm just trying to help people see that shredding others for their physical appearance isn't so hot.

[Greenday]

There is no right way to go about obesity. Either we make fun of them, which is bad for their feelings. We can't go on about how it's unhealthy, because then we are still being rude or some absurd crap. And we can't ignore it, because it is a huge problem. So what do we go with, since all are so ineffective?

[Amethyst Hunter]

My dad is guilty of this. Once in a while if we're out in public for whatever reason, and he happens to see someone who's *cough* a bit on the large side, he feels some weird compulsion to point it out to the rest of us (despite me having told him before that I don't care): "Woah, she's a BIG one!" "A little hefty there, eh?" (And I'm sure some of us probably *think* things like this, but at least we have the good grace not to SAY it...)

This coming from a man who has been told REPEATEDLY by his doctor he needs to start shedding a few pounds of his own because his habits led him to developing Type II diabetes. I can always tell when he's had a bad doctor report because he comes home and starts picking on ME for my habits! (Which, as you might imagine, pisses me off to no end)

Another thing (that's semi-related) that pisses me off: Why is it my family feels the need to single me out for crap like this, yet they give my brother a free pass on it? I have NEVER heard either of my parents give him shit about being overweight, and there was a phase in his early teens where he WAS on the chunky side (it burned off once he hit older teens). Today, he's not overweight, but he is developing a bit of a 'beer belly'.

By contrast, I've been getting little nitpicky comments about my weight (which, admittedly, isn't the greatest) ever since I hit my teens. Sheesh, no wonder we have so damn many girls in this world growing up with shit like bulimia and anorexia! Here's a hint, folks: riling me about something I'm eating and giving me the 'ol "it'll go straight to your hips!" lecture not only makes me totally ignore you that much more, it REALLY makes me want to punch you in the face. Someday my instincts will override my politeness...!

[Greenday]

My mom was just poking me before in certain areas I'm slowing starting to gain weight in. I was getting pretty pissed off. I told her to stop and she wouldn't. Made me want to say, "You know, you don't see me ripping on you for weighing more than I do, except I'm 5'11" and you are only 5'4"!" She'd flip out if I did that. But it's cool for her to dish it out.

[Sylvia727]

I am a big woman, though certainly not the worst of the lot. One day, I went to a grocery store and picked up a bag of candy. The cashier, a pleasant looking older lady, was laughing and joking with the customers in front of me. When I got up to her register, I was therefore in a good mood and cracked a joke on the same subject. She half-nodded and dropped eye contact. I then complimented her on her brooch, which was very pretty. She half-nodded again and told me my total. She didn't smile once during the entire transaction, when she'd been laughing just a moment before. As I left, I told her to have a good day, to which she didn't respond.

Later, I repeated this story to my sister, who if anything is on the skinny side. As I wrapped it up, I said, "And the worst part is, I don't know if she was being rude because I'm an overweight woman buying candy, or if I'm just being oversensitive." This shocked my sister. Apparently, she had never realized that my weight might be a factor in my interactions with other people, or that I evaluate people's responses to see if they dislike me for my size. It doesn't come up particularly often, maybe once or twice a week, but I always wonder how much prejudice against me is invisible. I can't tell if the waitress is being short because she's had a bad day or because she doesn't approve of my size.

Amethyst, if I ever overheard your dad make those comments about me, I would give him the double-barreled salute. I intensely dislike people who feel they can make judgements about my health and my appearence.

Another question: why is it unacceptable for fat people to eat the same food as everyone else? If twenty people are eating in a McDonald's, folks act like only the fat guy shouldn't be there. Maybe he only has a twenty minute lunch break, or maybe he forgot his wallet and needs something cheap. Maybe he likes their food, Heavin forbid. Why pick on just him?

[Rapscallion]

I'm fairly overweight. I have the advantage of not looking as fat as I actually am, but until a few weeks back I was about 280 pounds, or just under 20 stones for us who use real money. I'm physically active, and I have both a reasonably large frame and more than average musculature. However, I still carry at least five stone (70 pounds) of excess weight - I'll find out how much when I finish this current diet.

