Racist Scholarship

[KnitShoni]

WOW, talk about paranoia. Sounds like you distrust and dislike any and all white citizens you meet and immediately make these wide-sweeping generalizations about them. Guess what? Not all of your white coworkers are going to think you're "not really <insert race here>" or "trying to be white" just because you're a good worker. Probably most of them are simply going to consider you a good worker. Period. End of story.

Move away from Racists-R-Us Texas and find a community that doesn't have their heads up their asses and you might gain a bit of trust in white Americans.

I love how it always comes up that I must hate white people if I mention that white people have it easier in this country. What part of what I said was a generalization? The fact that people are surprised when I succeed because of generalized assumptions about my race?

I also love how it's assumed that racism only happens in certain parts of the country.

[Nekojin]

For example, I bet southern California is more interested in stereotyping illegal aliens than black citizens.

Just because the SoCal hispanics receive more racism directed at them doesn't mean that there isn't any aimed at the black citizens/community, or that the racism aimed at blacks (or any other race) is unimportant.

You show me this as if I should somehow be shocked that there are old racist douchebags who think lowly of black citizens. Guess what, I'm not. I'll be happy when the older generation dies off and we'll be left with much fewer racist idiots than we've had in the last few decades. (I realize that racism will probably never die out since it's a form of elitism, but I am confident it will continue to diminish as younger generations are taught acceptance and the importance of diversity.)

Strictly speaking, racism is a form of tribalism, and as such, it's unlikely to ever die out completely. As long as there's an "other" to hate, there will be plenty of people to hate them.

[Duelist925]

...They also have to change their way of speaking, study and become more knowledgeable about whatever they're talking about, and carry themselves differently.

Shaving, showering, and dolling themselves up is a plus, but if they still act and sound like morons, society is only going to laugh harder. "Oh look, a simpleton who thinks he's one of us!" Seriously, it's not as easy as you think.

Also, AGAIN, it depends completely on where you are. In some places (places where people aren't thoroughbred racists and are actually educated), a well-dressed minority can walk down the street without incident.

You are missing the point, seifer.

The point is that you cannot name one state or city where "standard white male" is discriminated again.

There are places where blacks are the target. Hispanics. Asians. Women. Gays. Etc. There is not one single state or city where a "standard white male" is discriminated against.

Yes, there are jackass trailer trash, and wannabe thug gangster jackasses. But fi they took a shower, and changed their clothes, they would stop getting any sort of weird look outside of a predominantly minority area.

This is not true of anyone who is black, hispanic, openly gay, asian,e tc, etc, etc. They have to prove themselves, as stated before. They get looked at like its "unusual" for them to be in an area, regardless of how long they've lived there. "Standard white male" doesnt.

"Standard white male" can walk down 99% of americas streets without raising an eyebrow from anyone. No other race can.

That is the damned point.

WOW, talk about paranoia. Sounds like you distrust and dislike any and all white citizens you meet and immediately make these wide-sweeping generalizations about them. Guess what? Not all of your white coworkers are going to think you're "not really <insert race here>" or "trying to be white" just because you're a good worker. Probably most of them are simply going to consider you a good worker. Period. End of story.

Move away from Racists-R-Us Texas and find a community that doesn't have their heads up their asses and you might gain a bit of trust in white Americans.

It's not paranoia if its true. And hey, maybe your right, maybe his coworkers are a bunch of open minded nice guys. But, then, i think he'd know them a hell of a lot better than you do.

also, what he said? Is true in sadly too many cases.

And that last bit? wow. Houston is a major city. Its hardly "Racists r us", though racism is generally more prevalent in the south.

This isn't about "Ah hate dem darkies" Racism. This is the subtle kind of racism, that people don't even realize they have. The kind that lets them dismiss a "standard white male" in an instant, but makes then glance just a bit longer at anyone with a good tan.

[KnitShoni]

Just because the SoCal hispanics receive more racism directed at them doesn't mean that there isn't any aimed at the black citizens/community, or that the racism aimed at blacks (or any other race) is unimportant.

Strictly speaking, racism is a form of tribalism, and as such, it's unlikely to ever die out completely. As long as there's an "other" to hate, there will be plenty of people to hate them.

Exactly. Does it actually matter who the racism is directed at? Just because latinos/as in SoCal will generally be told to "go back to Mexico" doesn't mean that blacks won't be told to "go back to Africa" or that East Asians won't be told to "go back to China." They're all getting the message that because they're not white, they don't belong here.

