Disney Princess Redesgin

[Gravekeeper]

Frankly, I'm more annoyed that Rapunzel is always shown with massive waves of blonde hair, when she was a short-cropped brunette by the end of the movie. It's almost as though the entire movie was rolled back out of existence. =^_^=

Well, it has been. They all have. Ariel should be 28-30 and a mother. They're all also married ( Save Merida ). They've been rolled back and set to Stepford Wife as a factory default.

Pocahontas is particularly bad, as the sequel makes specific note of the fact she doesn't know what make up is. -.-

[Bloodsoul]

Maybe that would explain her appearance? ^w^

[Kheldarson]

Well, it has been. They all have. Ariel should be 28-30 and a mother. They're all also married ( Save Merida ). They've been rolled back and set to Stepford Wife as a factory default.

Pocahontas is particularly bad, as the sequel makes specific note of the fact she doesn't know what make up is. -.-

Actually, with Ariel, her sequel doesn't count anyway. Most of the sequels don't count in Disney continuity. They're done by a completely different studio (hence the vast, vast difference in quality).

[Gravekeeper]

Actually, with Ariel, her sequel doesn't count anyway. Most of the sequels don't count in Disney continuity. They're done by a completely different studio (hence the vast, vast difference in quality).

How do they not count? That's pretty ballsy of Disney to churn out 1-2 sequels per movie, with as many of the original voice actors as they can afford ( Usually only missing the Big Celebrity Voice ), then claim they don't count. Also, only one of them was made by a different studio ( Mulan II ). And Mulan II still had the entire original cast save Eddie Murphy as well as Disney writers and a Disney director.

Yes, they're made by a different studio from the main movie making studio. Specifically, they're made by Disney's studio that animates all their TV series. Hence they retain the same style but with a lower budget.

Plus, some of the sequels were theatrical releases. There's no way they can claim they aren't part of the continuity.

Gah, I just noticed the Little Mermaid has a prequel too.

[Kheldarson]

How do they not count? That's pretty ballsy of Disney to churn out 1-2 sequels per movie, with as many of the original voice actors as they can afford ( Usually only missing the Big Celebrity Voice ), then claim they don't count. Also, only one of them was made by a different studio ( Mulan II ). And Mulan II still had the entire original cast save Eddie Murphy as well as Disney writers and a Disney director.

Yes, they're made by a different studio from the main movie making studio. Specifically, they're made by Disney's studio that animates all their TV series. Hence they retain the same style but with a lower budget.

Plus, some of the sequels were theatrical releases. There's no way they can claim they aren't part of the continuity.

Gah, I just noticed the Little Mermaid has a prequel too.

I can only find one movie that was an actual sequel that's also on the more or less accepted continuity list, and that's Rescuer's Down Under (BEST. MOVIE. EVER.) Here's the list most go by: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...mated_features

Basically the sequels made by their TV production studio don't count because they're inherently flawed by budget, design, and pacing. They very rarely have sequel movies that actually make sense, and often just reiterate the same lesson as the original, since "that's the theme".

Would you count an unoriginal story line/obvious cash cow as part of your continuity?

[Ginger Tea]

the beauty and the beast sequel (nostalgia chick did a review) happened mid way in the first movie and the lesson learned was forgotten by the time the next scene of he original happened, well that's cos the sequel's plot was not part of the main movie obv.

but Disney and continuity are not two words I associate with each other, Disney and new IP also ;P

but enough with the tinkerbell movies already

[Gravekeeper]

Basically the sequels made by their TV production studio don't count because they're inherently flawed by budget, design, and pacing. They very rarely have sequel movies that actually make sense, and often just reiterate the same lesson as the original, since "that's the theme".

But how can Disney say they don't count? Especially when some of them had theatrical releases. You can't make a sequel, release it in theatre after the original and then say "Oh it doesn't count". Because now you're trying to explain continuity and canon to 6 year olds.

As far as the target market ( Children ) is concerned, these are sequels and canon.

Would you count an unoriginal story line/obvious cash cow as part of your continuity?

I personally would not have an obvious cash grab to begin with, but I'm not an asshole studio executive. Especially when it comes to Disney who tends to make animated masterpieces. To shit on their own rug then have the gall to say they didn't when people ask what the smell and why their pants are down... -.-

[Kheldarson]

The entire logic is because it's not made by the main studio. Not by main studio = not really official.


And is it wrong that I'm finding this discussion kinda hilarious now? Not for any particular points, just that we're discussing what is and isn't canon of Disney.

[Gravekeeper]

The entire logic is because it's not made by the main studio. Not by main studio = not really official.

I get that, that makes sense to us. I'm thinking that canon vs non-canon is a fairly futile idea to explain to a lot of the target market.

And is it wrong that I'm finding this discussion kinda hilarious now? Not for any particular points, just that we're discussing what is and isn't canon of Disney.

No, I find this quite amusing as well. Also, I'm learning all sorts of random silly things about Disney.

