Racist Scholarship

[KnitShoni]

I'm sure you didn't notice that pretty much all of those scholarships are for groups that have been (and still are) mistreated? Jewish, Polish, Irish - all of those groups have faced heavy discrimination (and still do) from several other groups.

All those groups have stepped on non-white people at some point to gain the level of privilege they have. They are still considered white. Please tell my why non-white people are supposed to feel bad about certain groups of white people being treated badly by other groups of white people, when all groups of white people have advantages over non-white people?

And why, oh, why, are these scholarships ok because these groups have been mistreated, but black, hispanic, Asian, Native American scholarships are, apparently, such a problem? Because, I'm sure you noticed, people aren't bitching about the list I posted.

[KnitShoni]

European descent =/= white

Almost all of Latin America can claim European Descent.

A large population of the Philippines can claim "European Descent." Hell, that can probably be said for almost all of south east Asia.

What's the old saying? The sun never sets on the British Empire? Add in the Spaniards and the Portuguese and there's a hell of a lot of "European Descent" around the world.

The entire world can claim African descent. What's your point? The fact that they can claim European descent has nothing to do with the treatment they receive if they are not visibly white.

[Seifer]

All those groups have stepped on non-white people at some point to gain the level of privilege they have. They are still considered white. Please tell my why non-white people are supposed to feel bad about certain groups of white people being treated badly by other groups of white people, when all groups of white people have advantages over non-white people?

Really? You're gonna go that route? Every white person in the history of the planet has stepped on a minority?

That can be said about EVERYONE. Every. Single. Race. Has. Stepped. On. A. Minority. That's how land was overtaken and stolen in early human history. The village/kingdom/civilization with the most people would kill/destroy the smaller ones around it and grow larger.

If you're going to hold past transgressions against everyone, then you should hate/dislike/mistrust literally everyone on Earth. You should even dislike Africans, since they participated heavily in the slave trade (and still do. Seriously, they're still catching and selling their fellow Africans into slavery. Google it.).

And why, oh, why, are these scholarships ok because these groups have been mistreated, but black, hispanic, Asian, Native American scholarships are, apparently, such a problem? Because, I'm sure you noticed, people aren't bitching about the list I posted.

Okay, let me make this clear: I never said minority-only scholarships were bad. Ever. Not once. I merely wondered why a scholarship for WHM from low-income households wasn't appropriate.

[crashhelmet]

And why, oh, why, are these scholarships ok because these groups have been mistreated, but black, hispanic, Asian, Native American scholarships are, apparently, such a problem? Because, I'm sure you noticed, people aren't bitching about the list I posted.

Because the last time I was in Ireland, I saw quite a few black people that were natives. Scotland too. I've never been to Poland, so I don't know, but I'm pretty sure there are some there as well. Hell, I met a black man in Moscow.

There are also black jews in the world.

I highly doubt any of these scholarships in that list you provided specify "Caucasian" or "white skin" only

[KnitShoni]

Because the last time I was in Ireland, I saw quite a few black people that were natives. Scotland too. I've never been to Poland, so I don't know, but I'm pretty sure there are some there as well. Hell, I met a black man in Moscow.

There are also black jews in the world.

I highly doubt any of these scholarships in that list you provided specify "Caucasian" or "white skin" only

The majority of scholarships awarded in the US never specified white skin only. That does what, exactly, to change the fact that people who were not white were passed over, regardless of the fact that they met all the requirements?

Ok...you met a black man in Moscow. Does that mean you have knowledge of how he's treated in Moscow? Or the black people in Ireland, Scotland, or Poland, for that matter?

[KnitShoni]

Really? You're gonna go that route? Every white person in the history of the planet has stepped on a minority?

That can be said about EVERYONE. Every. Single. Race. Has. Stepped. On. A. Minority. That's how land was overtaken and stolen in early human history. The village/kingdom/civilization with the most people would kill/destroy the smaller ones around it and grow larger.

If you're going to hold past transgressions against everyone, then you should hate/dislike/mistrust literally everyone on Earth. You should even dislike Africans, since they participated heavily in the slave trade (and still do. Seriously, they're still catching and selling their fellow Africans into slavery. Google it.).



Okay, let me make this clear: I never said minority-only scholarships were bad. Ever. Not once. I merely wondered why a scholarship for WHM from low-income households wasn't appropriate.

I never said white-only scholarships were bad. I just question why they're necessary. I know why minority scholarships are necessary. It, to me, is the same as people asking why black history month exists, when white history month is every month.

I'm not holding past transgressions against anyone. My issues with racism are present-day. In the present, Irish people and Polish people and white Jewish people have advantages over non-white people, regardless of how other white people treat them.

If I were holding past transgressions against everyone: why are you allowed to do so, but I'm not?

Please stop telling me who I dislike. You don't know who I dislike, or why.

[crashhelmet]

The majority of scholarships awarded in the US never specified white skin only. That does what, exactly, to change the fact that people who were not white were passed over, regardless of the fact that they met all the requirements?

Ok...you met a black man in Moscow. Does that mean you have knowledge of how he's treated in Moscow? Or the black people in Ireland, Scotland, or Poland, for that matter?

Because once you specify white skin only, it becomes racist. Or as you continue to state "pointless."

But if you specify black, brown, olive, red, yellow, or whatever non-white skin it's not discriminatory?

Hypocritical much?

Last I checked equality and discrimination were on opposite sides of the spectrum.

[Seifer]

I never said white-only scholarships were bad. I just question why they're necessary. I know why minority scholarships are necessary. It, to me, is the same as people asking why black history month exists, when white history month is every month.