[Seifer]

Considering discrimination against you is less likely to get you jailed or killed than discrimination against me, I'm going to have to say, yes. It is worse. Most of the time, all you'll get is hurt feelings. I think my potential loss of life is a worse result than your potential hurt feelings.

Keep pretending it's only a handful of old people who are racist. We've been waiting for "old racist people to die out" for decades. People seem to forget those old racist people weren't always old.

I'm sure discrimination could get me killed if I went into the wrong neighborhood where everyone disliked/hated white citizens. I'd bet that there are plenty of communities out there where they've become so paranoid that they see every white person walking down the street as a threat. It's the parallel situation that you describe for yourself - being afraid to walk down the street because of the color of your skin. In this case, I'd be the minority figure facing a bunch of paranoid, uneducated people who are more concerned with the person they perceive me to be, rather than my actual character.

Also, when did I say it was only a handful? I'm sure there are a lot of people who still hold stereotypes about minorities - either due to learned fears or a lack of education. However, that can go both ways - I'm sure there are minority parents telling their children how every "cracker" is out to get them and they should be wary of everyone they meet. How is that helping anyone? It's just breeding more fear and paranoia.

Acceptance and education is the key. If people would stop listening to those paralyzed with fear and instead look at the facts - we're all human and our skin color doesn't dictate our personal character - then we'll be better for it.

Do you not watch the news or read? The figures I'm "working with" are all over the place.

http://www.aclu.org/criminal-law-ref...t-quarter-2011

Start there.

Your "mistreatment" is not institutional. I never said you aren't discriminated against. But I'm not going to pretend the discrimination you face is on par with what any non-white person faces. That would be a lie.

Like I said, if I walked into a minority community that was gripped with anti-white paranoia, I'd feel the same amount of fear as you apparently do in your current community.

I love how it always comes up that I must hate white people if I mention that white people have it easier in this country. What part of what I said was a generalization? The fact that people are surprised when I succeed because of generalized assumptions about my race?

I also love how it's assumed that racism only happens in certain parts of the country.

And you've missed my point like a champ. I didn't say you hated/disliked white people because you "mention that white people have it easier in this country." It was your comment that your white co-workers could only accept you if they felt you were "no longer <enter race here>." THAT is paranoia - the idea that every white person you work with will somehow think of you as "less black" when you do a good job. (By the way, that part was your generalization.)

You also generalized again. Not all of your white co-workers will assume you're gonna be lazy because you're black. They also won't all be surprised when you succeed.

I didn't say there wasn't racism all over the country, I said that different groups will get shit on in different parts of the country. It comes to elitism - who can the majority in that town stand on in order to make themselves feel superior.

Just because the SoCal hispanics receive more racism directed at them doesn't mean that there isn't any aimed at the black citizens/community, or that the racism aimed at blacks (or any other race) is unimportant.

Strictly speaking, racism is a form of tribalism, and as such, it's unlikely to ever die out completely. As long as there's an "other" to hate, there will be plenty of people to hate them.

When did I say racism toward blacks wasn't important? I merely stated that racism and prejudice changes as you move to different communities. In some communities, racism toward black citizens may not be as bad as racism/prejudice toward another group. In other places, racism toward black citizens will be the #1 problem. Trying to make a blanket statement and say that a black citizen will face the same level or amount of racism wherever they go is simply ludicrous.

(Just an opinion, but I see racism as sort of elitism, too. People feel superior over another group and try to come up with reasons to support their feelings.)

[KnitShoni]

Acceptance and education is the key. If people would stop listening to those paralyzed with fear and instead look at the facts - we're all human and our skin color doesn't dictate our personal character - then we'll be better for it.

Why do people pretend racism is a result of a lack of education?

And why do you assume my "fear" is only due to "my community?" Do you not realize that you have to go into a certain community to experience that type of discrimination, whereas a non-white person merely has to walk out their front door (provided someone doesn't break in their front door).

[Seifer]

You are missing the point, seifer.

The point is that you cannot name one state or city where "standard white male" is discriminated again.

When did I say "standard white male"? My original point was that WHM from low-income households should have more chances to gain scholarship money for school. They have just as much financial need as a minority student from the same background, yet it's considered racist to have a scholarship specifically for WHM no matter their level of need.

It's not like white households are given a money tree when they purchase the property. Money for college needs to come from somewhere, and a student from a low-income household is going to need all the financial help they can get, regardless of their skin color.