I've never looked for people who are biased against me because of my weight. Truth to tell, there are so many people of my size or more - many of whom obviously get no real exercise (half my working week is in the warehouse on average) and therefore look it - that I can't see that someone's going to be biased against that many people. Well, if they are then it's going to be a very small number doing it.

Granted, as I said, I don't look hugely overweight.

Acceptability of eating certain foods? Never had that happen to me. Mind you, most owners of fast food businesses know that their customers tend to be on the large side, so there's no point in chasing away your regular customers, and many patrons are also on the large side. If someone overweight is in a fast food place and a skinny person eating there is critical, why is the skinny person in there?

Common sense dictates that too much weight is bad for a person, but common sense also says that pretty much everyone knows this, and anyone who eats something greasy when overweight is doing so of their own free will and accepts the consequences. A lower life expectancy is implicitly accepted. Of course, when it comes to someone who is unable to leave the house due to really excessive eating (very rare), and I once read a piece by an EMT who had to help five colleagues carry someone out of an apartment once (they strained badly), then it's affecting other people.

From the other side of the coin, I see propoganda from the other side declaring that fat people are beautiful as well. Let's put it this way, as far as I'm concerned this viewpoint is wrong. There are a few people who love the larger person, but they are rare. I'm a gutbucket, and I know that if I went searching for romance I would have to lose a fair amount of weight to have a better chance of being considered. Looks aren't everything, but they bloody well help at first.

Rapscallion

[AFPheonix]

It's probably due to the fact that out of all the things people get picked on for, weight is one of the things that is controllable. Not to say that picking on people is wrong, it's because people tend to perceive obese people as being lesser beings for having less self control and being more selfish. Also some people resent the obese for choosing to become disabled by getting so large it affects their health.
It's interesting that obese people get so picked on considering how large of a percentage of the population is overweight themselves.
The other interesting thing is some of the backlash from some of the super obese by attempting to tell themselves that they are healthy and normal and are "real women" (as opposed to those fake skinny women, I suppose). They conflate the risk of anorexia and eschew doctors who tell them that they're killing themselves if they don't lose weight. People who were obese and are taking steps to lose weight are shunned for denying their true selves. There are blogs dedicated to this line of thinking.

Now, it's easy for people to say that fat people should be better able to control their weight, but apparently it's going to take more than an individual effort to change the epidemic we have going now. It's going to have to take a concerted effort to change attitudes about how much we eat and when and what.
New York is taking a pretty cool step right now by requiring eateries to list the caloric contents of their meals. Apparently a lot of people are finding that what they thought was pretty healthy really isn't. I'd love to see that go into effect here.

[Amethyst Hunter]

Amethyst, if I ever overheard your dad make those comments about me, I would give him the double-barreled salute.

I wouldn't feel much sympathy for him, because he'd totally have it coming. I've given him looks/said stuff to him before along the lines of "...and this trivia is important to me WHY?" I don't think he has any genuine hatred towards overweight folks (though feel free to debate that amongst yourselves) like some people seem to, but he doesn't get that this kind of behavior makes him look like a jerk.

(My dad isn't a BAD person, but he does have some bad *habits*, if that makes any sense. Unfortunately this is the way he was raised and the type of social environment he grew up in, so I don't look for him to change much - if any - of his ways anytime soon. )

[IDrinkaRum]

I've always hated the argument that fat people can control their weigh through diet and exercise alone. That's not true.

There are some prescription medications that people need to keep them alive that cause added weight. Some people can't exercise because of health problems. These might sound like excuses, but they're not.

Plus, for the overly obese? At the gyms, they buy equipment that has a weight limit of like 250 pounds. I'm over that & my husband are over that. Why waste so much money on a gym membership when we can't use the equipment anyway?

[BlaqueKatt]

It's interesting that obese people get so picked on considering how large of a percentage of the population is overweight themselves.