Now I'm wondering what the criteria is for a Disney Princess. There's 12 official princesses, but a bunch of missing ones and some included characters ( Merida, Mulan, Pocahontas ) don't really seem to fit.

Where's Eilonwy, Tiger Lily, Kida and Megara? Why aren't they good enough? They're more qualified than Mulan and Pocahontas. They're all from main studio features. Wouldn't having two younger princesses ( Eilonwy and Tiger Lily ) be a good thing? Instead of having a homogenized set of teen princesses?

And Megara and Kida for older role models. Megara had a heck of a personality and Kida at least gets to become Queen instead of trophy wife.

[Gravekeeper]

Oh hey, the two new princesses are yet more slender white blonds. ;p

[Kheldarson]

Well, Merida is the most recent princess, and, by design, an attempt to break the mold (hence why the Pixar designer got upset).

The only thing I can think for Megara and Tiger Lily is that they're technically supporting cast, but that would eliminate Jasmine from their list. There's also the fact that Disney hasn't quite gotten over some bad racial overtones, which probably is why they won't bring Tiger Lily forward (let's not rehash old controversy with how the Indians are designed...).

Eilonwy...well, I'm not a Black Caldron fan, and most people don't even know the movie in general. So that's probably the reason there. Although, I do like Eilonwy. I thought she was neat.

Kida...she's too alien? I don't know. Maybe it ties into the supporting cast problem again.


Although, now I'm just imagining a meeting of the Disney princesses and Megara being there snarking them all.

I may have a fanfic to write.

[Gravekeeper]

Well, Merida is the most recent princess, and, by design, an attempt to break the mold (hence why the Pixar designer got upset).

I think Mulan was a legitimate mold breaker. Until she got farked by the sequel.

There's also the fact that Disney hasn't quite gotten over some bad racial overtones, which probably is why they won't bring Tiger Lily forward (let's not rehash old controversy with how the Indians are designed...).

Ironically enough, one of the original pre-production designs of Pocahontas looked exactly like Tiger Lily.

Eilonwy...well, I'm not a Black Caldron fan, and most people don't even know the movie in general. So that's probably the reason there. Although, I do like Eilonwy. I thought she was neat.

I think for most people Black Cauldron and Sword In The Stone are blurred together in their memory.

Kida...she's too alien? I don't know. Maybe it ties into the supporting cast problem again.

Disney could use some sci-fi in the mix. -.-

Although, now I'm just imagining a meeting of the Disney princesses and Megara being there snarking them all.

Okay, yeah I'd pay money to see that. Also, I can envision a similar outrage if they tried to tart up Megara into a Stepford Wife.

[violiav]

Atlantis wasn't that popular of a movie as I recall, it came at the tail end of Eisner's reign at Disney. It came out at a time when tastes were shifting, but it also caught people by surprise. It was very, very different from any other Disney animated film. Still is. People just didn't accept it as a Disney film- no songs, etc. So it holds the same fate as The Black Cauldron, good, it just doesn't feel like Disney, or what Disney's supposed to feel like.

So what changed between 1994 and the release of the last really strong Dinsny movie and 2000?
Pixar.

Since Pixar came to town it seems like -most- of Disney films have been princess centric. Like, if there's a girl, she's got to be a princess. It's like they started doing exactly what people had been complaining about them doing. The one's that aren't are sort of hit or miss.

I wish I knew when Disney when from being liked by both boys and girls (and targeting both) to only trying to saw the female audience. Maybe late 90s?


eta:: In some cases they seem so hung up on "messages" that they seem to forget that a movie doesn't really need a message. It just needs to tell a story. And heck, if parents other than myself are so hung up on "message", then just don't buy it. Or talk to your kids. Watch the film with them. Have a conversation.

[Kheldarson]

I think Mulan was a legitimate mold breaker. Until she got farked by the sequel.

She was. And I loved using clips from her movie for my students. It's a decent movie for showing gender roles and stereotypes. And a bit of cultural/historical differences.

Ironically enough, one of the original pre-production designs of Pocahontas looked exactly like Tiger Lily.

Didn't know that, but I'm not surprised at all. At least they kinda fixed it for the movie?

I think for most people Black Cauldron and Sword In The Stone are blurred together in their memory.

Quite possible. Honestly, my main issue with the Black Cauldron is that it's not particularly memorable. I remember the ending clearly, but the lead up to it is kinda blurred. But not everybody's going to like the same things. (My favorite Disney movies are Rescuer's Down Under and The Great Mouse Detective. And then Robin Hood has a soft spot in my heart too).

Disney could use some sci-fi in the mix. -.-

Gods, yes. As long as it's not a repeat of Treasure Planet. *shudders*

Okay, yeah I'd pay money to see that. Also, I can envision a similar outrage if they tried to tart up Megara into a Stepford Wife.

Quit giving me ideas. I really don't have time for another writing project....unless I made it a complete one-off....hmm...

[Andara Bledin]

Oh, hey. So the Pocahontas look came from a glammed up princess group from last year, sometime. And the rouge was from two years ago. Apparently nobody cares until someone raises a stink, then suddenly it's an issue. *shrugs*