It's strange to me that skin color takes precedence over need in those situations. "You can't have your own scholarship because you're white!" Okay, so does being white automatically mean that they get a free ticket to college?

It's not paranoia if its true.

Simply assuming it is with no proof is paranoia.

And that last bit? wow. Houston is a major city. Its hardly "Racists r us", though racism is generally more prevalent in the south.

Considering how bleak the community was painted in earlier posts, it sure sounded like "Racists R Us" to me. Are you saying it was exaggerated?

[KnitShoni]

As far as the scholarship thing: Take a look at the requirements for race-based scholarships. Race is generally another requirement added to the list you'd find for other merit-based scholarships. If you don't qualify for a regular merit-based scholarship...what makes you think you'd qualify for a race-based one? Never mind the fact that people apparently forgot how these scholarships came into being, and actively deny the fact that they are still necessary. People are complaining there are no scholarships available for white people simply for being white. I'm trying to figure out where all the scholarships are for other races simply for not being white.

[Seifer]

Why do people pretend racism is a result of a lack of education?

Um, because it is? If you go to a school where no one mentions that there are people outside of your community who have different customs, opinions, religions, viewpoints, etc., you're gonna end up believing that you're all there is. Then, when you see someone who clearly isn't like you (whether it's skin color, religious differences, etc.) you're probably gonna be shocked and appalled. "Who is this person who is so different from me?" It's important to learn from an early age about the world so you have a better understanding of it. You're less likely to fear something you understand.

And why do you assume my "fear" is only due to "my community?" Do you not realize that you have to go into a certain community to experience that type of discrimination, whereas a non-white person merely has to walk out their front door (provided someone doesn't break in their front door).

Again, you're assuming that every community everywhere is full of racist and prejudiced people who are just itching to hate and distrust a minority. Also, that last bit could have come from the mouth of a racist white person. "YOU GOTTA LOCK YOUR DOORS OR THE BLACKS WILL BREAK IN TO STEAL YOUR STEREO!"

[KnitShoni]

When did I say "standard white male"? My original point was that WHM from low-income households should have more chances to gain scholarship money for school. They have just as much financial need as a minority student from the same background, yet it's considered racist to have a scholarship specifically for WHM no matter their level of need.

It's not like white households are given a money tree when they purchase the property. Money for college needs to come from somewhere, and a student from a low-income household is going to need all the financial help they can get, regardless of their skin color.

It's strange to me that skin color takes precedence over need in those situations. "You can't have your own scholarship because you're white!" Okay, so does being white automatically mean that they get a free ticket to college?



Simply assuming it is with no proof is paranoia.



Considering how bleak the community was pasted in earlier posts, it sure sounded like "Racists R Us" to me. Are you saying it was exaggerated?

You are still missing the point. In this society, white heterosexual male is the standard. Your personal hardships do not negate this. A black person in your circumstances does not share the privileges you have.

I think Duelist925 is wondering the same thing I'm wondering, which is why you insist that "Racists R Us" is a regional thing.

[Seifer]

As far as the scholarship thing: Take a look at the requirements for race-based scholarships. Race is generally another requirement added to the list you'd find for other merit-based scholarships. If you don't qualify for a regular merit-based scholarship...what makes you think you'd qualify for a race-based one?

If the race requirement is simply tacked on to an average list of scholarly requirements, then why even bothering make it a racial scholarship?

I'm not trying to be offensive, I'm genuinely curious. Are they trying to even the odds for minority students? How? By cutting out students who fit the majority? How is that going to change the scoring? If a minority student earns excellent grades and scores high on any standardized tests given by the state, how is making their race a requirement going to affect their chances of earning the scholarship? By cutting the overall numbers and raising their odds?

[Nekojin]

Um, because it is? If you go to a school where no one mentions that there are people outside of your community who have different customs, opinions, religions, viewpoints, etc., you're gonna end up believing that you're all there is. Then, when you see someone who clearly isn't like you (whether it's skin color, religious differences, etc.) you're probably gonna be shocked and appalled. "Who is this person who is so different from me?" It's important to learn from an early age about the world so you have a better understanding of it. You're less likely to fear something you understand.

Mostly true, but then how do you explain highly-educated people who are still out-and-out racist, and the many many more who are less overtly so, but still racist?

Education can help, but it's not anywhere near a universal panacea.