By the altered and "one-size-fits-all" BMI index. All these stories about the "epidemic" of obesity are fueled by two digit number that a mathematician developed in 1830*, that's right not a doctor, or scientist, or even a nutritionist, a damn mathematician. Let me say this again to make sure it it remembered BMI Developed by a MATHEMATICIAN in the 1830s(who observed that, among his samples of early C19th Belgians, weight tends to increase in proportion to the square of the height, once they were fully grown)-Because I know I go see my accountant to tell me if I'm healthy.

Rememeber the diet industry and big pharma are out to make money, if they can get more people to buy their products they will. But if weight is only an issue for say less than half the population, let's just change the definition, or move the stick to where we define disease. Just to show how absurd using the BMI is Arnold Schwartzenegger, Lance Armstrong, and Tom Cruise are highly obese by the BMI.

One other reason I know the BMI is crap-I'm 5'5" and a size 6 with less than 10% body fat however; going by the BMI I'm overweight I have a BMI of 25. Before I had my son and my bone structure in my hips changed(went from 34" to 36") I was the same weight and a size 3-so the BMI still said I was over weight AT A SIZE 3!!!! My ex-husband who was in the army(and had a 32" waist-yes he had the 6-pack abs) was classified as "obese" by the BMI. Do a 5'5" size 3 female and a 5'9" soldier with a 32" waist conjure the images of overweight and obese respectively? It's misleading at best and downright deceptive at worst.

The body mass index (BMI), is a statistical measure of the weight of a person scaled according to height. As such, it is useful as a population measure only, and is not appropriate for diagnosing individuals. However, BMI has become controversial because many people, including physicians, have come to rely on its apparent numerical authority for medical diagnosis, but that was never the BMI's purpose. The newest survey in 2007 indicates an continuation of the increase in BMI, 63% of americans are overweight, with 26% now in the obese category.(lies, damn lies, and statistics anyone?)

Or maybe 63% of Americans are like me "overweight" due to increased muscle mass, or bone density**(which is not taken into account by a 150+ year-old Belgian Mathematical formula), and 26% are professional bodybuilders, athletes, and soldiers. But that wouldn't get people to panic, and buy diet pills, and diet foods would it?


Forgot to add *link to BMI info

**and how many Belgians in 1830 were malnourished or had poor bone density?

[Lace Neil Singer]

There aren't that many obese people who are in that state for medical reasons; most are there cuz they ate all the pies. It's not being rude to point that out; and yes, if they did stop eating enough to feed a family of four and started exercising more (even if you have back or bone problems, there are exercises you can do; swimming, for example, or yoga) they'd lose weight. There is no point in pretending that you can see the Emperor's clothes on this issue.

Having said that, the legendary BMI states that I'm overweight. I'm a size 16-18, depending on the shop, and have an hourglass figure; big hips and big boobs. I go by how my clothes fit, not on weight or BMI cuz it's all so inaccurate. Seeing as I've had a lot of male attention, I really don't see that my weight is an issue; a lot of my male friends have said that they hate skinny girls cuz they have no boobs. There are still people who like skinny girls tho; it's all a matter of preference.

[AFPheonix]

I've always hated the argument that fat people can control their weigh through diet and exercise alone. That's not true.

You can, the first law of thermodynamics says so. The biggest thing is that we all overconsume calories, especially in the things we drink. Eating too many simple carbs, overly large portions, and not enough complex, harder to digest carbs are our biggest problem. Look at your daily food intake first if you're serious about dropping weight.

By the altered and "one-size-fits-all" BMI index. All these stories about the "epidemic" of obesity are fueled by two digit number that a mathematician developed in 1830*, that's right not a doctor, or scientist, or even a nutritionist, a damn mathematician. Let me say this again to make sure it it remembered BMI Developed by a MATHEMATICIAN in the 1830s(who observed that, among his samples of early C19th Belgians, weight tends to increase in proportion to the square of the height, once they were fully grown)-Because I know I go see my accountant to tell me if I'm healthy.

