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  • #61
    Well, clearly I'm just a big ol meanyhead and I should just be oh so ashamed of myself.

    Of course, it could be that there is more to the story than what I shared. So perhaps we can put down the torches and pitchforks for a moment here and I can shed some light on the circumstances surrounding my latest crop of stories.

    Honestly, I couldn't care less what's on the TV when the inmates are out. I truly couldn't. For the record, I don't watch the TV. It's background noise as far as I'm concerned. I am generally at my desk, which is about 30 feet away from the TV, where I am keeping an eye on 30 or so convicted criminals who ARE watching the TV (as well as the ones playing chess/cards/whatever, talking on one of the phones, getting books off the book carts, in the showers, cleaning their cells, visiting on doors, or just walking around aimlessly). Once an hour, I make a round of all cells on both floors, then it's back to the desk. The desk in right in the middle of everything, and it's the best vantage point to keep an eye on everything that's going on.

    There are two reasons why I refused and have continued to refuse to allow them to watch basketball. First of all, we noticed over a period of 10 days or so that it was the same guys every night who came up to the desk wanting to watch the game. I rotated into this house in about the middle of April. Since doing so, my personal policy was I'd change the channel once per Dayroom period, and there are four 55-minute periods. If, by some chance, basketball wasn't on, the next group to come out would see one of the same guys in each group come running up to the desk to ask me to switch to the game. Some of the other guys started to wise up, so if the game was already on, they'd come over and ask me to put it on a different channel (usually FX so they could watch part of a movie).

    Here's what I was noticing. The guy who got the one and only channel change for his group would find himself surrounded by the sports fans. After a few minutes, he'd come back to the desk and say something along the lines of "We've all seen this movie, you can put it back on the game." I had developed a reasonable suspicion that the guys were being strong-armed into watching basketball.

    But, why would they be so petty as to threaten others into watching a ballgame? A few of them probably had money on the game. They don't have cash-in-hand in prison, but they have accounts that their families and friends can put money in. And when they owe someone money, they have their friends and family put money in their debtor's account to prevent getting their asses kicked. They can also exchange property, though in the house I work in they are severely limited on what they can have. Blowjobs are also a pretty common form of currency.

    I don't believe that many guys are gambling where I work, though. It's about establishing dominance. It's a "my house, my rules" type of mentality. If one guy, or one group, can establish their position as the alpha(s), everyone else sees that it is their territory and they make the rules. I see this happen over and over and over again.

    The other reason I put my foot down was because my sargent simply doesn't allow them to watch any sports, any time, period. Most days I work on the other side of the house, by myself, but I do occasionally work with her on her side. It makes no difference to me, but she's my boss and I need to run things her way so that everything is consistent. I don't always agree with my sargents, and different OIC's have different expectations, but I do my best to follow what each individual superior demands from me depending on who I answer to.

    There's another reason, I suppose. Where I work is called the "Reception and Diagnostic Unit," or RDU. It's where inmates live for the first 6-8 weeks of their incarceration while they are assessed and assigned a custody level based on their crime, behavior, mental health issues, and how much trouble they do or do not get into. Once they get their custody level, they are sent out to other facilities or the General Population at my facility. RDU is a different beast. We have specialized guidelines and procedures because we are dealing with "unclassified" inmates. Some of them will be Minimum custody and not bother anyone. Some of them are future Max/Segregation superstars who will raise all kinds of hell. We take different precautions, we have tighter behavioral rules, and we are far more strict than anywhere else in the facility. It is against the rules, in RDU to talk or otherwise make noise in your cell that can be heard outside your cell. So I have to get on them about talking to loud, or shouting, or whatever. Do I personally care? Not really, I've spent most of the 5 years I've been out there working in Segregation, and those guys never stop hollering at each other or at us. But thems the rules, and therefore I will warn the noisemakers to knock it off or I won't allow them to come out when it's their Dayroom period.

    So, with all that in mind, let's talk about basketball. We have a man come up to the desk at the start of the Dayroom asking me to put the TV on basketball. While dealing with handing out spray bottles of cleaners, chess boards, decks of cards, and taking the ID's of all the guys borrowing those things, I tell him no. He proceeds to ask me why. I tell him because I said no. I can see the indignant look of disbelief on his face and before he says another word, I tell him I'm tired of them watching basketball. He asks why, I point out that I am the officer in charge of the floor and I said no, which is also part of the rules of RDU. Not 2 minutes later, here comes another guy, who is buddies with the first one. And we go round and round again.

    By this point it has occurred to me that they seem to think we're having a power struggle. Because these guys who think they're running something are now being told "no," in front of everyone, by a female. So they get more aggressive, I get more dirty looks, and I can see that my lack of caring what was on the TV for the past couple of weeks was mistaken for compliance, and also seen as an unspoken submission to their supposed dominance.