[KnitShoni]

Um, because it is? If you go to a school where no one mentions that there are people outside of your community who have different customs, opinions, religions, viewpoints, etc., you're gonna end up believing that you're all there is. Then, when you see someone who clearly isn't like you (whether it's skin color, religious differences, etc.) you're probably gonna be shocked and appalled. "Who is this person who is so different from me?" It's important to learn from an early age about the world so you have a better understanding of it. You're less likely to fear something you understand.



Again, you're assuming that every community everywhere is full of racist and prejudiced people who are just itching to hate and distrust a minority. Also, that last bit could have come from the mouth of a racist white person. "YOU GOTTA LOCK YOUR DOORS OR THE BLACKS WILL BREAK IN TO STEAL YOUR STEREO!"

No, it isn't. Unless you insist on discounting the number of highly intelligent racist people in the world.

Also, that last bit could have come from the mouth of a racist white person.

We live in a society where cops will break into your house and shoot you, while at the same time crime gets attributed to non white people regardless of who the offender actually is (the news stories of people committing crimes and blaming them on non-white people are only the tip of the iceberg), and you think those two scenarios are the same? Oh.

[crashhelmet]

You are missing the point, seifer.

The point is that you cannot name one state or city where "standard white male" is discriminated again.

There are places where blacks are the target. Hispanics. Asians. Women. Gays. Etc. There is not one single state or city where a "standard white male" is discriminated against.

Yes, there are jackass trailer trash, and wannabe thug gangster jackasses. But fi they took a shower, and changed their clothes, they would stop getting any sort of weird look outside of a predominantly minority area.

This is not true of anyone who is black, hispanic, openly gay, asian,e tc, etc, etc. They have to prove themselves, as stated before. They get looked at like its "unusual" for them to be in an area, regardless of how long they've lived there. "Standard white male" doesnt.

Oakland, CA
East Palo Alto, CA
East St. Louis, IL
9th Ward in New Orleans, LA
South Central Los Angeles?

"Standard white male" can walk down 99% of americas streets without raising an eyebrow from anyone. No other race can.

Your omission of that last 1% shows that you too know that there are places where whites are discriminated against.

[Seifer]

You are still missing the point. In this society, white heterosexual male is the standard. Your personal hardships do not negate this. A black person in your circumstances does not share the privileges you have.

I think Duelist925 is wondering the same thing I'm wondering, which is why you insist that "Racists R Us" is a regional thing.

"White heterosexual male" breaks down into sub-groups, was my point. You can't lump all of them together because not all of them will be treated the same. A lot of factors go into it, like economic status, appearance (what you can change and what you can't), how they carry themselves, their education, speech patterns, etc. I'm not saying that a white heterosexual male is going to get more flack than the average black citizen - I realize that's a fallacy. I'm saying that there are other factors and not to simply assume that all white males have it made.

I didn't say it was a regional thing. I'm tired of explaining this 8 different ways - racism changes depending on where you go. Prejudice can be directed toward one group over another, but it doesn't disappear altogether. It can certainly be worse in some areas than others, and those are the areas to try and avoid. (Like Duelist mentioned earlier, the Bible Belt South is probably the absolute worst place for racism.)

Mostly true, but then how do you explain highly-educated people who are still out-and-out racist, and the many many more who are less overtly so, but still racist?

Education can help, but it's not anywhere near a universal panacea.

I know that education is a huge part of it. The other part is learned - what your parents tell you. It can take decades to rid yourself of negative lessons your parents taught at home. If a child grows up hearing about how awful <insert group here> is, then they will most likely have a hard time unlearning that.

No, it isn't. Unless you insist on discounting the number of highly intelligent racist people in the world.

You mean the ones who were told all their lives by their families, parents, and friends that <insert group> is evil and should be purged from society? Yeah, it takes time and dedication to unlearn a lifetime of that shit. Some people aren't able to, unfortunately.

We live in a society where cops will break into your house and shoot you, while at the same time crime gets attributed to non white people regardless of who the offender actually is (the news stories of people committing crimes and blaming them on non-white people are only the tip of the iceberg), and you think those two scenarios are the same? Oh.

I'm pretty sure crime isn't attributed to non-white people when there aren't any around. (As Dave Chapelle said, there aren't any black people in Minnesota except Prince and Kirby Puckett.) Again, you're assuming that every community is the same. Now, again, in communities where there's a lot of prejudice and anti-whatever sentiments floating around, you're more likely to see the blaming happening.

And yes, I believe that paranoid fear = paranoid fear. Believing that all people of a single group are criminals and out to get you is PARANOIA.