Uhh....if big pharma wanted to continue to make more money, they'd have a lot more interest in keeping the populace fat than thin. Weight loss drugs are not the worlds biggest sellers. Statins like Lipitor and Crestor are.
Not to mention drugs that fly off our shelves like diabetes meds, blood pressure meds, and incidentals like stomach medication, hormones to counteract glandular conditions aggravated by extra weight, COX-2 inhibitors, inhaled steroids, durable medical goods like industrial strength beds, C-PAP machines, etc etc etc. Hell, just blood glucose testers and their accessories are a huge seller and the strips are expensive.
At the other end of the spectrum, we rarely sell hardly any appetite suppressors or other meds like Alli or Xenical in comparison.

As for the mathematician argument, so what? He's trained to recognize trends. Size of the people in the populace is a trend, and I'll bet he used journals published by medical professionals to put the mark at the populace's ideal weight.
BMI is flawed because it does not apply to all individuals well (it's a population trend, after all) and every person who wants to make themselves feel better about their weight will always point at that and say, "SEE? I'M NOT THAT FAT AND IT SAYS I'M A LARDO!" Right. Sorry, most people who make that argument are not professional weight lifters. Typically they're getting cheeto dust down into their keyboards as they're angrily banging out their manifesto against a society telling them to get thinner.
There will be people who are above or below the BMI trend line for their weight and height. Yay for statistics. That doesn't mean to say that we can't get valuable information from it, however. We can get the general gist that society as a whole is getting fatter.
Why? Partially because in our country, people have been encouraged to be lazy by our car culture. Also, the sheer amount of advertising thrown at us daily by food vendors is staggering. People are also getting fatter earlier in life. Time had a great series of articles on childhood obesity in the June 23rd issue.
Furthermore, clothes companies continue to stroke our egos through vanity sizing. Women love to say that Marilyn Monroe was a plus sized girl. In reality, she would wear a today's size 0.

We ARE getting fatter as a populace, and it does affect more than just the fat people. People are dying earlier than they should from comorbities associated with obesity, people are having to pay more for insurance because obese people are having to make more claims to treat their size-related health problems. It is an issue that we all have to tackle.

[BlaqueKatt]

Women love to say that Marilyn Monroe was a plus sized girl. In reality, she would wear a today's size 0.

actually she couldn't wear anything off the shelf:
Height: 5 feet 5 1/2 inches
Weight: Varied, 115 - 120 lbs.
Measurements: 37-23-36 (Studio's Claim); 35-22-35 (Dressmaker's Claim)
From official website


She would be closest to a size 4 or six depending on manufacturer(you have to go by hips not waist-you can take in the waist but not let out the hips that much)-and her BMI would be 19.7

[AFPheonix]

OK, I stand corrected on the Marilyn thing. You hear different stats on her all over the place. However, the underlying point still remains. People who justify being fat because they think they're the same size as her (and I'm saying people who are larger than even the average, size 14 or more in today's sizing) are deluding themselves.

[Boozy]

There's another thread kicking around here where we discussed so-called medical reason for obesity. The fact remains that so few people fall into that category as to be statistically insignificant. Even the worst offenders among prescription drugs for weight gain as a side effect only cause an additional 10% increase in body fat.

The fact remains that if you're obese, there is a 99.9% chance that it's because you eat too much.

But that doesn't mean that the obese aren't deserving of sympathy. No one wants to be fat. As AFPheonix said, the US is a society of cars, convenience, and fast food. Obesity isn't caused by a physical illness so much as a mental one; and it has infected the entire culture. An individual can manage their weight through personal responsibility, but until we address the bigger issues, it will remain an epidemic.

I have never been overweight, but I smoked for years before finally quitting. I know what it's like to be fighting an addiction, to know that you are destroying your body and your health, and still feeling powerless to stop yourself. Telling overweight people to put down the bag of chips won't help them, any more than telling me to put out the smoke would have helped me.

With that said, I don't like people making excuses. My husband, who still smokes, has all sorts of bullshit reasons for continuing. I used to do the same thing. I didn't quit until I acknowledged that there is NO reason to continue, and I had complete control over the decisions I made - not my family, my friends, or Big Tobacco. There is no secret to quitting; I just had to do it. Similarly, overweight people need to realize that they have the power to lose weight, as long as they quit making excuses.