    Now, several comments were made in which I said I was tired of basketball. Those were general statements. But at one point, yet another inmate puts words in my mouth saying that I said I was "tired of watching basketball." I said I was. I see now this is where I goofed. I should have clarified, I suppose, that I don't watch the TV. As I said, I have other things to tend to and it's just background noise to me (or perhaps background imagery, since there's so much other noise going on that you can't even hear it unless you happen to be within 6 feet of it).

    The fact is, I had my reasons for not turning the TV to the ballgame. As stated above, I believed some of the inmates were being strong-armed into watching it. Actually, I meant to comment on this after the story where an inmate said " If we all want to watch the game, then I don't see why not," as this comment was made after he made sure everyone agreed with him. But what it comes down to is this: I was taking ownership of the word "no." It's not like I'm going to start throwing accusations and say, "No, because you and your friends are threatening everyone." I'm not obligated to give them a reason. I don't have to explain myself. So when they want to argue, when they want to make a huge deal out of something petty, I own it. "Because it's what I want." Because I said so." They don't need to know why I made a decision, just that I made one. Not because of what my boss said, not because of the facility itself or any outside influence other than the fact that I said so.

    I try to give a little background info for my stories, because most people don't know what it's like in prison. But sometimes I forget that, sometimes I fail to realize that it may not be as funny if you're on the outside looking in. Maybe I should have provided more detail behind what was going on. Maybe I should have mentioned that for every story where some guy was fighting me about putting the stupid game on, someone quietly thanked me for not making them watch another basketball game.

    Anyway, hopefully this all clears the air a little. It's probably more defensive than I intended it to be, just as my post apparently made me look nastier than I am. Take it as you will. Let the lynching of my character and integrity continue if it must.

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    • #62
      My problem is the fact the US penal system is essentially a for profit slave labour system supporting a military industrial complex. People are sent to prison because it's profitable both for the prison company and the government. That is beyond fucked up.

      Even if they did get minimum wage your argument wouldn't stand though. The math doesn't add up because the system is for profit. So all of these services you claim inmates get are substandard since providing them would cost money which would cut into the profit advantage. Prison companies try to restrict access to anything that would cost money, such as medical care or proper housing facilities. Also, normally minimum wage doesn't come with rape and hepatitis C.

      Never mind the fact the job they are doing is one that would normally pay way more than minimum wage. The job they're doing ( Assembling military and aviation components ) would normally pay $20-28 an hour. Thats why prison companies can make money hand over fucking fist off of prison slave labour.

      You could pay them minimum wage after subtracting everything the prison provides for them if they were being paid the industry standard for the job they are actually doing. And still make a profit. It costs $31,000 a year to keep someone in prison. The job they're doing pays about $58-$59,000 a year if you were working it outside of prison for the company they're doing it for ( Boeing ). Minimum wage would be about $15,000 a year give or take.

      So your point is completely irrelevant. They should be making more than enough to pay for the room, boarding and services that prison provides them. They are being exploited for profit.

      The final fuck you of course is that they can't actually get the job they're trained for in prison after they get out of prison because they've been in prison.

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      • #63
        Originally posted by Kara_CS View Post
        The other reason I put my foot down was because my sargent simply doesn't allow them to watch any sports, any time, period.
        You could have simply just gone with that in the OP and saved us a thread >.>

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        • #64
          Originally posted by Ladeeda View Post
          Both. Inmates are getting a lot more than a single-person household on one minimum wage income would get. So insisting inmates get all that PLUS minimum wage... well, why should anyone in poverty NOT commit a crime, if they could at least have 3 meals and a place to live?
          Well. Theres the horrible conditions, the horrible food, the horrible health care, the odds of getting killed because of your skin color/region of origin/refusal to give a blowjob.

          Oh, and the rape. Lets not forget the rape. After all, its the butt of some many jokes.

          Yeah, prisons a fucking WONDERFUL place, ain't it? Three meals a day, and all the shankings and rape you could ever want. And then some.

          I really. REALLY. Hope you can feel the sarcasm radiating from me.

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          • #65
            Originally posted by Gravekeeper View Post
            You could have simply just gone with that in the OP and saved us a thread >.>
            Yeah, I think there's a lesson to be learned here. That lesson is, no matter how much you want to finally get that damn post written, you shouldn't do so while spaced-out on painkillers. Oi...

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            • #66
              Originally posted by Kara_CS View Post
              Yeah, I think there's a lesson to be learned here. That lesson is, no matter how much you want to finally get that damn post written, you shouldn't do so while spaced-out on painkillers. Oi...
              Thanks for the clarification at least. My initial arguments were based off the original posts. With full context and info, everything makes quite a bit more sense, and doesn't lend itself to what I initially though.

              Thanks. ^_^

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              • #67
                Originally posted by Ladeeda View Post
                Both. Inmates are getting a lot more than a single-person household on one minimum wage income would get. So insisting inmates get all that PLUS minimum wage... well, why should anyone in poverty NOT commit a crime, if they could at least have 3 meals and a place to live?
                "Well, I have it worse, so fuck them," is never an acceptable response in a civilized world. Neither misery nor sustenance are zero sum games.