Asking why Jewish-only scholarships or Polish-only scholarships are necessary shows a level of egocentrism I haven't seen in awhile. Somehow, your hardships and the discrimination you and your own minority group face is worse than that faced by these other white minority groups. You see them as simply "white people" and look no further, so you don't understand why they need their own scholarships.

There are just as many people out there who will discriminate against someone of Jewish descent as they would another minority. Same goes for the Polish and the Irish.

I'm not holding past transgressions against anyone. My issues with racism are present-day. In the present, Irish people and Polish people and white Jewish people have advantages over non-white people, regardless of how other white people treat them.

You are holding past transgressions against an entire group of people when you ask why non-white minorities should care about discrimination against white minorities. Let me give you the exact quote, since you think I don't have any reading comprehension skills:

All those groups have stepped on non-white people at some point to gain the level of privilege they have. They are still considered white. Please tell my why non-white people are supposed to feel bad about certain groups of white people being treated badly by other groups of white people, when all groups of white people have advantages over non-white people?

You said they basically stepped on minorities to get where they are today, so why should you care? According to you, they're all just white people, and white people have it easy.

Give me a break. I guarantee you can find someone from any white minority who has felt the same level of discrimination you have. Fear of leaving the house? Check. The belief that you have to prove yourself in order to be accepted simply because of who you are? Check. The list goes on and on.

Just because they're white doesn't mean the discrimination they face is any more or less than your own. Saying so is fucking offensive.

If I were holding past transgressions against everyone: why are you allowed to do so, but I'm not?

Please stop telling me who I dislike. You don't know who I dislike, or why.

Where in this conversation have I held past transgressions against everyone?

You've made it quite clear who you dislike by your comments. Saying how all of your white coworkers consider you less black when you work harder, how a white person's respect is lost the moment "they see you as black", etc. Here's the exact quote again, since you think I can't read:

And once we gain that acceptance, we're seen as "not really <insert race here>" by white people, and "trying to be white" by non-white people. The instant we remind white people we actually are <insert race here>, that acceptance is gone. We go back to being just another <whichever racial slur applies>.

Those come off as paranoid generalizations from someone who dislikes/mistrusts anyone with white skin.

[KnitShoni]

...And here is where I shake my head at your profound lack of reading comprehension and exit this conversation.

[Nyoibo]

Ok...you met a black man in Moscow. Does that mean you have knowledge of how he's treated in Moscow? Or the black people in Ireland, Scotland, or Poland, for that matter?

I have knowledge of how black people, asian people and jewish people are treated in the US and you know what, not really any difference that I saw.

...And here is where I shake my head at your profound lack of reading comprehension and exit this conversation.

Read, "I've run out of thinly veiled racist statements to make and have no real response"

[Andara Bledin]

Your omission of that last 1% shows that you too know that there are places where whites are discriminated against.

I live in Compton, surrounded by Latinos and blacks, and I still am not the one that has to worry about being profiled, followed, and/or harassed due to my race.

Honestly, I'm saddened by the evidence of lack of experience from both sides; one side has been so affected by prejudice that they have trouble not seeing it everywhere, and the other has had so little direct experience that they just sort of handwave it off as being not a big deal.

^-.-^

[Hyena Dandy]

I think there's a big assumption of extremes going on here.

I think that one side is basically saying "Prejudice is different in different areas" and the other is taking that as "There is no prejudice whatsoever outside the bible belt south."

While the other side is saying "There is prejudice in all places, in one way or another" and is being taken as saying "Every black/latino/etc person everywhere might as well live in Alabama in '67."

[wolfie]

And I'd agree. Is it really that offensive for a scholarship to state that it's for black Americans? Do they really have to say "African-Americans" in the attempt to be politically correct?

Because once you specify white skin only, it becomes racist. Or as you continue to state "pointless."

But if you specify black, brown, olive, red, yellow, or whatever non-white skin it's not discriminatory?

Hypocritical much?

Last I checked equality and discrimination were on opposite sides of the spectrum.

If a not-explicitly-race-tied scholarship (e.g. one open only to children of firefighters who died in the line of duty) skips over non-white applicants in favour of white applicants with lesser (according to the stated criteria for the scholarship) qualifications, it's a fault in the administration of the scholarship which needs to be addressed.

For race-based scholarships, if it's OK to have a scholarship in honour of Martin Luther King for which only blacks are eligible (as in case cited by OP), then one in honour of Nathan Bedford Forrest for which only whites are eligible should also be OK. If it's not OK to have an NBF memorial scholarship, then it should also be not OK to have a MLK memorial scholarship. To say that one is OK and the other isn't is racism pure and simple - regardless of which one you're arguing is OK.

[AdminAssistant]

Okay, can we take a giant step back and go back to the scholarships? Because I'm going to pull the "work at a college" card again and explain this. It's for diversity. Most of the universities in American (except for the historically black ones like Spelman) are predominantly white and predominantly upper to upper-middle class. That's why universities support the idea of scholarships for minorities, women (esp. in the sciences), and first-generation college students (meaning that they are the first in their family to go to college). The school I went to, a large R-1 university, if you saw an African-American student chances are they were an athlete. That's a problem. As others have said, that just means that you qualify for the scholarship. You still have to meet the academic and/or financial requirements.

[Greenday]

Too much to quote so there's no point in it. But no one has yet to prove just one point of how my being a white male has given me privilege. Maybe I've just lucked out and only lived in areas where people don't care about the color of your skin, including the cops.

AA, that's interesting that your school gives scholarships for those who are the first in their family to go to college. I've never heard of such a thing.