Officer fired for not wearing a seatbelt???

[ditchdj]

http://www.khq.com/global/story.asp?s=6061335

----For you "I support do-gooder laws" type you need to understand why this country was originally founded. It cites the reason in the Declaration of Independence....

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed, by their Creator, with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness."

Sooooooooooooo, how does ME choosing NOT to wear a seatbelt affect YOUR right to "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness"???

[Ryu]

Heres an example
You get in a car accident with someone and had you been wearing your seatbelt you survive but since you werent you die
That would seriously affect the other person having caused someone to die even if it wasnt there fault
Just an example
Also, should police not have to follow the law ever?

[rahmota]

Well I am opposed to nanny laws where the government, corporations, other people think they know better than I do how I can and should live my life.

That being said I do know that wearing my seatbelt generally increases my survival factor in most wrecks. Decreases it in others. Its a gamble but one that can be mitigated by defensive driving techniques.

And no police are not and should not be above the law, (Nor are they the law) but sometimes getting in and out of cruisers and moving they can sometimes forget. I knbow when I worked at the dealership I would sometimes not bother with the belt driving down the street to the gas station if I was going to be in and out of cars.

As for your example:

You get in a car accident with someone and had you been wearing your seatbelt you survive but since you werent you die

Well I think Would be a bit more upset about the death part no matter what the reason seatbelt or not. Especially if it was my own. However accidents happen because of mistakes or circumstances beyond all reasonable control.

Each person is responsible for their own lives. If you are an adult you take the responsibility seriously, good or bad. Its not like you need mommy to hold your hand every day of your life. Someone else is not you. You are not someone else. To think that you can force someone else to live their life to your standards is sheer arrogance. Talking to them, explaining that it migt be a beneficial idea to do that, or advising them is great, wonderful but trying to force someone to take care of themselves is just not right. If they are a reasonably intelligent and responsible person they will know what they need to do with their life and how to take care of themselves. Either through their parents having taught them or the school of hard knocks.

[MadMike]

I think not wearing a seatbelt is just plain stupid. A buddy of mine almost got killed because he chose not to where his, while myself and the rest of the people in the vehicle walked away without a scratch.

However, I don't think the government has the right to tell us not to be stupid, unless that stupidity harms someone else. I'm supposedly an adult, so I should be able to decide for myself whether to put myself at risk or not.

[rahmota]

Madmike: Well yeah I'll agree that in a lot of cases not wearing the seatbelt can be hazardous. But there have been a few cases where people have beenhurt or killed much wrse by wearing their belt. One of my friends would be dead if he hadn't bee going beltless. He missed a curve and went straight down a fence row. A 6' long steel Tpost snapped off and flipped up and speared through the windshield and the back o his seat. Fortunately during the bouncing and spinning he got thrown over into the passenger seat and the spear of dooom missed him.

So the whole goal of driving should be to avoid getting into those situations in the first place through defensive driving and better skills overall in accident avoidence. Thats where the driver ed and public service dollars should be spent. Not like you said trying to protect people from their own stupidity. To do that we'd have to make everythign out of nerf.

[AFPheonix]

My only reason for legislating seat belt laws is that if a person who has no health insurance chooses to not wear one, and then proceeds to get into a nasty accident, he'll have to go to the hospital. Now, he can't afford everything they're going to do to save his life, and the hospital isn't going to turn him away, so who gets to pay for it?

You and me, through higher hospital rates. THAT'S how it affects me.

back on topic, I don't think that cop should have been fired though. told to remember his seat belt? yes, but not fired. Which makes me wonder what else was going on, too.

[rahmota]

AFP: Well I think the health system needs a big overhaul to get things on a more equal footing overall anyhow so that healthcare is truely universal. Because the poor people who have govt assistence do not get the same kind of treatment as the ones who are rich enough to selfpay or have the really good gold card stuff. but thats a topic for another thread.

As for the officer yeah it is kinda curious. Maybe they where looking for an excuse. But he'll do all right the boys in blue take care of each other.

[MadMike]

My only reason for legislating seat belt laws is that if a person who has no health insurance chooses to not wear one, and then proceeds to get into a nasty accident, he'll have to go to the hospital. Now, he can't afford everything they're going to do to save his life, and the hospital isn't going to turn him away, so who gets to pay for it?

You and me, through higher hospital rates. THAT'S how it affects me.

So where do we draw the line? Do we start telling people they're not allowed to do anything remotely dangerous, especially if they don't have insurance? Do we tell them they're not allowed to go skydiving? Rock climbing? Hell, even getting behind the wheel of a car can be dangerous.

Where does it end?

[protege]

However, I don't think the government has the right to tell us not to be stupid, unless that stupidity harms someone else. I'm supposedly an adult, so I should be able to decide for myself whether to put myself at risk or not.

The only problem with that is...the stupid people start suing and blaming *others* for their stupidity. A prime case of this is the idiots who try to steal soda cans from vending machines by tipping them...only to get hurt/killed when the machine falls on them. Last I heard, the family of one of those idiots was suing Coca-Cola because the machine didn't have a warning on it.

There are too many stupid people, simply because companies fear getting sued over their actions. We need to remove the warning labels from everything...and let the problem take care of itself

[MadMike]

The only problem with that is...the stupid people start suing and blaming *others* for their stupidity.

No argument there. Crime may not pay, but stupidity certainly does. I think that if someone gets hurt or killed as a result of something they clearly should not be doing, there should be no recourse. Judges should be allowed to throw out cases on the grounds that the plaintiff is a fucking idiot.

[rahmota]

Exactly, Like I've said each person is responsible for thier own actions, good or bad, right or wrong. To try and blame someone else for your stupidity is just well stupid.


At a couple palces around here they have the pop machine bolted down or within a giant steel cage. Not sure if that is for the tipping thing or because someone has stolen them often enough to require this kind of security.

[AFPheonix]

So where do we draw the line? Do we start telling people they're not allowed to do anything remotely dangerous, especially if they don't have insurance? Do we tell them they're not allowed to go skydiving? Rock climbing? Hell, even getting behind the wheel of a car can be dangerous.

Where does it end?

I suppose I was making more of a jab at the way health care in this country is set up, and it didn't come across well.


Although I do wear my seatbelt all the time.