Flashing Headlights Protected by First Amendment

[TheHuckster]

Link

Guy flashes lights to motorists who are about to enter a speed trap, police notice and nearly try him for obstruction of justice. Prosecutors later dropped the case, although the guy files a lawsuit against the town over his first amendment rights.

I typically don't flash my headlights to speeders about to enter a trap, although I have done so if I see an obstruction in the road or if I see a speeder who is going into a blind curve with kids nearby. That being said, I believe that speed traps do little to actually improve road safety, and in some cases can even decrease safety. On more than a few occasions I've had to slam on my brakes on the highway to avoid a collision because the cars in front of me spotted a radar pointed at them.

It especially frustrates me when we were even going the speed limit, and by instinct we decide to suddenly slow down to 10-15 mph under the speed limit. Except in certain cases, such as police cracking down on speeding in a truly dangerous road that often sees speed related crashes, speed traps seem to be doing little more than padding the municipality's budget.

[Andara Bledin]

Be aware that the flashing of headlights is actually against the law (no matter the reason) in some areas. I'm not sure whether a First Amendment challenge in that case would hold up as the law is ostensibly supposed to be about safety.

The appropriate way to signal other drivers of a potential hazard here is to turn on the appropriately named hazard lights. However, if you are driving, and you are the hazard, you're back to breaking the law.

It's worth noting that I'm speaking specifically of California law, but many other states have similar statutes.

That said, I don't warn people about speed traps; they shouldn't be speeding in the first place.

[protege]

It especially frustrates me when we were even going the speed limit, and by instinct we decide to suddenly slow down to 10-15 mph under the speed limit. Except in certain cases, such as police cracking down on speeding in a truly dangerous road that often sees speed related crashes, speed traps seem to be doing little more than padding the municipality's budget.

It's even more fun, when such antics cause massive backups--in both directions--because people have to slam on the brakes. If you've ever driven over the hill near Green Tree, PA (I-376, the "parkway west"), you know exactly what I mean. Many nights, there's a state trooper sitting at the bottom of the hill, right under the high railroad bridge. He's there, to nail speeders. I-376 has several ramps at that location--perfect for a massive accident.

Drivers will come over the hill, see the cop, and go nuts. Even though he's a good mile-plus away, they feel the need to slam on the brakes so we're all doing 25mph. 25...on a fucking highway! Unless you're doing something extremely stupid--90mph weaving in and out of traffic--they're not going to bust your balls over a few miles over 55. There's plenty of time to simply lift your foot off the pedal, and allow your car to slow itself down. By the time you pass the cop, he probably won't even notice. Unless you're stupid enough to slam on the brakes when you pass him

[TheHuckster]

The appropriate way to signal other drivers of a potential hazard here is to turn on the appropriately named hazard lights. However, if you are driving, and you are the hazard, you're back to breaking the law.

I have only seen hazard lights used if the car itself is broken down or is carrying something on its rack and as a result is going slower than usual. Whenever there is an upcoming hazard that the car had passed, such as an animal or debris on the road, I've only seen headlights flashing. If someone turned on their hazards, I wouldn't associate that with an upcoming hazard, because at least where I live we don't do that here.

[Andara Bledin]

I can't help it if nobody learns the proper use of what lights are for what purpose.

Just be aware that if you flash your lights in California instead of using your hazards, you stand a chance of being ticketed over it.

[Greenday]

I can't help it if nobody learns the proper use of what lights are for what purpose.

Just be aware that if you flash your lights in California instead of using your hazards, you stand a chance of being ticketed over it.

I'm pretty sure every state can ticket you for creating a distraction to other drivers. Flashing your headlights would easily fall under that.

Hazards are supposed to be used to indicate a problem with your car and you are hazardous to other drivers. Broken down, driving slower than traffic, etc. Not because there's random hazards on the road.

[Andara Bledin]

A handy list for what different states have to say about hazard lights.

CA regulations on "flashing lights" aka hazard lights.

(3) To warn other motorists of accidents or hazards on a roadway, turn signal lamps may be flashed as warning lights while the vehicle is approaching, overtaking, or passing the accident or hazard on the roadway if the front turn signal lamps at each side are being flashed simultaneously and the rear turn signal lamps at each side are being flashed simultaneously.

As I said, you are permitted to use your hazard lights to indicate hazards other than your own vehicle. It's worth noting that most people are unaware that in most cases you are actually required to use your hazard lights when you are on the side of a roadway, unless your car is disabled to the point where they do not function.

[violiav]

I've always thought that flashing headlights was meant to communicate something. Like if someone has their headlights off. That's happened to me before.

[TheHuckster]

A handy list for what different states have to say about hazard lights.

CA regulations on "flashing lights" aka hazard lights.



As I said, you are permitted to use your hazard lights to indicate hazards other than your own vehicle. It's worth noting that most people are unaware that in most cases you are actually required to use your hazard lights when you are on the side of a roadway, unless your car is disabled to the point where they do not function.

There are many traffic laws that are also on the books that are virtually never enforced, such as not having things hanging from the rear view mirror or suction cuped to the windshield, or having too many loose articles inside the car... I'd like to know just how much this one is enforced. I'm also not sure if this is a California-only law or if all other states have the same laws and how much they enforce them.

