Harassed by Greenpeace

[mathnerd]

I'm putting this in Fratching because it's likely to get contentious.

So, today I went to my local Barterer John's to pick up a few things. On my way out, I was prevented from exiting by a line of Greenpeace activists holding hands with each other. I must admit I behaved badly, as I made eye contact with one of them, took a step back, aimed my cart directly at her and started running. She let go of the person next to her and I got out to my car, along with a half dozen people behind me.

Now, let me be clear, I hate any sort of groups soliciting for any reason (except maybe Girl Scouts hawking cookies, but even then I'm not really fond of it). But I find Greenpeace in particular to be a vile and offensive organization, and any mention of them is likely to send me into a rage. So, I loaded up my groceries, calmed myself down and called the manager. I was told that corporate had researched it and there was nothing they could do to send them on their way, as since they weren't actually soliciting money, they couldn't kick them off the property. I then asked, "well, what about harassment, loitering or general trespass laws?" He had no answer.

I'm inclined to think that the company just doesn't want to do anything about it, and either actively or passively supports this disgusting and vile group. I've emailed corporate, so let's see what they say, but in the meantime, no more Barterer John's for me!

[Greenday]

More like they didn't want to get bad press for kicking out protesters or sued for violating their first amendment rights.

[mathnerd]

But on a safety issue alone, wouldn't it be worse if the headline read "Dozens of shoppers die after being trapped in the store during a fire", or something like that?

Honestly, there are harassment laws for a reason. I should be able to shop in peace. Who's rights should supersede?

[Greenday]

But on a safety issue alone, wouldn't it be worse if the headline read "Dozens of shoppers die after being trapped in the store during a fire", or something like that?

Honestly, there are harassment laws for a reason. I should be able to shop in peace. Who's rights should supersede?

Sure that'd look bad. But were they actually harassing anyone?

[Andara Bledin]

I'm pretty sure that if they actually kept you from departing the store, you could totally call the cops on them for whatever that law is about being unlawfully detained.

Also, if they're blocking access into or out of the store, that is a safety issue, and it's legally incumbent upon the store to keep those accesses clear of all obstruction, including protesters.

[mathnerd]

Sure that'd look bad. But were they actually harassing anyone?

I'd certainly say that keeping me from leaving the store while shouting at me and the rest of the customers (what they were shouting, I have no idea), most definitely counts as harassment.

[Ginger Tea]

Just remind them they could have learned how to use Photoshop instead of fucking up the Nazca Lines.

Had I wanted to enter the establishment I would shrug it off and go another day, leaving and being detained, I probably would have gone "Ramming speed Smee!" too.

[HYHYBT]

If there were a fire, they'd probably move. But still...

If you could get in and out, they might well not have been breaking any laws, though that organization's not exactly known for being sticklers about obeying them. They're not trespassing if they're on public land or if they haven't been asked to leave.... and the sidewalk or parking lot may well not be under the control of the same people as the store.

[mathnerd]

The only way to have gotten out without plowing through them would have been to walk to along the sidewalk (probably about 1000-1500 feet in either direction) and used the public street to get around the end of the line, then back into the parking lot. I was alone, but if I'd had my disabled, wheelchair using son with me, that would have been impossible, because of the lack of wheelchair ramps going those routes, not to mention the added distance would have made it a challenge for any mobility impaired customer.

As for the store itself, I'm angry at them not because the organization was there. This particular group, as noted, doesn't exactly put much effort into obeying the law. I'm angry because of what I perceived as a complete lack of response by the management. It felt like I was being blown off. It didn't feel like the guy was weary from having to field dozens of complaint calls about them. I could have handled that. I'm just so anti-Greenpeace that if I even think that this store might actively or passively support them, then I won't spend a single cent there.

So, we'll see what corporate has to say. I'm not quite half way between two stores. This one is 5ish or so minutes from my house and there's another one 10ish or so minutes in a different direction. If I get an acceptable response from corporate, then I'll just go to a different location. If not, well, then I'll miss my Maple and Brown Sugar shredded wheat, but that's the only thing I get there that I can't find a suitable alternative somewhere else.

Edited because 5ish and fish aren't the same thing.

[Gravekeeper]

Greenpeace is barely a step up from PETA these days. What the fark are they even protesting outside a store?

[EricKei]

Doesn't the right to freedom of Assembly/Speech only apply to government/public property? A store and its parking lot are, by definition, private property, so their even being present to hold a protest without written permission from the landlord is probably illegal. They were also interfering with conduct of business (misdemeanor -- a form of Disrupting the Peace), and possibly also a fire hazard, if their presence prevented people from easily and quickly leaving the premises -- correct?

[Gravekeeper]

Doesn't the right to freedom of Assembly/Speech only apply to government/public property?

Correct. Which is why this manager sucks.

[mathnerd]

I would have thought so, EricKei. I'm actually more upset about the management's lack of response than the fact that they were there at all. Greenpeace doesn't actually care about obeying the law, and I could have been totally forgiving of the store management if it seemed to me like he was trying to do something about them, even if he wasn't actually successful at getting rid of them.

[mathnerd]

Also, the laws the management quoted were the solicitation laws. Technically, he was right. The solicitation laws in my state don't apply to any group not actually asking for money. The excuse though, is weak, due to everything else pointed out. This is private property, and harassment, loitering and safety/fire code laws could have been invoked as well.

[Rageaholic]

Doesn't the right to freedom of Assembly/Speech only apply to government/public property? A store and its parking lot are, by definition, private property, so their even being present to hold a protest without written permission from the landlord is probably illegal. They were also interfering with conduct of business (misdemeanor -- a form of Disrupting the Peace), and possibly also a fire hazard, if their presence prevented people from easily and quickly leaving the premises -- correct?

Yeah, if mall security can kick people out for taking pictures, a grocery store should be able to kick protesters out for any reason (especially if they are in peoples way). It's also disrupting their business by alienating current and potential customers.