                While resources are finite and the ability to effect change as well, the ability to actually care and speak out that things are wrong is not. To dismiss the plight of one group merely because another group is deemed "more worthy" (no matter how legitimate) and also in plight is callous at best.
                Faith is about what you do. It's about aspiring to be better and nobler and kinder than you are. It's about making sacrifices for the good of others. - Dresden

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                • #68
                  I think GK is thinking of privatized prisons. Some states, like Colorado, don't run their own prisons. The prisons are run by private companies, and yeah, a lot it is for-profit. Those are usually the prisons you see on TV shows like Lockdown. Because they're usually a goddamn mess.

                  There's no profit to be had for state-run facilities like mine. And since we don't generate income for the state, they don't give us much to work with. Which is the downside to non-privatized prison systems. We've had to cut all kinds of programs in the 5 years I've been there. They've cut parole services down to just 3 people for the entire state, they've closed smaller facilities which has caused crowding for the rest of us. Fun fact: This state has no post-incarceration sex offender programs. Those were cut from the budget 3 or 4 years ago. We got next year's budget, and it's about as grim as always. Until there's a huge incident that includes officers and/or civilians in the body count, the state won't do anything other than keep cutting our budget to the bone. It's going to take a public outcry, a demand from the people for better funding of our prisons to get anything done. And right now, the public is blissfully unaware of how bad things are. They think we get tons of funding and walk around in full body armor and have more than enough officers to deal with anything. Truth is, we get almost no equipment and only run on operational staffing.

                  As for inmate pay, if they work as custodians, cooks, or laundry, they make $1.25 per day. There are two on-site industry jobs. A balloon company (which is a single-room where they only box up all the stuff for shipment), and a larger building were they make beer taps and plastics. Those are the 2 minimum wage jobs they have. But the state taxes the hell out of them, they get less than half of that once it's all said and done.

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                  • #69
                    I honestly think that prisoners should be able to make 12K a year. There are prisons that run fish farms, some that run dairy farms, some that run farm farms. The prisoners are to work in those industries and yes it's training to a job on the outside if they can find someone to hire them. How many times have we heard of counselors having once been on the inside and they got their degree or certificate while they were in jail.

                    Hell one of the financial counselors I knew used to be in prison. He worked in the kitchens during the day and in his free time he learned about investing. Is this your typical prisoner? No but because some guard got him his first financial book he was able to learn.

                    Course if I had any say, all prisoners would have to work 8 hours a day , six days a week, and then take four hours of classes. Be they finishing up a high school degree or work on a night school correspondence.

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                    • #70
                      Thank you, Kara; it's a relief to find out the "more to the story" made such a difference.

                      Course if I had any say, all prisoners would have to work 8 hours a day , six days a week, and then take four hours of classes. Be they finishing up a high school degree or work on a night school correspondence.
                      What good does forced schooling do? You can't make them learn what they're supposedly studying, and if there's an actual classroom involved, then if high school is any guide those who don't want to learn make it all the harder for those who do.
                      "My in-laws are country people and at night you can hear their distinctive howl."

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                      • #71
                        Originally posted by Kara_CS View Post
                        Anyway, hopefully this all clears the air a little. It's probably more defensive than I intended it to be, just as my post apparently made me look nastier than I am. Take it as you will. Let the lynching of my character and integrity continue if it must.
                        I'm glad you finally responded. I've always respected you as a poster and I hoped there was more to the story. And the reasoning in this post makes a lot of sense. Power needs to be established in a prison and it shouldn't be between prisoners. It needs to be the people running the prison above those who are there as a result of misdeeds. But to be honest, this post seems insanely different from your post on CS. I hope you can see how I would interpret it so differently.
                        Violence has resolved more conflicts than anything else. The contrary opinion that violence doesn't solve anything is merely wishful thinking at its worst. - Starship Troopers

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                        • #72
                          Originally posted by Gravekeeper View Post
                          You're so wrong you have me and Andara agreeing on something. ;p
                          Actually, that should read "...me, Andara, AND Greenday all agree."

                          I can't remember when that's happened in the past.
                          Violence has resolved more conflicts than anything else. The contrary opinion that violence doesn't solve anything is merely wishful thinking at its worst. - Starship Troopers

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                          • #73
                            Originally posted by Greenday View Post
                            Actually, that should read "...me, Andara, AND Greenday all agree."

                            I can't remember when that's happened in the past.
                            Hah, damn. That IS an accomplishment.

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                            • #74
                              Next thing you know the three of you will be free styling rap on a street corner.

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                              • #75
                                Originally posted by Ginger Tea View Post
                                Next thing you know the three of you will be free styling rap on a street corner.
                                I was trying to avoid a Triforce reference. >.>

                                I would however like to think I would have more rhythm.

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