All I can say is I've been on the road and have passed a car who is flashing headlights, and sure enough around the bend after I slow down a sharp object like a hubcap or broken glass is on my lane, or even a really bad pothole. Had the driver merely had their hazards on I would have had no idea that the driver was getting my attention. Maybe that's my fault for not knowing the rules of the road, but quite frankly, at least where I'm from, it's a pretty obscure law if it even exists around here, and the de facto standard everyone around here follows is to flash headlights... or maybe sometimes a quick honk of the horn.

This kind of concept might seem strange in a place like California, where roads are wider, have much less tight curves, and are straighter than the New England roads I drive. And it's not like I'm speeding. These kinds of obstructions can be easy to miss if you're even driving 25 mph in a 35 mph zone when you're going around tight bends.

[Aethian]

Flashing lights was also used and still used in areas to let Demi's know they can safely get in front of you.

[Panacea]

Slamming on the breaks when you're speeding actually attracts the cop's attention. If you see a cop, take your foot off the pedal. The gradual slowdown, if you are going the speed of traffic to begin with, is less likely to be noticed (I got this tidbit from a cop friend years ago).

A driving safety instructor (in California as it happens) told me he likes speed detectors. He told me drivers that use them tend to use more awareness of their surroundings, and the false positives many models get forces them to slow down; they often don't go as fast as they otherwise might. I thought that interesting.

[Andara Bledin]

If someone flashes their lights at me and I a) already have my lights on, b) am not preventing them from passing, and c) don't require that they let me know I have sufficient room to merge, then all it does is confuse the ever-loving fuck out of me.

Is one of my tires low? Did I leave the gas cap open? Is my trunk not closed? Did I leave my drink on the roof?

It's an incredibly inefficient form of communication for all but a very, very limited set of messages.

A few things about hazards: While it's true that someone running with their hazard lights on constantly (also against the law, by the way) might make you think they are the hazard, someone who wasn't using them who started using them would make you become more alert. Also, someone heading the same direction ahead of you can flash their headlights all they want, and you'll never see them, thus hazard lights are a much better option. Same for daytime operation - hazards will be much, much more visible than headlights.

[TheHuckster]

If someone flashes their lights at me and I a) already have my lights on, b) am not preventing them from passing, and c) don't require that they let me know I have sufficient room to merge, then all it does is confuse the ever-loving fuck out of me.

Is one of my tires low? Did I leave the gas cap open? Is my trunk not closed? Did I leave my drink on the roof?

Each of those scenarios, besides perhaps the gas cap, make you a hazard and if you don't see a hazard a little ways down the road it might be in your best interest to pull over and check things out before you cause injury to someone else.

A few things about hazards: While it's true that someone running with their hazard lights on constantly (also against the law, by the way) might make you think they are the hazard, someone who wasn't using them who started using them would make you become more alert. Also, someone heading the same direction ahead of you can flash their headlights all they want, and you'll never see them, thus hazard lights are a much better option. Same for daytime operation - hazards will be much, much more visible than headlights.

If you are ahead of someone and they encounter a hazard on or near the road, brake lights and some swerving usually suffice for me to understand there's something awry ahead. I don't need any other signal.

Keep in mind, this is not a common occurrence. In the last 5 years I can probably count, maybe, 3 times I've actually flashed my headlights at someone to warn them of a hazard behind me and ahead of them, and each of the times it was:

a.) A hazard which was behind a blind spot, such as on top of a steep hill or just beyond a sharp turn.

b.) Could cause bodily harm if the hazard was hit, such as deer or moose on the road or another person, or something which may cause the driver to reflexively and dangerously swerve to avoid.

Each of these times I glanced in the rear view mirror and saw that the driver had slowed down, heeding my warning.

And on the flip side, I was flashed twice and one of the times I slowed down, and sure enough a deer bolted in front of my car, nearly hitting it. Had the driver not flashed the headlights I would have surely not had enough time to avoid a collision. The other time was a broken headlight. I'll admit flashing your lights over a broken headlight is silly, and I had known about it, since such a thing is usually quite obvious to the driver.

A driving safety instructor (in California as it happens) told me he likes speed detectors. He told me drivers that use them tend to use more awareness of their surroundings, and the false positives many models get forces them to slow down; they often don't go as fast as they otherwise might. I thought that interesting.

Interesting, the two friends I know who have a detector are doing 80+ until the thing start beeping, at which point I nearly get whiplash as they go down to 50 in 2 seconds.

[Andara Bledin]

I wonder if this is an east coast thing. Because I can guarantee if you flash your lights at me, I'm going to become a hazard as I am distracted by trying to figure out what the hell you're trying to tell me rather than paying attention to my driving. So, in my case at least, you're more likely to cause an accident than avert one.

As for the people who slowed down, you can hope you helped make them aware, but you have no way of knowing that they didn't just slow down because, hey, you shouldn't be cresting a hill or turning a corner with no visibility at speed.

[MadMike]

This is actually not the first time this issue has come up. Someone on the school board where I went to school ended up in a case like this, and that was back in the '80s. He flashed his lights to warn other drivers about a speed trap, the cop ticketed him, and he took the cop to court and won.